# Will 50 Shades of Gray make BDSM more mainstream? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 12, 2015, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483 "2015-02-12T16:40:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Namkcalb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c89c15/32.png) [@Namkcalb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Namkcalb)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2015, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/62 "2015-02-13T21:27:14Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I never understood the attraction of some guy dominating or controlling a woman. I realize its a sex game with boundaries and a willing partner. It still doesn’t appeal to me. I never like game playing in my relationships. Keep it real. I think you misunderstand what D&S is. The role of the dom[me] is to actively create experiences for their sub, and the sub enjoys playing out, without having to overthink. IMHO, it’s similar to a chef preparing food for a customer. The sub/customer chooses the nature of the experience, the dom/chef puts in the effort to create it, and the sub/customer gets to enjoy it. It’s not surprising then that most people into D&S are submissives and many couples switch roles. ---
**Author:** ![Cara\_mel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@Cara\_mel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cara_mel)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/63 "2015-02-14T03:32:35Z")
> [@Namkcalb](#): > > The role of the dom[me] is to actively create experiences for their sub, and the sub enjoys playing out, without having to overthink. > > IMHO, it’s similar to a chef preparing food for a customer. The sub/customer chooses the nature of the experience, the dom/chef puts in the effort to create it, and the sub/customer gets to enjoy it. Yes. It takes a whole lot of qualities to create a great and sexy experience - creativity, intelligence, attentiveness, passion, an eye for nuance. The results can be exquisite if done right. I really admire someone who can bring all those skills together. ---
**Author:** ![Tuxie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ee59a6/32.png) [@Tuxie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuxie)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/64 "2015-02-14T03:34:56Z")
I think guys will go see this movie this weekend, if anything for the prospect of getting some pre-moistened 40yo action afterward. There was a similar phenomenon with Titanic- guys took women on dates to see the movie, not because they had any interest, but because they thought it would help their chances of getting laid. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/65 "2015-02-14T03:47:24Z")
> [@Gedd](#): > > (Missed the edit window.) > > What manipulation? Real BDSM has agreed on rules and boundaries. You can’t make the sub do anything they don’t want to. You set limits before. If they change their mind in the middle of play, they have the safe word. > > It’s just a different way to have fun. Some couples like walks on the beach, others like BDSM. Saying “real BDSM” is like saying “real Christianity” - there are no objective standards, just whatever arbitrary rituals the participants choose, if any. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/66 "2015-02-14T04:20:19Z")
Today I was in a conversation about the 50 shades movie and the comment was made that it might be the first movie ever picketed by both the Christian Right and the Kink crowd. I made the observation that there is a good possibility that those two groups overlap a bit. In fact it would not surprise me someone shows up with a picket sign that on the front says **BDSM is a sin** , and on the back says **They got it all wrong** 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/67 "2015-02-14T06:15:12Z")
> [@Gedd](#): > > There’s a good point at the end there. Dislike of this film has made for strange bedfellows. I see what you did there. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/68 "2015-02-14T14:58:14Z")
(spoilers ahead) Y’know, come to think of it… Conventional porn shows a fantasy of casual sex that is really a caricature, one that could potentially have disastrous outcomes if you tried to make it happen IRL, and many people who are otherwise cool with casual sex object to that. The Kink community probably feels _50 Shades_ shows a fantasy caricature of BDSM, specifically, that’s similarly objectionable. Another objection that comes up from the various articles and reviews quoted is that the _real_ fantasy in the 50 Shades trilogy is NOT the BDSM… It’s a fantasy about \*fixing a Broken Bad Boy \* who’s unfulfilled by his wealth and power and needs the Right Woman to straighten him out. [spoiler]Grey is shown to have been introduced to the whole “scene” by having been seduced at age 15 … Anastasia \*\*never \*\*embraces “the scene”, and in fact the first book ends with Anastasia running \*away \*from Grey’s lifestyle. By the end of the trilogy Grey has “exorcised his demons” and gotten rid of the toxic people in his life, and they LHEA in “normal” marital bliss. One could see how some may be a bit put off by the implication that unconventional sexual inclinations involve a “demon to be exorcised” and some sort of negative influence/abuse history. [/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/69 "2015-02-14T14:58:51Z")
> [@Namkcalb](#): > > I think you misunderstand what D&S is. > > The role of the dom[me] is to actively create experiences for their sub, and the sub enjoys playing out, without having to overthink. > > IMHO, it’s similar to a chef preparing food for a customer. The sub/customer chooses the nature of the experience, the dom/chef puts in the effort to create it, and the sub/customer gets to enjoy it. > > It’s not surprising then that most people into D&S are submissives and many couples switch roles. My negative reaction is primarily against the character trope. Mickey Rourke and Mr Gray are wealthy, mysterious, manipulative, cold etc. The way they draw the woman in with harmless games at first that get darker as the relationship develops. The manipulation bothers me. I strongly disliked the male characters by the end of these movies. I’ve wondered if [tropes.com](http://tropes.com) has an article on these characters. Real life is different. I know little about that lifestyle. I’d guess couples enjoying that lifestyle bares little resemblance to the movie relationships. ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/70 "2015-02-14T17:32:41Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > My negative reaction is primarily against the character trope. Mickey Rourke and Mr Gray are wealthy, mysterious, manipulative, cold etc. The way they draw the woman in with harmless games at first that get darker as the relationship develops. The manipulation bothers me. I strongly disliked the male characters by the end of these movies. I’ve wondered if [tropes.com](http://tropes.com) has an article on these characters. > > Real life is different. I know little about that lifestyle. I’d guess couples enjoying that lifestyle bares little resemblance to the movie relationships. Romantic movies/stories aimed at women are always about manipulation. You can’t just BDSM practices by movies anymore than you can judge actual dating practices by watching romantic comedies. (Or so I’m told. Given Hollywood’s relationship to the truth, it seems like a good assumption.) ---
**Author:** ![CheshireKat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheshirekat/32/1207_2.png) [@CheshireKat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CheshireKat)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/71 "2015-02-14T18:30:06Z")
After the reviews about how poorly written this book was, I had no desire to read it. However, now that I have been bombarded for weeks with the constant movie trailers, my curiosity got the better of me. I am halfway through the book (a used copy purchased from Goodwill), and it’s not a waste of time at all. It’s like two books for the price of one. For me, the bad writing is hilarious and has made me laugh out loud A LOT. Parts of their sexcapades are hot! Then you laugh! Then you steam up your glasses! Then you laugh some more! The only downside to actually reading the book is knowing that the author has made and will make MILLIONS and MILLIONS of dollars off it. This makes me angry and sad, because I know I could’ve written a better book than this. It reminds me of the guy who got rich off sticking a stone in a cardboard box and calling it a Pet Rock. I berated myself for years, saying “Why didn’t I think of that?” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Enlightening\_Meditation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecc23a/32.png) [@Enlightening\_Meditation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enlightening_Meditation)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/72 "2015-02-15T01:53:12Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > Today I was in a conversation about the 50 shades movie and the comment was made that it might be the first movie ever picketed by both the Christian Right and the Kink crowd. > I made the observation that there is a good possibility that those two groups overlap a bit. > In fact it would not surprise me someone shows up with a picket sign that on the front says **BDSM is a sin** , and on the back says **They got it all wrong** > 🙂 I haven’t read the book or seen the movie, but I understand the BDSM/Kink culture’s criticism of the basic plot. I know some goth people involved in that subculture. Why exactly would the Christian Right be in opposition? It doesn’t promote family values? Wouldn’t that group of people be offended by over half of R-rated films anyway? I’m only tangentially familiar with this sub-culture. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/73 "2015-02-15T02:22:40Z")
I have met Born Again types that are totally against pre-marital sex in all forms (see purity balls) yet they gave off one hell of a kink vibe. In addition others among the group would object to BDSM. Would you find it beyond belief if say the Phelps gang showed up and picketed 50SoG? I don’t think it is to big a stretch to picture one person who is Born Again and kinky. Hence what I (and the person I was talking to) thought was funny. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/74 "2015-02-15T06:16:33Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Another objection that comes up from the various articles and reviews quoted is that the _real_ fantasy in the 50 Shades trilogy is NOT the BDSM… It’s a fantasy about \*fixing a Broken Bad Boy \* who’s unfulfilled by his wealth and power and needs the Right Woman to straighten him out. This is what I gathered from the trailer “I thought you didn’t do romance” - “See what you do to me”. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/75 "2015-02-15T06:47:41Z")
> [@Enlightening\_Meditation](#): > > Why exactly would the Christian Right be in opposition? It’s a movie in which the “hero” is pissed off about work and decides to let off some steam by beating his girlfriend with a belt. Why _wouldn’t_ they be in opposition? > [@Rick](#): > > I have met Born Again types that are totally against pre-marital sex in all forms (see purity balls) yet they gave off one hell of a kink vibe. I would guess that to be more of a 1950’s D&s thing, where the man’s job is to handle external matters (and in doing so fund the household) and the woman’s job is to handle internal matters (so the man can come home from work and unwind). ---
**Author:** ![cherry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/da6949/32.png) [@cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cherry)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/76 "2015-02-15T08:35:30Z")
Well I just saw the movie and big groups of girls leaving were laughing as they left. Overhearing them they felt like it would be funny if guys thought girls actually liked that stuff. I thought it was really boring but I didn’t read the book. It also kept reminding me of the Jian Gomeshi cases so I kept wondering why am I watching this I should have chosen another movie. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 9:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/77 "2015-02-15T09:21:40Z")
No interest in seeing this, but I can say that at Chicago’s River East 21, every single showing was sold out by mid afternoon. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/78 "2015-02-15T09:39:34Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Y’know, come to think of it… > > Conventional porn shows a fantasy of casual sex that is really a caricature, one that could potentially have disastrous outcomes if you tried to make it happen IRL, and many people who are otherwise cool with casual sex object to that. > > The Kink community probably feels _50 Shades_ shows a fantasy caricature of BDSM, specifically, that’s similarly objectionable. From what I’ve read, it’s worse than that: they feel that the book and film outright show an abusive relationship, and are angry that their scene is being associated with abusive relationships, and fear that it’ll make some people easy prey for being abused AND blame their scene for it. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/79 "2015-02-15T09:57:40Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > I have met Born Again types that are totally against pre-marital sex in all forms (see purity balls) yet they gave off one hell of a kink vibe. > In addition others among the group would object to BDSM. > Would you find it beyond belief if say the Phelps gang showed up and picketed 50SoG? > I don’t think it is to big a stretch to picture one person who is Born Again and kinky. > Hence what I (and the person I was talking to) thought was funny. There is a whole “Christian spanking” subculture where the husband is asserting a dominant role, and unlike a lot of their nonsense, has unambiguous Biblical support. No interest in it myself, but a good example of two ends of the human spectrum engaging in the same thing for different reasons. Strict Biblical adherence has some bits that would seem a bit extreme to a member of the Taliban. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/80 "2015-02-15T11:40:06Z")
I think we’re living through a bad time between the sexes. ---
**Author:** ![Icerigger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icerigger/32/432_2.png) [@Icerigger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icerigger)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483/81 "2015-02-15T15:13:46Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > I have met Born Again types that are totally against pre-marital sex in all forms (see purity balls) yet they gave off one hell of a kink vibe. > In addition others among the group would object to BDSM. > Would you find it beyond belief if say the Phelps gang showed up and picketed 50SoG? > I don’t think it is to big a stretch to picture one person who is Born Again and kinky. > Hence what I (and the person I was talking to) thought was funny. Yeah, look up Christian Domestic Discipline. 😕 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-50-shades-of-gray-make-bdsm-more-mainstream/712483.md?page=5)