# Wikileaks releasing thousands of diplomatic cables. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 27, 2010, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041 "2010-11-27T02:58:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/41 "2010-11-28T03:37:15Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I corrected the typo in the previous two posts. Thanks. Of course you also made a typo, albeit a less consequential one. > [@](#): > > Wikiiedia cofounder addresses Wikileaks: ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/42 "2010-11-28T05:03:00Z")
> [@godix](#): > > Based on wikileaks past performance, I doubt much will come of this. As before, it’ll probably be a bunch of fairly low level stuff that has little if any surprises in it. Most likely the biggest secret that gets exposed is that the ambassador to XYZ once said something less than flattering about XYZ. It’s hard for me to call revealing that sort of crap to be heroic, but it’s also hard to call it villainous. It’s just a kinda dick move of little concern to anyone not directly involved. Assange wants to be the NYT releasing the Pentagon Papers, but so far he’s hasn’t even managed to be as influential and relevant as the National Enquirer reporting on a politicians affair. According to the [Pentagon](http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130600687), no U.S. military or intelligence operations were compromised by the previous dump, although some Afghans cooperating with the US who were named in the documents have been threatened by the Taliban. ---
**Author:** ![ushimitsudoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e9a140/32.png) [@ushimitsudoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ushimitsudoki)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/43 "2010-11-28T08:17:20Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > Wikiiedia cofounder addresses Wikileaks: > > [http://twitter.com/lsanger/status/8617774721015808](http://twitter.com/lsanger/status/8617774721015808) > [http://twitter.com/lsanger/status/8618100681347072](http://twitter.com/lsanger/status/8618100681347072) Since the reference to him seems a bit of an appeal to authority (and since Mr. Sanger himself appeals as the “co-founder” of Wikipedia), I find myself compelled to note that [Mr. Sanger also accused Wikipedia and Wikimedia of distributing “child pornography”](http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100428/1153439220.shtml) - of course, these accusations had nothing to do with the fact Mr. Sanger set up a competing online encyclopedia, Citizendium, after being ousted from Wikipedia. Basically, I would take anything Mr. Sanger has to say with an extremely large swig from the mug of STFU coffee. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/44 "2010-11-28T09:09:25Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > According to the [Pentagon](http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130600687), no U.S. military or intelligence operations were compromised by the previous dump, although some Afghans cooperating with the US who were named in the documents have been threatened by the Taliban. Rrrright.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/45 "2010-11-28T11:24:58Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Rrrright.:rolleyes: Well, whatever the real number, it’s certainly lower than the number of Americans Bush got killed with his Iraq conquest. :dubious:\* Perhaps the current leak will encourage future presidents to curb their baser urges. * * * \*smiley, [IOW](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6f/Your_argument_is_invalid.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Henrichek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/5daacb/32.png) [@Henrichek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Henrichek)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/46 "2010-11-28T13:35:55Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > It’s not legal. Julian Assange, the guy who runs wikileaks, is on the run. > > Doesn’t this seem at all one-sided to anyone? Wikileaks used to be about transparency anywhere. Now it seems to be on a mission to attack the American government or something. Or it’s just trying to shut down U.S. military in Iraq and Afghanistan. Why isn’t it leaking diplomatic cables from Russia? Or China? or Japan? Or any number of other countries which must certainly have whistleblowers. Seems like they are planning to release Russian and Chinese stuff soon as well: [http://en.rian.ru/russia/20101026/161087816.html](http://en.rian.ru/russia/20101026/161087816.html) ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/47 "2010-11-28T14:56:05Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > If that is his proven motive, fine. Does this constitute as treason though? When did proof become the standard for reporting the possible motives for alleged criminals? It’s much closer to treason than what Libby or the sock stuffer did. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/48 "2010-11-28T15:36:16Z")
I think too much attention is paid to the role of Wikileaks and too little to security procedures within the Defense Department. Is it really possible for a very junior analyst to simply download hundreds of thousands of classified documents? Even if wikileaks weren’t around it would have been quite easy for him to send the files directly to a bunch of new organizations. And if security procedures are so lax wouldn’t it be trivial for any decent intelligence agency to get their hands on these files anyway? For all we know, Russian and Chinese intelligence has access to all this material and more anyway. Pentagon claims that these releases seriously damage US national security are belied by how little care they took to protect these files. Either that or the Penton is shocking,criminally negligent and it’s the person who desgined these security procedures who needs to be punished. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/49 "2010-11-28T15:43:11Z")
[Owni.fr](http://Owni.fr) Claims Wikileaks Leaks revealed in Basel > **[StateLogs: Wikileaks begins to reveal 250,000 diplomatic files](http://owni.fr/2010/11/27/wikileaks-statelogs-diplomatic-assange-application-insurance/)** > > Wikileaks might be on the verge of releasing new information on a scale larger than before. We will provide the tools and context to explore the new logs. > [@](#): > > All times given are CET (Paris), or GMT+1 > \<3:17 p.m.\> Leaks revealed in Basel > > Copies of tomorrow’s Der Spiegel have been sold in Basel, Switzerland > Contents are being exposed on Twitter by Symor Jenkins. > Among what can be read in Der Spiegel: > > - “Obama prefers to look East than West.” > > - “Obama has no emotion towards Europe.” > > - “The US sees the world as a confrontation between 2 superpowers. The EU plays a secondary role.” > > - “Europe is not so important for the US.” > > - From the cover, we read that Ahmadinejad “is Hitler”, Sarkozy is “an emperor without clothes”, Karzai is “driven by paranoia”. > > - From the inside articles, scanned by Symor Jenkins , we learn that the US have a snitch inside the German government, a member of the liberal FDP party. German chancellor Angela Merkel is described as barely creative and risk-averse. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/50 "2010-11-28T15:45:06Z")
> [@ushimitsudoki](#): > > Since the reference to him seems a bit of an appeal to authority (and since Mr. Sanger himself appeals as the “co-founder” of Wikipedia), I find myself compelled to note that [Mr. Sanger also accused Wikipedia and Wikimedia of distributing “child pornography”](http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20100428/1153439220.shtml) - of course, these accusations had nothing to do with the fact Mr. Sanger set up a competing online encyclopedia, Citizendium, after being ousted from Wikipedia. > > Basically, I would take anything Mr. Sanger has to say with an extremely large swig from the mug of STFU coffee. Not an appeal to authority. Just something I found interesting. Especially considering the fact that some have claimed that Wikipedia is some sort of left leaning anti-American organization. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/51 "2010-11-28T16:01:44Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > I think too much attention is paid to the role of Wikileaks and too little to security procedures within the Defense Department. Is it really possible for a very junior analyst to simply download hundreds of thousands of classified documents? Even if wikileaks weren’t around it would have been quite easy for him to send the files directly to a bunch of new organizations. And if security procedures are so lax wouldn’t it be trivial for any decent intelligence agency to get their hands on these files anyway? For all we know, Russian and Chinese intelligence has access to all this material and more anyway. Pentagon claims that these releases seriously damage US national security are belied by how little care they took to protect these files. Either that or the Penton is shocking,criminally negligent and it’s the person who desgined these security procedures who needs to be punished. I think you’d be surprised at how many people have clearances for various things in Washington DC. 20+ years ago my first job was as a USAID contractor and I had to get a clearance. Took a while but once it was done I had access to documents crossing my desk every day that were either ‘Confidential’ or ‘Secret’ classified. Had I felt a need to I certainly could have leaked them. And that was before email…most of the documents were hardcopy. I can only imagine what it would be like today. ---
**Author:** ![godix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/278dde/32.png) [@godix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/godix)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/52 "2010-11-28T20:03:18Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > [Owni.fr](http://Owni.fr) Claims Wikileaks Leaks revealed in Basel > > [StateLogs: Wikileaks begins to reveal 250,000 diplomatic files » OWNI, News, Augmented](http://owni.fr/2010/11/27/wikileaks-statelogs-diplomatic-assange-application-insurance) Exactly the sort of thing I expected. None of those headlines are at all surprising. - “Obama prefers to look East than West.” Of course Obama looks east. So did Bush. And Clinton. It’s not like China just suddenly popped up on the radar when Obama took the oath of office. The US has focused on the east since, at bare minimum, the 90’s when we first setup favored trade status with China. - “Obama has no emotion towards Europe.” - “The US sees the world as a confrontation between 2 superpowers. The EU plays a secondary role.” - “Europe is not so important for the US.” Didn’t Bush pretty much prove how little the US paid attention to Europe? Europe hasn’t been a focus since the Soviet Union fell. What’s more, Europe should be happy for that. It’s a sign that the US doesn’t think Europe is a shithole anymore. US attention is focused on areas that pose problems for us, like NK or Iran or Iraq and Afghanistan. Europe is no longer a cold war battleground, so we’ve moved on. They’re big boys now. They don’t need the US to hold their hands. We no longer feel the need to play daddy to the entire continent. It’s a good thing. It’s a sign of equality and trust they can take care of themselves. - From the cover, we read that Ahmadinejad “is Hitler”, Sarkozy is “an emperor without clothes”, Karzai is “driven by paranoia”. Was there anyone who thought the US was pro-Ahmadinejad? Did someone think the US respects France after the whole Freedom Fries thing? Is anyone shocked that the US has issues with Afghanistan politics? - From the inside articles, scanned by Symor Jenkins , we learn that the US have a snitch inside the German government, a member of the liberal FDP party. The US has spies in friendly nations? I’m shocked! Shocked I say! Why this is outrageous, there has never been a case of allies spying on each other! In other words, if those headlines are the worst and most shocking revelations, this all amounts to nothing. Some specific people might get their nose bent out of shape, Merkel can’t be happy for example, but there isn’t anything new here. A thinking person already knew this stuff years ago. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/53 "2010-11-28T20:06:24Z")
I hope that you’re right and that this does all amount to nothing. The documents have now apparently been released, so we shall see. > **[Wikileaks has released the documents](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=587188)** > > The Guardian has an interactive browsable database. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/interactive/2010/nov/28/us-embassy-cables-wikileaks ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/54 "2010-11-28T20:48:45Z")
[Wikileaks under “mass distributed denial of service attack.”](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11858637) ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2010, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/55 "2010-11-28T23:46:51Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [Wikileaks under “mass distributed denial of service attack.”](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11858637) It seems to be working fine at the moment. > **[WikiLeaks](https://wikileaks.org/)** ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2010, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/56 "2010-11-29T05:21:12Z")
I’m pretty much of a mind with the OP. Although I’m all for transparency, I also think diplomatic cables should enjoy some degree of confidentiality. Seems odd some of this stuff would have actually been written down, though. And I’m also curious about a security situation that allows so much of this stuff to get out anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2010, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/57 "2010-11-29T05:58:16Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > I think you’d be surprised at how many people have clearances for various things in Washington DC. 20+ years ago my first job was as a USAID contractor and I had to get a clearance. Took a while but once it was done I had access to documents crossing my desk every day that were either ‘Confidential’ or ‘Secret’ classified. Had I felt a need to I certainly could have leaked them. And that was before email…most of the documents were hardcopy. I can only imagine what it would be like today. A very good [post](http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2010/11/29/the-wikileaks-dump-more-secrecyfewer-secrets/)on Time’s blog which gives the details and background on this phenomenon. The bottom line: too many people have the power to classify, too many documents get classified and too many people have security clearance. ---
**Author:** ![Khaki\_Campbell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9de053/32.png) [@Khaki\_Campbell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khaki_Campbell)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2010, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/58 "2010-11-29T07:54:05Z")
> [@godix](#): > > Europe is no longer a cold war battleground, so we’ve moved on. **They’re big boys now**. Muhahahaha. This is ridiculous. We have _millenia_ of civilization and culture behind us. _You_ are the big (stunted) boys with their M16 and planes which (unfortunately) are real. ---
**Author:** ![godix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/278dde/32.png) [@godix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/godix)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2010, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/59 "2010-11-29T08:50:42Z")
> [@Khaki\_Campbell](#): > > Muhahahaha. This is ridiculous. We have _millenia_ of civilization and culture behind us. > > _You_ are the big (stunted) boys with their M16 and planes which (unfortunately) are real. How many world wars did the US start? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2010, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041/60 "2010-11-29T09:30:03Z")
> [@Khaki\_Campbell](#): > > Muhahahaha. This is ridiculous. We have _millenia_ of civilization and culture behind us. > > _You_ are the big (stunted) boys with their M16 and planes which (unfortunately) are real. Your knowledge of American idiom is as lacking as your knowledge of European history. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikileaks-releasing-thousands-of-diplomatic-cables/562041.md?page=2)