# Will the death penalty ever go extinct? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 19, 2014, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720 "2014-05-19T08:29:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/21 "2014-05-19T15:25:39Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > **Will the death penalty ever go extinct?** > > Why should it? Because it’s pointless and always implemented unjustly. Overwhelmingly, it’s race and gender and how much money the accused has and who the supposed victim is that determine whether someone gets the death penalty, not what they’ve done. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/22 "2014-05-19T16:25:48Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Because it’s pointless and always implemented unjustly. Not even close to being accurate. > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Overwhelmingly, it’s race and gender and how much money the accused has and who the supposed victim is that determine whether someone gets the death penalty, not what they’ve done. If this statement is accurate, it just means there needs to be more executions, not less. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/23 "2014-05-19T17:29:02Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Miscarriages of justice are going to happen because no justice system is perfect. The very least we can hope for is that they are reversible. Rather pointless to release a corpse. There’s something to be said for that, but you also have to consider that releasing a guy who was wrongly convicted 20 years ago doesn’t really accomplish much. His life is still ruined; he’ll be unemployable as anything other than unskilled labor (and even then, most reputable employers wouldn’t touch an ex-con); and any personal relationships he had are likely to be long gone. I’m not saying that we should leave wrongly-convicted people in jail, but let’s not kid ourselves that there’s any possibility of restoring “justice” at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/24 "2014-05-19T17:42:40Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Because it’s pointless and always implemented unjustly. Overwhelmingly, it’s race and gender and how much money the accused has and who the supposed victim is that determine whether someone gets the death penalty, not what they’ve done. Gender? In response to the OP: no, I don’t think capital punishment is going anywhere. Countries have abolished it and brought it back before , after all. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/25 "2014-05-19T17:46:17Z")
Simplicio, India uses the death penalty exceedingly sparingly, although there are actually quite a number if offences which qualify and another one was just added last year. The two most recent people executed were both Muslim terrorists responsible for the 2001 attack on government buildings in Delhi and the 2008 Mumbai attack. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/26 "2014-05-19T17:46:59Z")
**Will the death penalty ever go extinct?** Hopefully not. Hopefully, what will happen is that we don’t take 20 years to complete an execution. ---
**Author:** ![Mogle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mogle/32/12021_2.png) [@Mogle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mogle)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/27 "2014-05-19T19:08:00Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But you’re missing the historical perspective. Capital punishment was abolished in the United States in 1972. Japan unofficially abolished the death penalty in 1989. It wasn’t abolished in much of Europe until the nineties. So arguably the United States and Japan were ahead of Europe in ending capital punishment. Prior to the 90’s much of Europe consisted of dictatorships, if you look at western Europe most countries had stopped using it by the 1950’s(last executions being WW2 related most likely), even if it remained on the books(in many cases only for wartime crimes) for longer. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/28 "2014-05-19T19:22:16Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > 😕 you are making my argument for me because I’m sure we didn’t execute any of those people. > > Miscarriages of justice are going to happen because no justice system is perfect. The very least we can hope for is that they are reversible. Rather pointless to release a corpse. In case you don’t know, that was one of the reason a given for why the injustices continued for so long, the fact that the death penalty was no longer an option. If if had been, the prosecution and the Crown would have been far more careful and they likely would never have been convicted at all. I am opposed to the death penalty. I have been instructed as Counsel in capital cases. But, I am also opposed to know mindless assertions of who is of who is not “civilised” based upon statistics from a website. There is nothing stated at all about the cases, its merits, review done, trial proceedings, type of crime etc. That decides whether a system is “civilised” not the type of penalty imposed. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/29 "2014-05-19T20:05:24Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But you’re missing the historical perspective. Capital punishment was abolished in the United States in 1972. Japan unofficially abolished the death penalty in 1989. It wasn’t abolished in much of Europe until the nineties. So arguably the United States and Japan were ahead of Europe in ending capital punishment. You mean that the USA and Japan stopped killing for a bit while it ironed out the legal niceties? took you about 4 years I think in both cases. Not really “abolition” in any true sense as it was never taken off the books. > [@](#): > > And perhaps they were just ahead of Europe in reinstating it as well. Instead of assuming the future will have America and Japan joining Europe in once again ending capital punishment, perhaps we’ll see Europe following America and Japan in bringing it back. Not a hope in hell for that, nor any need. It is neither an effective deterrent nor does it accomplish anything that life incarceration cannot. Japan and the USA will abolition it fully in time. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/30 "2014-05-19T20:13:15Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > In case you don’t know, that was one of the reason a given for why the injustices continued for so long, the fact that the death penalty was no longer an option. If if had been, the prosecution and the Crown would have been far more careful and they likely would never have been convicted at all. No, I’m aware of the arguments. Not that they form a rational argument\* for\* the death penalty of course, just further impetus for improving standards all round. > [@](#): > > I am opposed to the death penalty. I have been instructed as Counsel in capital cases. But, I am also opposed to know mindless assertions of who is of who is not “civilised” based upon statistics from a website. not the people, the system. > [@](#): > > There is nothing stated at all about the cases, its merits, review done, trial proceedings, type of crime etc. That decides whether a system is “civilised” not the type of penalty imposed. The most “civilised” process in the world does not offset or negate the barbarity of the end result. ---
**Author:** ![Death\_of\_Rats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a6a055/32.png) [@Death\_of\_Rats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Death_of_Rats)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/31 "2014-05-19T20:49:55Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > The most “civilised” process in the world does not offset or negate the barbarity of the end result. Leaving a person to rot in prison, caged like an animal for the rest of thier natural life? or released back into the general population after receiving advanced training in criminal techniques at the hands of thier only daily companions, other criminals and free to commit additional crimes? Any punishment you want can be redefined by someone else a “barbaric”. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/32 "2014-05-19T21:07:42Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > Because it’s pointless and always implemented unjustly. > > Not even close to being accurate. Like it or not, it’s the truth. > [@Omar\_Little](#): > > If this statement is accurate, it just means there needs to be more executions, not less. Why? > [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > Gender? A woman is _much_ less likely to be targeted for the death penalty for the same crime (they are punished less harshly for crimes in general). For that matter, you are more likely to get the death penalty for killing a woman than for killing a man. > [@AK84](#): > > In case you don’t know, that was one of the reason a given for why the injustices continued for so long, the fact that the death penalty was no longer an option. If if had been, the prosecution and the Crown would have been far more careful and they likely would never have been convicted at all. That’s certainly not how it works in America. In America death penalty cases are usually run in a much more slapdash and often outright corrupt fashion than non-death penalty cases. They get the worst defense lawyers (the sort who sleep through trials or show up drunk), the flimsiest (or outright faked) evidence, the most blatant bias. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/33 "2014-05-19T21:25:05Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Like it or not, it’s the truth. No it’s not. > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Why? Because you claim that only a certain segment receive the death penalty because of their gender or race. Which if true, means there are people that are avoiding the death penalty because of there gender or race. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/34 "2014-05-19T22:39:15Z")
I believe that the death penalty, particularly in the U.S., is **bound** to go away. As a kind of evolutionary step up the ladder. It will happen; _when_, however, is something I wouldn’t put money on. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/35 "2014-05-19T22:46:25Z")
> [@Death\_of\_Rats](#): > > Leaving a person to rot in prison, caged like an animal for the rest of thier natural life? exactly, that would barbaric. > [@](#): > > or released back into the general population after receiving advanced training in criminal techniques at the hands of thier only daily companions, other criminals and free to commit additional crimes? indeed, that would be a terrible system. We should seek to ensure that it doesn’t happen. You seem to be implying that the two scenarios above are something I’d advocate and are the only other options to the death penalty. > [@](#): > > Any punishment you want can be redefined by someone else a “barbaric”. yes, you are free to make up your own definition of barbaric, just as I did. There is no objective standard and I don’t claim there is. Any punishment and suffering cannot be undone. However, as long as the death penalty is not imposed there is chance of rehabilitation of the guilty and release and recompense for the innocent. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/36 "2014-05-19T23:25:56Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Because you claim that only a certain segment receive the death penalty because of their gender or race. Which if true, means there are people that are avoiding the death penalty because of there gender or race. Or that people are being _targeted_ because of their race, class or gender. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/37 "2014-05-19T23:41:50Z")
Will the death penalty ever go extinct? Yes, right after ethnic cleansing campaigns and massacres go extinct. Before then, not bloody likely. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/38 "2014-05-19T23:43:19Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > yes, you are free to make up your own definition of barbaric, just as I did. There is no objective standard and I don’t claim there is. I say we offer definitions for _“effete”_ or _“decadent”_ as the standard for judging cultures that went too far past _“barbaric”_. Y’know, so long as we’re name-calling. ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/39 "2014-05-19T23:53:47Z")
Believe it or not, the death penalty is [declining in Texas](http://www.texasobserver.org/state-texas-decline-death-penalty/), in part due to juries now having the option to sentence a defendant to life without parole, which wasn’t available until 2005. I don’t know that it will ever go completely extinct in the U.S. unless and until some U.S. jurisdiction sees a case like the [Timothy Evans](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Evans) case that led to the abolition of the death penalty in the UK. ---
**Author:** ![mascaroni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dc4da7/32.png) [@mascaroni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mascaroni)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720/40 "2014-05-20T00:15:24Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > In case you don’t know, that was one of the reason a given for why the injustices continued for so long, the fact that the death penalty was no longer an option. If if had been, the prosecution and the Crown would have been far more careful and they likely would never have been convicted at all. I’d have to disagree with that. The Birmingham Six were convicted largely on the “expert” evidence of Dr. Frank Skuse, who was later found to have miscalculated the finger swabs by a factor of 10, which led the jury to believe they had handled nitro-glycerine rather than a brand new pack of playing cards. The judge in the trial said at sentencing words to the effect of: “If there was crime that deserved capital punishment, this is it.” I’ve no doubt they would have been executed, had the law been in place. > [@](#): > > I am opposed to the death penalty. I am too. And if sentencing a teenager to death and then waiting 25 years to kill the middle aged man is not a cruel and unusual punishment I don’t know what is… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-death-penalty-ever-go-extinct/688720.md?page=3)