# Will the GOP implode over Tea Party demands for cuts to ethanol subsidies? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 23, 2010, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653 "2010-11-23T13:00:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/1 "2010-11-23T13:00:56Z")
[http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2010/11/the\_next\_big\_gop\_intra-party\_w.html](http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2010/11/the_next_big_gop_intra-party_w.html) > [@](#): > > Senators Jim DeMint and Tom Coburn, two leading conservative Senators who have pushed the GOP to be serious about its anti-spending rhetoric, told me they are calling on fellow Republicans to urge Congress to allow ethanol subsidies to expire – something that could put other leading GOP Senators in an awkward spot and subject them (in theory) to the wrath of the anti-government-spending Tea Party if they don’t go along. > > … > > DeMint, who bucked the GOP establishment by successfully rounding up enough support for an earmarks ban, said in a statement emailed my way: > “Government mandates and tax subsidies for ethanol have led to decreased gas mileage, adversely effected the environment and increased food prices. Washington must stop picking winners and losers in the market, and instead allow Americans to make choices for themselves.” > “We need to let the ethanol subsidies expire and we need energy developed based on market forces,” Senator Coburn added in an interview with me. He said Senators who are not willing to let them expire are “just protecting a parochial interest ahead of the national interest.” Have DeMint and Coburn stepped on the third rail of midwest politics? Whether you want to cut ethanol subsidies or not, it is undeniable that anyone who even suggests cutting subsidies gets a very cold shoulder in some very reliable red states. Or can the Tea Party convince corn farmers vote against their own self interest yet again, only this time in a very up-close and personal way? I personally think the subsidies should be cut, but I am not so naive that I think I can convince the corn belt to agree with me. The Tea Party must think they have enough power without the corn lobby, or they are just deluded about how far people will go in sacrificing their own interests for a political goal. I think it will blow the 2012 primaries wide open, and divide the Tea Party from the mainstream GOP who largely support ethanol subsidies. The Tea Party is going to learn the hard way that all politics is local. Let’s you and him fight. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/2 "2010-11-23T13:06:20Z")
I bet Rand Paul would vote for ending corn subsidies. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/3 "2010-11-23T13:11:56Z")
That’s an easy one, assuming Rand Paul isn’t planning to run for President. I am wondering if Sarah Palin will take a position on ethanol subsidies; damned if she does, and damned if she doesn’t. Somebody should ask her. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/4 "2010-11-23T13:56:55Z")
If the Republican Party does manage to eliminate ethanol subsidies, it would be one of the few indisputably and totally good things that they’ve done in my lifetime. However, given how difficult it is to get rid of even tiny handouts [such as mohair subsidies](http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0610/38379.html), I doubt that it will happen. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/5 "2010-11-23T14:11:30Z")
I don’t really equate the Tea Party with the major corn growing states. I feel like you pretty much have to be a whore for Big Agriculture to get elected there. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/6 "2010-11-23T14:24:34Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > I don’t really equate the Tea Party with the major corn growing states. Perhaps you should [rethink that](http://www.teapartypatriots.org/state/Iowa). > [@](#): > > I feel like you pretty much have to be a whore for Big Agriculture to get elected there. You also have to be a whore to big agriculture to win the Iowa caucus. Can a Tea Party candidate (such as Sarah Palin) win Iowa while advocating the abolition of ethanol subsidies? ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/7 "2010-11-23T14:29:20Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Perhaps you should [rethink that](http://www.teapartypatriots.org/state/Iowa) Their presence alone in Iowa doesn’t mean anything. I’m sure they have a presence in every state. ---
**Author:** ![Keweenaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Keweenaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keweenaw)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/8 "2010-11-23T15:10:18Z")
The subsidies aren’t the only thing set to expire, the import tariff on ethanol is set to expire as well. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/9 "2010-11-23T15:19:29Z")
For heaven’s sake, even [Algore](http://spectator.org/archives/2010/11/23/al-gores-important-admission) recognizes that ethanol subsidies were a mistake. He even admitted he was whoring his environmental principles to try to win votes in the Iowa primary - > [@](#): > > One of the reasons I made that mistake is that I paid particular attention to the farmers in my home state of Tennessee, and I had a certain fondness for the farmers in the state of Iowa because I was about to run for president. I suspect “getting a liar and hypocrite like Gore to admit it” can count as bipartisanism these days. I hope so - it may be the best we can hope for. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/10 "2010-11-23T15:21:16Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > [Algore](http://spectator.org/archives/2010/11/23/al-gores-important-admission) He was my favorite fighter in Killer Instinct. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/11 "2010-11-23T15:37:26Z")
I think the GOP will keep the subsidies, and the Tea Party will forgive them. It will be just one more exhibit that the TP is really just another name for the right wing of the GOP, not a truly independent-minded small-government movement. DeMint and Coburn are rather ignorable. Maybe they get some token reduction, but even that would kinda surprise me (and I say that as someone that thinks the subsides are silly). There is no way in hell that Sarah Palin (or any other POTUS contender) comes out against ethanol subsidies (and if she does, then I’ll become convinced she doesn’t really want to be president, just wants to use a run to keep her Q-score high). ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/12 "2010-11-23T16:03:18Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > . . . [Algore](http://spectator.org/archives/2010/11/23/al-gores-important-admission) . . . Post reported, and I demand this thread be moved to the Pit immediately. I will make the same demand every time I see the above piece of shitheaddery. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/13 "2010-11-23T16:06:35Z")
Agreeing with the Tea Party makes me feel funny, and not in a good way. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/14 "2010-11-23T16:20:49Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Post reported, and I demand this thread be moved to the Pit immediately. I will make the same demand every time I see the above piece of shitheaddery. That’s not how this works. A Great Debates thread does not become a Pit thread just because someone takes a shot at a politician during a discussion. If you think the comment is unwarranted, wrong, or foolish, say so while following the rules here. If you’re going to call someone else’s post “shitheaddery,” do it in the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/15 "2010-11-23T16:25:33Z")
OK, someone has to explain what “Algore” is supposed to mean, and how it’s a slight against Gore. I’ve never seen it before, and the link doesn’t explain it AFAICT. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/16 "2010-11-23T16:31:48Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > OK, someone has to explain what “Algore” is supposed to mean, and how it’s a slight against Gore. I’ve never seen it before, and the link doesn’t explain it AFAICT. I don’t know. I took it as an Algore=Igor insult. No, it doesn’t make sense, but I chuckled. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/17 "2010-11-23T16:34:03Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > OK, someone has to explain what “Algore” is supposed to mean, and how it’s a slight against Gore. I’ve never seen it before, and the link doesn’t explain it AFAICT. It is a Rush Limbaugh bit, that he did back when Clinton was President. Algore was Clinton’s evil henchman. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/18 "2010-11-23T16:38:04Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It is a Rush Limbaugh bit, that he did back when Clinton was President. Algore was Clinton’s evil henchman. Good thing Republicans don’t have evil henchmen. We’re safe now. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/19 "2010-11-23T16:44:59Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Or can the Tea Party convince corn farmers vote against their own self interest yet again, only this time in a very up-close and personal way? If they can, good for them. The agriculture lobby is arguably the most disproportionately powerful group in America. > [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > He was my favorite fighter in Killer Instinct. His Ultimate Combo where he turned into ManBearPig was awesome. > [@Shodan](#): > > It is a Rush Limbaugh bit, that he did back when Clinton was President. Algore was Clinton’s evil henchman. I hope you won’t mind if I equate your credibility with Limbaugh’s from now on, then. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2010, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653/20 "2010-11-23T16:57:15Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > That’s not how this works. A Great Debates thread does not become a Pit thread just because someone takes a shot at a politician during a discussion. If you think the comment is unwarranted, wrong, or foolish, say so while following the rules here. If you’re going to call someone else’s post “shitheaddery,” do it in the Pit. I think what it is, is beyond the pale. “Teabagger” and “Repugnican” are the height of Algonquinian wit by comparison. The Pit demand is only so that we can, **in this same thread,** give **Shodan** the crucifixion he deserves. Not an unreasonable demand under the circumstances, **Marley.** [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-gop-implode-over-tea-party-demands-for-cuts-to-ethanol-subsidies/561653.md?page=2)