# Will "BHENGAZI-GATE" screw up Hitlery's chances in 2016? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 9, 2013, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888 "2013-05-09T13:53:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/221 "2013-05-12T04:59:35Z")
That’s an interesting argument. I remember the great criticism of the press during the Bush years is that they weren’t confrontational enough. And do I detect the insinuation that the media shouldn’t be interested in the details of Benghazi and its response? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/222 "2013-05-12T05:31:10Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Now I admit this isn’t a huge scandal or anything. But the public should learn the truth, and also learn just how intensely political the candidate who says he wants to get past politics is. This is a President who claims to want to set aside politics on actual political issues like guns and the budget, but plays politics with an incident that normally you don’t play politics with. You know how they tell people to sue big companies with deep pockets, so they can get a larger settlement? Obama is out of politics at the end of his term. You really should be trying to blame this on someone who could potentially run for office again. > [@adaher](#): > > What happened in Benghazi under Clinton’s watch… Much better. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/223 "2013-05-12T05:50:26Z")
So we’ve gone from “Obama did nothing and let Americans die” to “Administration bureaucrats engaged in selective rewording of press releases for PR purposes”? Looks like this is coming to its Whitewater-esque endgame. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/224 "2013-05-12T05:58:47Z")
No, there are still some unresolved questions about the response too. It appears the President gave this far less attention than say, the Sandra Fluke controversy. He says he ordered help for the consulate, but given that this didn’t happen, I’m more inclined to believe he’s lying. If he actually had ordered help and people were told to stand down, someone down the line violated orders and you’d think he’d be pretty mad about that. Since he’s not, he probably just received the briefing that the consulate was under attack and went off to a campaign event. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/225 "2013-05-12T06:48:01Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It’s not playing politics with the incident that got them in trouble, it was doing it while denying they were doing it. And of course the gravity of the incident. I don’t recall politics being played when Arafat ordered two of our diplomats murdered in the 70s. There are just some things you don’t screw around with. You give it to people straight. > > But because an election was close, the administration chose the most politically expedient line and sent an official out to lie to the public. > > Now I admit this isn’t a huge scandal or anything. But the public should learn the truth, and also learn just how intensely political the candidate who says he wants to get past politics is. This is a President who claims to want to set aside politics on actual political issues like guns and the budget, but plays politics with an incident that normally you don’t play politics with. You have no idea what you’re talking about. You’re so pulled in by RW misinformation that you literally have a phantom view of the facts that are eliciting an emotional reaction from you. It’s kinda sad. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/226 "2013-05-12T06:49:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > People care plenty. No, it’s not a huge deal, but it’s a big enough deal that it deserves the attention it’s getting. > > And there are still unanswered questions, like what happened between the President ordering help for the besieged consulate and it not happening. Since he says he ordered help to be sent, that means someone disobeyed his orders and needs to be fired. Or he just lied about that, too. Another small insignificant detail the public has the right to know about. > > Now that there are no real political consequences for revealing the truth, this shouldn’t be a huge problem for the administration. He’s not up for reelection and this isn’t impeachable. Specific quotes, moron. Please cite them. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/227 "2013-05-12T06:50:24Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Smear? As I recall, questions were raised about Rudy Giuliani’s judgment over much less. At least when he was a threat. What happened in Benghazi under Clinton’s watch is much more significant than where Rudy Giuliani placed his emergency headquarters. It’s not significant at all, because it’s a tragedy that idiots like you are painting as a failure. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/228 "2013-05-12T06:56:21Z")
For anyone who cares at all, here is the timeline according to the military: [http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/files/serve?File\_id=286253c3-3345-46a3-a120-496a75a448da](http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/files/serve?File_id=286253c3-3345-46a3-a120-496a75a448da) That’s a PDF, by the way. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/229 "2013-05-12T06:57:53Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > No, there are still some unresolved questions about the response too. There will always be unanswered questions, as long as people think there are points to be scored by asking them. And I just stumbled across this article: [GOP ready to push Benghazi case into 2014, beyond](http://news.yahoo.com/gop-ready-push-benghazi-case-2014-beyond-073214926.html) ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/230 "2013-05-12T07:32:56Z")
The 3am phone call ads write themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/231 "2013-05-12T07:36:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The 3am phone call ads write themselves. And they will work, on the barely sentient cretins that make up the base of your side of the field. I have news for you, the average diplomatic installation will not be able to repel mortar fire any time in the near future. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/232 "2013-05-12T07:40:37Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > He says he ordered help for the consulate, but given that this didn’t happen, I’m more inclined to believe he’s lying. If he actually had ordered help and people were told to stand down, someone down the line violated orders and you’d think he’d be pretty mad about that. Since he’s not, he probably just received the briefing that the consulate was under attack and went off to a campaign event. Except for how help _did_ arrive and all. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/233 "2013-05-12T07:41:32Z")
That’s not the issue. Skyscrapers won’t be able to dodge planes anytime soon, but people wanted answers and they go them. This is no different. This is what the President said he did during the attack: I can tell you that immediately upon finding out that our folks were in danger, that my orders to my National Security team were do whatever we need to do to make sure they’re safe. And that’s the same order that I would give anytime that I see Americans are in danger, whether they’re civilian or military, because that’s our number one priority. [http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/11/14/obama\_on\_benghazi\_my\_orders\_were\_to\_do\_whatever\_needed\_to\_make\_sure\_theyre\_safe.html](http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/11/14/obama_on_benghazi_my_orders_were_to_do_whatever_needed_to_make_sure_theyre_safe.html) Now, given those orders, why weren’t they carried out? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/234 "2013-05-12T07:42:49Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Except for how help _did_ arrive and all. Much later than it otherwise would have. People were told to stand down, air cover wasn’t sent. Those are defensible decisions if the military was acting without orders, or with orders to be cautious. Not defensible when told to do “whatever we have to do”. Either he’s lying, or his words were disregarded as just “something the President has to say”. Or someone made a decision down the line to not relay those orders. In any case, he seems remarkably uncurious about why everyone was being told to stand down after he gave orders to do the opposite. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/235 "2013-05-12T07:47:27Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > That’s not the issue. Skyscrapers won’t be able to dodge planes anytime soon, but people wanted answers and they go them. This is no different. > > This is what the President said he did during the attack: > > I can tell you that immediately upon finding out that our folks were in danger, that my orders to my National Security team were do whatever we need to do to make sure they’re safe. And that’s the same order that I would give anytime that I see Americans are in danger, whether they’re civilian or military, because that’s our number one priority. > [Obama On Benghazi: My Orders Were To Do Whatever Needed To "Make Sure They're Safe" | RealClearPolitics](http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/11/14/obama_on_benghazi_my_orders_were_to_do_whatever_needed_to_make_sure_theyre_safe.html) > > Now, given those orders, why weren’t they carried out? If you actually care about reality, I suggest you read the military’s timeline: [http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/files/serve?File\_id=286253c3-3345-46a3-a120-496a75a448da](http://armedservices.house.gov/index.cfm/files/serve?File_id=286253c3-3345-46a3-a120-496a75a448da) ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/236 "2013-05-12T07:50:01Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Much later than it otherwise would have. People were told to stand down, air cover wasn’t sent. > > Those are defensible decisions if the military was acting without orders, or with orders to be cautious. Not defensible when told to do “whatever we have to do”. > > Either he’s lying, or his words were disregarded as just “something the President has to say”. Or someone made a decision down the line to not relay those orders. > > In any case, he seems remarkably uncurious about why everyone was being told to stand down after he gave orders to do the opposite. Again, you are misinformed and pushing nonsense based on your partisan need for Obama to be wrong. His orders were carried out to the best of the ability of the military. So you’re just utterly wrong and promulgating a delusional and dishonest version of events. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/237 "2013-05-12T07:54:10Z")
> **[Top Diplomat in Tripoli: Pentagon Told Special Forces to 'Stand Down'](https://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/05/08/top-diplomat-in-tripoli-pentagon-told-special-forces-to-stand-down?s_cid=rss:top-diplomat-in-tripoli-pentagon-told-special-forces-to-stand-down)** > > Pentagon says special operators told to stay where they would do most good. The military’s account is different from the account of witnesses on the ground. And this is a lot more than just a Republican witch hunt. Lindsey Graham and John McCain take their jobs very seriously and went after Bush the same way they are going after Obama. If they have a problem with how things have been handled, we all should. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/238 "2013-05-12T07:56:52Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Again, you are misinformed and pushing nonsense based on your partisan need for Obama to be wrong. > > His orders were carried out to the best of the ability of the military. So you’re just utterly wrong and promulgating a delusional and dishonest version of events. His orders were carried out by a few men who disobeyed orders to not go help. Unaware of the Presidential command, I’m sure. You are citing the military account as authoritative when it is not. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/239 "2013-05-12T08:00:36Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > [http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/05/08/top-diplomat-in-tripoli-pentagon-told-special-forces-to-stand-down?s\_cid=rss:top-diplomat-in-tripoli-pentagon-told-special-forces-to-stand-down](http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/05/08/top-diplomat-in-tripoli-pentagon-told-special-forces-to-stand-down?s_cid=rss:top-diplomat-in-tripoli-pentagon-told-special-forces-to-stand-down) > > The military’s account is different from the account of witnesses on the ground. In what specific ways? I’m betting you believe half of the bullshit the RW media has put out there. Give me specific ways that the guys on the ground differ with the military timeline. And I’ll tell you what, some guys hiding from a mortar barrage and RPG fire are hardly the guys I’d trust to be taking detailed notes about what was happening. > [@](#): > > And this is a lot more than just a Republican witch hunt. Lindsey Graham and John McCain take their jobs very seriously Horse-fucking-shit. You have no fucking idea what you’re talking about. Graham trashed immigration reform because Obama was working on healthcare reform. He’s more than willing to hurt the country to further his political goals. And McCain has been histrionic in the extreme since he lost the election. > [@](#): > > and went after Bush the same way they are going after Obama. If they have a problem with how things have been handled, we all should. Well, there goes your credibility. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888/240 "2013-05-12T08:04:15Z")
I guess you forget the Abu Ghraib investigation. You also don’t seem to regard the fact that the administration doesn’t want these people talking to Congress as another insignificant detail. They sure aren’t acting like they have nothing to hide. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-bhengazi-gate-screw-up-hitlerys-chances-in-2016/657888.md?page=13)