# Wikipedians are the reason Wikipedia is dying **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 23, 2016, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921 "2016-02-23T23:02:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Cardboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/49beb7/32.png) [@Cardboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardboard)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2016, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/81 "2016-02-27T17:09:32Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > I was a very prolific Wikipedia administrator, until I was driven off. And I’ve never looked back. The admins are another reason why Wikipedia sucks. Too many with blatantly obvious biases, too many that get away with overstepping their bounds without having to explain themselves, too many that get away with making unilateral decisions without following the guidelines that they so quickly invoke to a “t” when it conveniences them. Self-proclaimed intellectuals. They’re just such cocks 95% of the time, man. ADD: The admins are like the Supreme Court of Wikipedia. Who checks them? They become a cabal once they get into power. ---
**Author:** ![Pinmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@Pinmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pinmin)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2016, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/82 "2016-02-28T00:34:31Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Pretty much. I’m not sure plausibility should even be an issue with Wikipedia. If I were looking up any of those subjects, I’d want to know _Who believes in them? Are they part of some particular organized sect or belief system? Where, when, and with whom did this belief originate (if known)? Where and when do/did the people who hold these beliefs primarily live?_ That’s all pretty much factual information that I’d want a reference work like Wikipedia to provide. > > That question might well have a good answer, but I don’t think it belongs in this thread (nor does a discussion of whether God actually exists or any other Great Debate). For the record, I had in mind people who are “reasonably well-informed” _in general_. If lots of people believe something but all of those people are under the age of three, for example, I don’t think I’d consider it a live option. Agreed, but tangential to my main point, which is that it isn’t Wikipedia’s business to assign truth values to disputed questions. I think you left off the most important question, that of why they hold a particular belief. I mean that why in a formal, academic manner such as Christian apologetics (see here [http://www.reasonablefaith.org](http://www.reasonablefaith.org) for example). Many have a faulty assumption that since they believe something isn’t true, no one can have a good reason for holding that belief. In a greater philosophical context, this is a foundation of science. Why do you believe atoms exist? Or a Higgs boson? The answer can’t just be “because it’s true”; why do you think it’s true? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2016, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/83 "2016-02-28T15:06:28Z")
> [@Green\_Bean](#): > > I’d like even more flag information, pictures, and articles, and stuff will always need to be updated Sheldon? Is that you? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2016, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/84 "2016-02-28T15:18:48Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > If a “bias” towards facts ticks off paranormalists, antivaxers, chemtrail adherents etc. and they go somewhere other than Wikipedia for their dose of unreality - well, too bad. > [@Cugel](#): > > Such as [Conservapedia](http://www.conservapedia.com/Main_Page), where it just turns into a stream of modern day Geocitiesesque nutbaggery I love [what Jimmy Wales had to say](http://arstechnica.com/science/2014/03/wikipedia-founder-calls-alt-medicine-practitioners-lunatic-charlatans/) when alties signed a [change.org](http://change.org) petition to get more respectful treatment of their views. \*"No, you have to be kidding me. Every single person who signed this petition needs to go back to check their premises and think harder about what it means to be honest, factual, truthful. ``` Wikipedia's policies around this kind of thing are exactly spot-on and correct. If you can get your work published in respectable scientific journals—that is to say, if you can produce evidence through replicable scientific experiments, then Wikipedia will cover it appropriately. What we won't do is pretend that the work of lunatic charlatans is the equivalent of "true scientific discourse." It isn't."* ``` There are a bazillion loon sites spreading the glop that Wikipedia won’t present as fact. Alties have tried creating their own wikis, as [hilarity ensued](http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2009/07/21/the-health-ranger-mike-adams-needs-your/). ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2016, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/85 "2016-02-29T16:51:35Z")
I quit editing because of this. I would update an article with new research, and it would be deleted. You can list as many studies as citations as you want, some people will delete it. Eventually I quit trying, not worth it. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2016, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/86 "2016-02-29T19:12:50Z")
There is an infinite amount of information in the world. No matter how big Wikipedia gets, there’s still an infinite amount of things to add to it. It isn’t like an article on the tree in my back yard is going to make it harder for people to research the Bosnian Crisis. Nothing should be deleted from Wikipedia, ever, unless it is wrong. The idea most editors share, that there could somehow be _too much_ information on Wikipedia, just blows my mind, and it’s why I will never post a single thing there. This isn’t the 1983 World Book Encyclopedia. And as long as people in power over at Wikipedia keep thinking it is, I refuse to help them even a little, let alone donate to the cause. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/87 "2016-03-01T03:54:17Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Sheldon? Is that you? :: sigh :: Yes. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/88 "2016-03-01T04:10:38Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Nothing should be deleted from Wikipedia, ever, unless it is wrong. The idea most editors share, that there could somehow be _too much_ information on Wikipedia, just blows my mind There’s no limit to the amount of data that Wikipedia’s servers can hold? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/89 "2016-03-01T06:02:40Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Nothing should be deleted from Wikipedia, ever, unless it is wrong. The idea most editors share, that there could somehow be _too much_ information on Wikipedia, just blows my mind, and it’s why I will never post a single thing there. This isn’t the 1983 World Book Encyclopedia. And as long as people in power over at Wikipedia keep thinking it is, I refuse to help them even a little, let alone donate to the cause. So you and I should have articles about ourselves? And every one of the billions of people in the world should have articles? ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/90 "2016-03-01T07:13:39Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > So you and I should have articles about ourselves? And every one of the billions of people in the world should have articles? Why not? It may be of no use to you now, but our grandkids will find great value in it. A $100 hard drive could probably hold a detailed essay about everyone on Earth. There is no downside. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/91 "2016-03-01T07:16:11Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > There’s no limit to the amount of data that Wikipedia’s servers can hold? Essentially, no. Storage is cheap, they can buy more. “The hard drives are full” is NOT the reason editors are delete-happy, FYI everyone. ---
**Author:** ![Cugel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cugel/32/1199_2.png) [@Cugel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cugel)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/92 "2016-03-01T08:18:16Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > So you and I should have articles about ourselves? And every one of the billions of people in the world should have articles? Not quite… say you note a cited statistical curiosity within an article about a sports league. These additions can and are deleted because reasons. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/93 "2016-03-01T13:31:11Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > So you and I should have articles about ourselves? And every one of the billions of people in the world should have articles? > [@DrCube](#): > > Why not? It may be of no use to you now, but our grandkids will find great value in it. A $100 hard drive could probably hold a detailed essay about everyone on Earth. There is no downside. The idea of a detailed \*voluntary \*biographical database on everybody is nice. And useful to future generations. But that’s a special purpose database. The \*www \*ought to contain such a thing. Whether \*Wikipedia \*is the best repository for it is very different matter. Even in the heyday of dead tree knowledge, different specialized publications served different purposes. There were specialized publications that were exhaustive encyclopedias of every genus & species of tree. Meanwhile general encyclopedias had articles on a few of the major types and on trees in general. When I go to Wikipedia, I’m looking for general knowledge of headline topics, not treatment of every factoid humanity has ever uncovered. If I search for [Bill Clinton] I’m probably looking for the former president, not my neighbor. The utility of being able to find the noteworthy Bill Clintons (Bills Clinton? :)) easily has value. Outnumbering those articles 10 or 20 \*thousand \*to one with articles about ordinary schlubs (many long dead[sup]1[/sup]) is not smart. IMO wiki’s noteworthiness standards are pretty much spot-on. The social aspects of their editor corps has a lot to answer for. The goals & structure are fine. ========= 1. See [Facebook of the Dead](https://what-if.xkcd.com/69/) for issues with perpetual storage of data about humans. Note that his info is now 3 years old. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/94 "2016-03-01T14:15:20Z")
> [@Cardboard](#): > > It should be noted, perhaps not surprisingly, that participation on the non-English Wikipedias (Spanish, for example) has increased in recent years. Among other things because when you go to search for something and find a google translation, if you have the time you WILL use the Grammarhammer. Oh wait. I should have used “I”… Quote my brother with the real bad English: “it’s a sad state of affairs when I understand a wikipedia article better in English than in Spanish”. ---
**Author:** ![Cardboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/49beb7/32.png) [@Cardboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardboard)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/95 "2016-03-01T16:47:34Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Why not? It may be of no use to you now, but our grandkids will find great value in it. A $100 hard drive could probably hold a detailed essay about everyone on Earth. There is no downside. In this case, maintenance and upkeep IS the downside and keeps that idea from being feasible. There just aren’t enough people out there who would be able to update pages of living people. Now, if we just focused on dead people, that would be easier, since once someone’s dead there is much to add. ---
**Author:** ![Cardboard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/49beb7/32.png) [@Cardboard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardboard)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/96 "2016-03-01T16:49:25Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Essentially, no. Storage is cheap, they can buy more. “The hard drives are full”\*\* is NOT the reason editors are delete-happy\*\*, FYI everyone. Outside of what I’ve mentioned already, another reason I think Wikipedia editors are so quick to delete things is because each of them thinks the future and maintenance of upkeep of Wikipedia rests on their shoulders and theirs alone. So “we can’t possibly keep this page, I’ll have no time to update it!” ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/97 "2016-03-02T01:50:12Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Among other things because when you go to search for something and find a google translation, if you have the time you WILL use the Grammarhammer. … Grammarhammer ? ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4bbf92/32.png) [@Charlie\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/98 "2016-03-02T13:56:16Z")
I think Wikipedia is one of the best ideas since the advent of PCs. I know it has problems but I think it’s worth making the effort to save it. I’ve never before heard anyone say that it’s dying and I sure do hope it does not die but instead, I hope we find a way to keep it up and running. It would probably take a very long essay to explain just why I think Wikipedia is so wonderful and so important. Unfortunately, that is the kind of post that most people would complain is too long and they would not read. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/99 "2016-03-02T14:09:43Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Grammarhammer ? It’s shaped like a computer keyboard and you can use it to hammer, kick, punt and otherwise place into orbit multiple grammatical mistakes. The only time I’ve made a factual correction it was on the Sagrada Familia getting called a “cathedral” in Freddie Mercury’s article; everything else has been to correct grammar. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2016, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921/100 "2016-03-02T15:43:01Z")
> [@Green\_Bean](#): > > This is seriously bugging me. How do we not have a gamelan ensemble? Nebraska has one. Maine has one. WYOMING has one, and it’s the least populous state! Vermont, which is barely any bigger, has THREE!!! > > Every nearby state has at least one. New York, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Connecticut, Maryland. There are only two states on the eastern seaboard that don’t have a gamelan ensemble, us and South Carolina - and that’s just about the only thing we have in common with South Carolina. (I hear it’s an awfully nice place to visit though…unless you’re looking for some hot gamelan action.) See, I’m in South Carolina, and I was reading through the rest of this thread waiting to post the exact same thing, except, you know, only from the other side. WTF why are we odd man out? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wikipedians-are-the-reason-wikipedia-is-dying/746921.md?page=6)