# Will the choice of Paul Ryan as VP doom Florida for Romney? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 11, 2012, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161 "2012-08-11T04:34:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/101 "2012-08-13T14:07:37Z")
It looks like the administration had a demonstration program that paid bonuses to try to incentivize better performance. Evidence accrued to show that it wasn’t leading to better performance, so they are considering ending the program. How is discontinuing a bonus incentive program a cut in services? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/102 "2012-08-13T14:13:02Z")
Beats me. I just know that they were worried about it, which means there was probably something to worry about. if there’s nothing to worry about, they should discontinue it as scheduled. The Republicans are urging the President to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/103 "2012-08-13T14:19:34Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Beats me. I just know that they were worried about it, which means there was probably something to worry about. if there’s nothing to worry about, they should discontinue it as scheduled. The Republicans are urging the President to do so. You don’t know any such thing. You have one blog entry from the Hartford Courant website that suggests such. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/104 "2012-08-13T14:21:25Z")
The one thing that worries me here is the argument that the elderly will not be comforted by the assurance that they, personally, will be unaffected by the Ryan plan. AFAICT, the elderly by and large don’t care a damn what happens to younger people. And that even makes sense to me–we all have different advantages. Younger people will live longer, have not been forced to serve in various wars, have had all sorts of modern conveniences and will benefit from future ones, so why shouldn’t they pay more to benefit from entitlement programs? That’s how I think the elderly will think on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/105 "2012-08-13T14:22:18Z")
It was all over the news that hte Medicare cuts have been postponed until after the election. The blog post links to an AP article which has expired, but I’m sure it wouldn’t be hard to find other sources. Why postpone Medicare ‘savings’ until after the election? Especially since the president had to use questionable methods to do it? He sure has gone to a lot of trouble. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/106 "2012-08-13T14:25:13Z")
From the Washington Post: ``` In a rebuke to the Obama administration, government auditors are calling for the cancellation of an $8 billion Medicare program that congressional Republicans have criticized as a political ploy. The nonpartisan Government Accountability Office says in a report to be released Monday that the $8.3 billion the administration has earmarked for quality bonuses to Medicare Advantage insurance plans would **postpone the pain of cuts** to the plans under the new health care law. Most of the money would go to plans rated merely average. … GAO, the investigative agency of Congress, did not address GOP allegations that the bonuses are politically motivated. But, its report found the program highly unusual. It “dwarfs” all other Medicare pilots undertaken in nearly 20 years, the GAO said. ``` [http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/auditors-call-on-obama-administration-to-cancel-medicare-bonuses-gop-sees-as-political/2012/04/22/gIQAvoFuaT\_print.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/auditors-call-on-obama-administration-to-cancel-medicare-bonuses-gop-sees-as-political/2012/04/22/gIQAvoFuaT_print.html) ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/107 "2012-08-13T14:28:17Z")
What is it with the AP and liberal news sites flushing articles that make the President look bad? Finally found the original AP report on Fox News site: [http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/04/23/government-auditors-call-for-end-to-8-million-medicare-bonus-program/](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/04/23/government-auditors-call-for-end-to-8-million-medicare-bonus-program/) Yes, it’s Fox news, but it’s the AP version verbatim. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/108 "2012-08-13T14:28:21Z")
“Page not found.” ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2012, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/109 "2012-08-13T14:31:06Z")
Yeah, they made it up. Whatever. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2012, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/110 "2012-08-19T08:16:38Z")
[http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/state-regional-govt-politics/polls-ryan-choice-not-hurting-romney-among-florida/nRDgx/](http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/state-regional-govt-politics/polls-ryan-choice-not-hurting-romney-among-florida/nRDgx/) Polls: Ryan choice not hurting Romney among Florida seniors In Florida, where seniors were 22 percent of voters in the 2008 election, Obama pollsters John Anzalone and Jeff Liszt called the Ryan pick a “game changer” that could “immediately erode” Romney’s advantage with senior voters. But two Florida polls conducted since Ryan’s selection suggest that voters who are 65 and older support Ryan and his budget plan more than younger voters do. A third Florida poll released this week doesn’t include an age breakdown, but finds the state’s voters agreeing more with Ryan’s description of his budget and Medicare plan than with Democratic criticisms that it would “end Medicare as we know it.” And most ominous for the President: Rasmussen asked Florida voters whether Ryan’s Medicare plan or the Medicare changes in the federal health care law “scares you more.” By a 48-to-41 percent margin, Floridians said the health care law was scarier. Among seniors, the health care law was rated scarier by 54 percent, with 34 percent saying they were more frightened by the Ryan plan. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2012, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/111 "2012-08-19T11:54:38Z")
_Rasmussen_? :D:D:D I always love seeing folks her who think watching Fox nonstop prepares them for the real world. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2012, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/112 "2012-08-19T12:17:41Z")
SurveyUSA also found that Ryan is doing just fine among seniors as well. ---
**Author:** ![TheSlapIsBack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/838e76/32.png) [@TheSlapIsBack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheSlapIsBack)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2012, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/113 "2012-08-19T16:02:17Z")
> [@boytyperanma](#): > > You keep making this argument like it’s meaningful. The only way for Obama’s budget to get a vote would be for the Republican led house to put it up for a vote. For some unknown reason Republicans don’t introduce Democratic bills..It’s almost like they have created a talking point they want their supporters to use in any forum they can find. Just a minor … wait no a major correction. Obama had full control for the first two years. Why no budge? Was the economy and our domestic fiscal policy not important? I will help you. Healthcare was more important. He could have had majorities for 4 years and there be no budget. I would like to point you to the 129 absent votes of Obama as a Senator. This is a man who does not want to have a record to answer to and has done a great job at doing just that. As to the quote above it is pretty accurate. If Romney wins Florida which he will attempt to do by spending a quarter of a billion dollars or more convincing seniors that the democrats are liars about medicare and he manages to steal Wisconsin and or a couple of other Midwest states it will be the equivalent of The Music City Miracle in football. The obama campaign will have been thoroughly out smarted and the move will be seen as one of the most brazen and intelligent decisions in modern electoral history Of course he could lose Florida and the election whereby everybody will say he should have taken Rubio. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2012, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/114 "2012-08-19T16:40:33Z")
> [@TheSlapIsBack](#): > > Just a minor … wait no a major correction. Obama had full control for the first two years. Why no budge? Was the economy and our domestic fiscal policy not important? I will help you. > Healthcare was more important. He could have had majorities for 4 years and there be no budget. I would like to point you to the 129 absent votes of Obama as a Senator. This is a man who does not want to have a record to answer to and has done a great job at doing just that. No budget? What are you talking about? Further, the Affordable Health Care Act dramatically improves the economic health of the country. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2012, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/115 "2012-08-21T19:15:37Z")
[http://realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest\_polls/](http://realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/) Two Democratic pollsters find Romney ahead in Michigan and Wisconsin. Even if Romney was trailing in Florida(and he’s not), he could make it up by winning those two traditional blue states. If Romney does win Florida, Michigan, and Wisconsin, it’s hard to see a path to 270 for Obama. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2012, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/116 "2012-08-21T19:21:42Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > [http://realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest\_polls/](http://realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/) > > Two Democratic pollsters find Romney ahead in Michigan and Wisconsin. > > Even if Romney was trailing in Florida(and he’s not), he could make it up by winning those two traditional blue states. If Romney does win Florida, Michigan, and Wisconsin, it’s hard to see a path to 270 for Obama. Thanks for bringing us today’s cherries! Mmmm, these are yummy and hand-selected! ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2012, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/117 "2012-08-21T19:26:42Z")
Not at all. Both major tracking polls also have Romney in the lead. I also did not mention the extreme outlier poll that shows Romney up by 15 in Florida. The only good polling news for Obama in the last couple of days is that he has a big lead in New York. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2012, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161/118 "2012-08-21T21:58:58Z")
Republican trickster [Roger Stone claims that Ryan’s selection was well compensated](http://www.nationalmemo.com/gop-consultant-koch-brothers-bought-ryans-nomination-with-100-million-promise/): > [@](#): > > According to Stone, the billionaire Koch brothers purchased the Republican vice presidential nomination for Ryan from Romney in late July by promising to fork over an additional $100 million toward “independent expenditure” campaigning for the GOP ticket. > > Any such transaction would represent a serious violation of federal election laws and perhaps other statutes … (This has nothing to do with Florida, but several other posts in this thread relate to neither Ryan not Florida. I guess _doom_ is the common link.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-choice-of-paul-ryan-as-vp-doom-florida-for-romney/631161.md?page=5)