I think that some people feel like they have a buffer against a fascist or authoritarian leader, or even that they may benefit from what happens. They are probably white, and not in a very diverse area. Maybe they own a gun, maybe they just want to see shit burn, and think they are far from the flames.
It’s strange but we have yet to see if a lot of people who said Obama was a fascist would be more tolerant of an actuial right wing, white fascism.
So you’re alright with this propaganda that Trump himself and his underlings are trying to pass off as truth? Do you seriously believe any of it?
Who can vote and under what circumstances has varied over the years and varies by state. Calling it the end of democracy or free and fair elections is being overly dramatic. Elections are about persuasion. You persuade the voters that exist, not the voters you wish existed. That being said, there is always some manipulation of the system by whoever is in power, whether it be voting restrictions or gerrymandering, or social programs that buy voter loyalty to a particular party, or regulations that empower a certain bloc(as the Wagner Act did for unions). There are many types of legal manipulation that have a larger effect than voter ID laws. While many of them are quite shady and have subverted our democracy, in the end the people do still make their choice. And both parties win frequently regardless of their machinations.
Could you be a bit more specific than “this porpaganda”? There’s been a lot of propaganda, from both sides, and most of it was false. Every now and then, both sides stumbled across and argument that had a ring of truth to it.
It depends – if the Democratic party runs a campaign like it has in past election cycles, one with a message that is aimed primarily toward minorities, women, gays, and other typically left wing constituencies and avoid going out into the suburbs and countryside, then yes, they could lose again. They probably WILL lose again. The democratic party needs to stand against discrimination and for civil liberties. But they also need to start talking to blue collar white guys, veterans, people who watch NASCAR, and the rest of the democratic party would do well to do whatever finger wagging and lecturing they intend to do in private behind closed doors.
I think you’re absolutely right here.
There seems to be a thing on the right, where “facism” has been re-defined to mean “things I don’t like”.
#alternativefacts
You might believe in Trump’s alternative facts, but others are a little more discerning in what they accept as the truth.
Careful with the phrase “alternative facts”. I’ve recently learned that it is considered an accusation of lying.
Yes, Trump is lying.
I used to think the old joke about how you know when a politician is lying was hyperbolic.
So Trump had to go and prove me wrong.
Mockery is not a substitute for an argument. Reducto absurdum only works if you’re dealing with some general principle. You are merely exaggerating to the point that what you say is obviously false.
The OP doesn’t require some sort of nefarious conspiracy. Just continuing to do what’s already being done. Keep gerrymandering districts to keep Republicans in power. Keep having the FBI conveniently time things to help with your elections. Keep coming up with excuses like election fraud to try and reduce Democrats from voting. (An issue no one cared about until Republicans used fear tactics.) You seem to forget that you once admitted that you were okay with it because it helped Republicans, and were okay with restricting the vote. You, an intelligent Republican, are already primed to go along with it. You’re already ready to make excuses.
Then there’s Trump. You admitted one of the things you were worried about was Trump acting like a dictator, locking out Congress or defying the Supreme Court. The one “president” he is most like is Putin, who effectively made voting pointless in his country, and is doing the same shit to his people that Trump is doing.
And even if his incompetence causes him to keep bumbling everything up, he’s a nice distraction, while Republicans silently pass things that make it harder to vote, with a possibly conservative Supreme Court that will just let it happen.
Mockery will not change the problems we are going through. Acting like things can never happen is foolish when we saw someone like Trump win the presidency. There is no more “it can never happen here.”
Registered Democrats outnumber registered Republicans by 22 million, no? Are the Democrats so devoid of personal IDs that voter ID laws would permanently cede power to Republicans in elections? Do half of Democrats have no ID whatsoever?
I’m sure that was the rationale the NC lawmakers used in arguing for the voter ID legislation that they passed. Legislation which was struck down by the courts, btw.
Same way you’d ‘fix’ it if any other conservative was elected president…or how the Republicans would ‘fix’ it if Clinton had gotten elected. Obama told people that there are consequences to elections. If many of the people who had voted for Obama had just come out and voted for Clinton we wouldn’t be having these issues.
Yeah, that’s going to be an issue. However, we seemingly recovered fairly quickly after the disaster that was Bush II’s presidency, and he did a hell of a lot of harm to the US’s image. I HOPE Trump will be a one term wonder. Hopefully the Democrats will figure out how to beat him in the next election cycle
Again, definitely going to be an issue. We are going to be hurt as a nation, politically and economically, no doubt about it. And countries like China who were on the ropes are going to get a much needed jolt. Personally, I think we are going to have a pretty big economic down turn with all of Trump’s stupid trade protectionism and attempted strong arm crap. But I doubt it will be any worse than the 2008 crash or the dot com bust, and we recovered from those pretty quickly. It will depend on who the next president is. We really, really need a good one after this disaster.
I doubt he will back down, but the other side of that is he’s not a king. He has to work within the reality of our system. There is already push back on some of the crazy ass things he’s trying to do and he’s only been in office 2 weeks. I fully expect various groups to be striking back at Trump’s initiatives through the courts, and for protests to just ramp up. He can’t simply pick a SCJ by fiat but has to go through the Congress. I seriously doubt that he can get someone he really wants and will have to compromise in terms of his own party if nothing else.
So…I think it will be a bad 4 years. Trump is a disaster. The policies he is pushing will hurt us politically and economically, IMHO. But wrt the OP? Naw…it’s just same old same old. Heard it all before from first the Democrats then the Republicans, then the Democrats, then the Republicans…blah blah blah.
My suggestion in the future if for folks to fucking vote, and to try and keep it real. There were a lot of butt hurt lefties on this board and elsewhere who just refused to vote for Clinton because Sanders was their guy (or someone else), and figured they could protest the system while the rest of the voters carried the water and Clinton was elected. How did that work out for everyone? Kind of like how it worked out for us when folks did the same thing with Gore… :mad:
We’ll see. It’s early yet, but the only actions so far have been the emoluments suit and the one brought by the two Iraqis directly affected by the ban. I hope the emoluments thing gets past a judge. Worst case then is we finally get to see Il Trumpo’s returns. As for SCOTUS, I can practically guarantee a rubberstamp for whoever he puts up as long as it’s a conservative. Dems will make a lot of noise, but they’re powerless to stop it in the end. Even filibusters only last so long. The true justice (pun unintended) would be if another spot opened up after 2018, by some fluke the Dems took control of the Senate, and they refused to have hearings.
I said exactly the same thing and asked “So how do you feel now?” And what I got was a litany of “Don’t blame me!” from BernieBros.
Well, but there are also states that don’t require citizens to register themselves with Big Brother in order to freely associate with political parties. There exists no registration system for political parties in Washington State, for example, so there are zero stats for that state in those tallies.
That may be true or not, depending on what your definition of “elderly” is. If it’s, say 80+ or even 75+, then yes that’s right. If it’s 70+, then it’s wrong.
You have to look at how large the birth cohorts were however many years ago you define “elderly” as. 75 years ago, we were in WWII and the birth rate was low. It’d been very low during the Depression, and continued that way during the war. But 70 years ago was just after the war and the Baby Boom had started. The Boom was the largest generation in the country’s history. So now there’s lots more people turning 70 than there was even a couple years ago. And the numbers of 70+ are going to increase rather dramatically over the next 15 or so years.
Right but we’re talking political outlook and peoples policies don’t tend to change when they grow old – as a matter of fact I think there may have been some studies that objectively people tend to grow more liberal as they age: they only seem conservative because they don’t change their views enough to match the newborns. So the GOP has to move toward the left or the more liberal people who are replacing the dying elderly people in the elder cohort will move toward the Dems.
Bio-metric National ID.
Purge the dead people, 2 state voters, and Illegals from the voter rolls.
You’ll be voting in the first HONEST election in your lifetime.
Unless the Democrats win. They couldn’t possibly win in an HONEST election. So I’ve heard, anyway.