# Wildfires on Maui \[2023-08-10\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** breaking-news\ **Created:** [August 10, 2023, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362 "2023-08-10T13:36:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2023, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/41 "2023-08-11T13:26:31Z")
This NPR article shows the banyan tree still standing while surrounded by fire destroyed buildings. They say it is scorched. Hopefully it will continue to live. [Scorched by Maui wildfire, historic Lahaina banyan tree appears still standing](https://www.npr.org/2023/08/11/1193204078/maui-fire-historic-lahaina-banyan-tree-appears-still-standing) [![](https://i.imgur.com/3wkUaBt.jpg) ](https://i.imgur.com/3wkUaBt.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2023, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/42 "2023-08-11T13:35:16Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > ??? > I thought you did it under the same name. If you had a sock, you just outed yourself, it wasn’t me. Okay, when you started posting again the content was [so](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resources-for-learning-mandarin/824799/26) [distinctive](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/people-of-color-do-you-ever-guess-at-others-ethnicity/981264/25) I recognized it as being the same person but didn’t even notice that you were doing under a different name from before. ---
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2023, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/43 "2023-08-11T13:42:40Z")
Death toll now reported to be 55, with fears that it could increase significantly. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2023, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/44 "2023-08-11T14:20:50Z")
I know there are many reasons something like this can happen. As someone posted above, downed power lines throwing sparks is one possibility. But somewhere in the back of my mind is always the sneaking suspicion that it was some idiot carelessly throwing a cigarette butt out of the car window. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2023, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/45 "2023-08-11T14:24:25Z")
Steve here. Wife and I live on Oahu, on vacation now. We have a number of family and friends on Maui. Most near the Kahului airport away from the fire. They all checked in on the facebook group page. There maybe some friends of friends in the area. The hurricane was some 500 miles south. A large high pressure area is north. Maui was in the wind tunnel driven by the two systems. Picture a counter clockwise flow from the hurricane and a giant clockwise flow from the high meeting like two grinding wheels over Maui. One thing to be investigated in the aftermath is a failure of the all-disaster siren warning system. Most often heard as a tsunami alert but also for any other emergency. Power and communication failures driven by wind damage even before the firestorm is a possible cause. Cellular and other wireless services (911, …) failed early. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/46 "2023-08-12T15:36:13Z")
> [@eschrodinger](#): > > Power out. Cell phone towers out. 911 service out. I’m sure they were broadcasting information, but people would need battery powered radios, or to be sitting in theirs cars to get the news, I presume. > > How would your city, county, or state get word to you in those circumstances? They’re not focusing on this in the news but they said they didn’t get the traditional alerts in a timely manner but people got alerts on their phones. So that means the phone towers were in place. ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/47 "2023-08-12T22:58:23Z")
Many fatalities–this is from WaPo today: ### The deadliest U.S. wildfires Deaths in each fire A bar chart showing the 10 deadliest wildfires in U.S. history. The 2023 Lahaina fire is the seventh-deadliest, with 55 dead as of August 11. The top 5 deadliest fires are all from 1910 or earlier. 02004006008001,000 Peshtigo, 1871 1,152 Cloquet, 1918 453 Hinckley, 1894 418 Thumb, 1881 282 Great Fire, 1910 87 Camp, 2018 85 **Lahaina, 2023** 80 Yacolt, 1902 38 Griffith Park, 1933 29 Oakland Hills, 1991 25 ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/48 "2023-08-13T00:12:09Z")
**Firestorm At Peshtigo** by Denise Gess and William Lutz is an [excellent book](https://www.amazon.com/Firestorm-Peshtigo-Deadliest-American-History/dp/0805072934) about that horrifying fire. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/49 "2023-08-13T00:14:13Z")
A potential (non life threatening) danger I recently saw pointed out: is there any way to prevent some billionaire from swooping in, buying all the land on the cheap, and turning Lahaina into a private playground estate or charging massive rents or whatever? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/50 "2023-08-13T04:28:08Z")
People not selling? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/51 "2023-08-13T04:34:13Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > A potential (non life threatening) danger I recently saw pointed out: is there any way to prevent some billionaire from swooping in, buying all the land on the cheap, and turning Lahaina into a private playground estate or charging massive rents or whatever? Well there was already a billionaire (who bought up a 1000 acres of land) handing out blankets and other essentials to the survivors. So, no. But there’s also nothing stopping a billionaire from handing out free cars. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/52 "2023-08-13T04:35:29Z")
> [@Tride](#): > > bar chart showing the 10 deadliest wildfires in U.S. history. The 2023 Lahaina fire is the seventh-deadliest, with 55 dead as of August 11. It’s moved up to 5th and largest in the last 100 years: > **[Death toll from Maui wildfire reaches 89, making it the deadliest in the US...](https://apnews.com/article/maui-hawaii-fires-lahaina-destruction-evacuation-38ec0d6a5c610035a0a72b804fcdffe0)** > > Authorities in Hawaii say a fire that swept through a picturesque town in Maui this week has killed at least 89 people, making it the deadliest U.S. wildfire of the past century. Maui has very expensive housing with a median home sales price of $1.2 million and an average sales price of $1.7 million: > **[Maui Real Estate Report | Locations](https://www.locationshawaii.com/learn/market-reports/maui-real-estate-report/)** > > Locations Maui real estate report offers market statistics on median & average sale price, number of homes sold, and median days on the market. ---
**Author:** ![Digger11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@Digger11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Digger11)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/53 "2023-08-13T04:58:09Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > I also heard that Lahaina and environs are technically a desert, because they get about 15 inches of precipitation on average in a year. The rain forest on the other side of the island would stop it, I hope. Typically, a desert receives less than 10 inches of rain a year, whereas a semi-desert receives 10-20 inches. Some people use the terms arid and semi-arid instead. > **[Arid and Semi-arid Region Landforms - Geology (U.S. National Park Service)](https://www.nps.gov/subjects/geology/arid-landforms.htm)** ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/54 "2023-08-13T05:01:17Z")
> [@Digger11](#): > > Some people use the terms arid and semi-arid instead. Lahaina is basically a slightly drier Los Angeles. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/55 "2023-08-13T17:10:26Z")
But there’s no Owens Valley to steal water from. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/56 "2023-08-13T18:14:15Z")
Boy, the officials’ actions seem awfully poor. Will be interesting to eventually hear who decided it was unnecessary to sound the sirens. ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/57 "2023-08-13T18:26:16Z")
> [@Section\_Maker\_Jupe](#): > > High winds will send large embers far ahead of the main front, and soon everything that can burn will. Building codes in California are constantly being updated after each fire. Embers blowing into attic vents or eaves is a current problem being addressed here. (edit: I had to man the hoses here, watching for those very embers) > Really sorry to see this happen to Hawaii. I’m familiar. We endured smoke from a wind fueled fire that was able to jump the Columbia river because of the wind-driven embers. > [@Magiver](#): > > They’re not focusing on this in the news but they said they didn’t get the traditional alerts in a timely manner but people got alerts on their phones. So that means the phone towers were in place. Some people in some places got alerts at some time. There were some initial small fires that were extinguished in the morning. People in Lahaina got alerts about those on cell phones. The big fires started later in the afternoon. By then everything was down. Police were driving around trying to alert people. Here’s an excellent timeline with photos and video. It’s a gift link, so no paywall. > **[How the Maui wildfires devastated Lahaina, hour by hour](https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/08/13/maui-wildfire-started-spread/?pwapi_token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJyZWFzb24iOiJnaWZ0IiwibmJmIjoxNjkxODk5MjAwLCJpc3MiOiJzdWJzY3JpcHRpb25zIiwiZXhwIjoxNjkzMjgxNTk5LCJpYXQiOjE2OTE4OTkyMDAsImp0aSI6IjdiYjE4OWUzLWQwNTMtNDRmZC1iMjNlLTM4NTJlZTZmMzk2ZCIsInVybCI6Imh0dHBzOi8vd3d3Lndhc2hpbmd0b25wb3N0LmNvbS9jbGltYXRlLWVudmlyb25tZW50LzIwMjMvMDgvMTMvbWF1aS13aWxkZmlyZS1zdGFydGVkLXNwcmVhZC8ifQ.H6jZhDEkvAMlMIMTwepG2ufYH6SKtDMi-Kk-G-VopXw&itid=gfta)** > > Survivors of the Maui fire in Lahaina say they were overwhelmed by the speed of the blaze, the smothering smoke and the lack of escape routes. There’s no question to me after seeing that that it started from downed power lines. They’re everywhere in the videos. Really terrifying narratives. I’m so sad for this place where I just was a few weeks ago. I felt such a connection to it, I knew I wanted to keep coming back. And I can’t help but picture if this had happened while I was there, with my spouse and two ten-year-olds. It makes my blood run cold. I also read yesterday that more than 1,000 people are missing. So this fire is likely going to keep moving up the list of deadliest. ---
**Author:** ![keeganst94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a6a055/32.png) [@keeganst94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/keeganst94)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/58 "2023-08-13T22:23:19Z")
Strange that Cloquet and Hinckley, only 50 miles away from each other, had such devastating fires so close together. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/59 "2023-08-13T22:55:11Z")
> [@eschrodinger](#): > > > [@Magiver](#): > > > > They’re not focusing on this in the news but they said they didn’t get the traditional alerts in a timely manner but people got alerts on their phones. So that means the phone towers were in place. > > Some people in some places got alerts at some time. There were some initial small fires that were extinguished in the morning. People in Lahaina got alerts about those on cell phones. According to press reports, the head of Hawaii Emergency Management indicated _none_ of the conventional emergency warning sirens in Maui (which would just be a signal to people to tune in on the radio or their mobiles to find out what’s the problem and what to do) sounded at any point. ---
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2023, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362/60 "2023-08-13T23:02:47Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > there’s no Owens Valley to steal water from. None needed, when parts of your island receive more than 20 ft of rain per year. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wildfires-on-maui-2023-08-10/988362.md?page=4)