# Will The Marvels flop? \[Open spoilers after post 112-ish\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [November 8, 2023, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837 "2023-11-08T16:54:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/121 "2023-11-14T15:31:20Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Is _The Incredibles,_ for me. Or _Superman!_ (1978). Mind you _Iron Man, Avengers_, etc were damn good. Then they decided to kill off the second best known group of Superheroes and showcase little known ones, with Mixed results- _Guardians of the Galaxy_- wow, vs _Eternals_ (who? why?). Those were great films but were not in the time frame I was talking about. I am talking specifically about the last few years as both Marvel and DC films have gotten very tired because of the “produce more content” drive. I actually have a sick fascination to see Aquaman 2. I thought the first one was basically a migraine, but 1. It’s under 2 hours, which is pleasantly unusual these days, and 2. Black Manta is a great villain. Way underused in the first film. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/122 "2023-11-14T18:02:37Z")
Tried to go see it last weekend, but the shows were sold out. If the film is flopping, you couldn’t tell from the local theater patronage. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/123 "2023-11-14T21:20:02Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Those were great films but were not in the time frame I was talking about. I am talking specifically about the last few years as both Marvel and DC films have gotten very tired because of the “produce more content” drive. Okay, I see your point. ---
**Author:** ![jadielyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jadielyn/32/8808_2.png) [@jadielyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jadielyn)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/124 "2023-11-14T22:51:27Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Tried to go see it last weekend, but the shows were sold out. Must be a pretty skiffy population you have in your area, coolness! Saw it twice, first showing was maybe 1/3 full, second showing there was only one other person there, disappointing. _However_ I will note that both showings were afternoon and in 3-D which not everyone loves; the first showing was Saturday on the upscale border of a college town when there’s two theatres closer to campus and the general population … the second showing was the only theater of a small conservative town on a Sunday. So… yeah. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![jadielyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jadielyn/32/8808_2.png) [@jadielyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jadielyn)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2023, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/125 "2023-11-14T23:44:18Z")
One thing that rather puzzled me at the end of the film was Kamala’s family moving into Monica’s place. Yes, their Jersey home was trashed, yes someone ought to look after the Rambeau’s place until/if Monica can return. But for the Khans to up and leave their community in Jersey to live off somewhere remote in Louisiana for a while, that’s quite the life change. Fury going to help them pay the bills, will Yusuf get a local or telecommuting financial job, how is Kamala going to cope moving away from her Jersey friends and into an LA high school? Or is she going to have a transport at her disposal, since she did pop back to NY to drop in on Kate Bishop? I mean, chances are they’ll move back once their home is repaired, it’s just the moving-in scene felt more permanent than temporary unless I missed something. I also have a small quibble with the design of Carol’s ship. Sure it’s fine for her and maybe Goose to have an always-open stern with a selectively-permeable forcefield but it doesn’t seem wise to me to have a ship designed so that a power loss or equipment failure will vent everything into space. Sucks for any passengers, y’know. I suppose there might be a physical door that Carol just leaves open all the time but wouldn’t it have been a good idea to close it while evacuating survivors, at least? An evasive maneuver or impact could’ve thrown someone out the back, nevermind when being shot at by enemy ships. Or did it close up at some point and I missed it? I really hope SABER’s space elevator vehicle had failsafe engines or parachutes or was docked planetside when the elevator failed. Wonder where their home base is, the SWORD facility we saw in WandaVision with the numbnut in charge? It’s interesting that Fury has built up such an interstellar research facility, deep enough in technical scope to be able to measure the integrity of the jumppoint network as well as exploration. I suppose having an engineer/scientist exchange program with other alien races doesn’t hurt. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/126 "2023-11-15T00:13:41Z")
Since e are doing open spoilers now I will agree that I didn’t like thee idea of Kamala’s family moving and I hope it is temporary. Jersey City is a part of her character. It would be a shame if they ditch it already. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/127 "2023-11-15T00:14:39Z")
One minor point I noticed in the movie. The Waterworld Showtune Aliens gave Ms. Marvel a new costume with special powers. In the comics aliens once gave her a new costume with special powers, too. It didn’t go well. _If_ the character is ever used again in the MCU, they might make use of this concept. > **[Ms. Marvel's Greatest Enemy May Be... Her Own Costume?!](https://www.cbr.com/ms-marvel-stormranger-costume-enemy/)** > > Now that her alien costume has separated from her and gone rogue, Ms. Marvel has a problem that Spider-Man has some serious experience with. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/128 "2023-11-15T16:04:25Z")
Saw it yesterday and really liked it. The cast was good, the settings and fight scenes were cool, the plot worked. I’ll admit I’m still a sucker for a good superhero fight scene, with diverse powers interacting in a well coreographed way. I liked the teleporting body swapping gimmick here. I think the “you have to know so much” criticsm is overblown. As long as you don’t mind not knowing everything about every character, it’s a good story in itself. I’ve seen most of the MCU, but in my comic reading days I could accept that there’d be storylines and minor characters that would go over my head. I agree the Khan’s moving to Louisiana was not great. They are really going to leave their whole community, their mosque and South Asian neighbors. Surely SHIELD can rebuild their New Jersey house. I hope waterworld was okay in the end. They kinda left that hanging. Who was that big dark skinned dude on the station, the one who said he was 300 years old? An Eternal? The eldritch kitties were cute ---
**Author:** ![jadielyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jadielyn/32/8808_2.png) [@jadielyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jadielyn)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/129 "2023-11-15T20:00:59Z")
> [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > I hope waterworld was okay in the end. They kinda left that hanging. Agreed, my thought is the Kree soldiers left (why bother staying?), and within half a day the jump portals Dar-Benn opened most likely closed when she was no longer controlling the Quantum Band; stopping the ocean loss. So now they have a new coastline. Mind you, it would’ve been nice to show that the rogue jump-portals closed on their own but the implication seems to be it was the Kree futzing with the QB that was causing their specific portals as well as other random portals like Earth’s to stay open indefinitely. Of course, now I’m wondering - why did Dar-Benn bother meeting up with the Aladna royals at all? Vindictiveness, I suppose, to help ensure that word gets back to Danvers that it was personal, since if things had gone as expected Danvers wouldn’t have found out what transpired until she happened to drop back on by on her own. > [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > Who was that big dark skinned dude on the station, the one who said he was 300 years old? An Eternal? Not sure if they’re any specific named individual from comics or not; seemed to me like part of Fury’s alien outreach/exchange program he seems to have going on - they’re obviously sending and receiving spacecraft on the regular … contacting alien civilizations and establishing some level of intel and technology trade - not only part of the original goal of finding new homes for the Skrulls but to also have some hope of identifying and defending against threats such as the Kree, Thanos, et cetera. It’s no Stark “suit of armor around the world”, but it’s a beginning. (watching the ship leave via the jumppoint near SABER gave me something of a Deep Space Nine vibe, tbh) ---
**Author:** ![crazyjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@crazyjoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crazyjoe)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/130 "2023-11-15T20:20:41Z")
Granted the hole in this concept is only 10 meters wide, and the one in the movies looked larger, but it was not on the order of “so much larger that the oceans are going to dry up in days” larger. Let’s say the hole was maybe 200m in diameter. That’s about 400 times more area than a 10m hole as posed in the example. Instead of thousands of years, perhaps it only takes a few dozen years…the hole was open for a few days, so the planet lost maybe 1/1000th of its water. That could be catastrophic on a geological scale, but it’s hardly enough that it’s going to cause an immediate problem. [https://what-if.xkcd.com/53/](https://what-if.xkcd.com/53/) ---
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/131 "2023-11-15T20:28:54Z")
> [@jadielyn](#): > > I also have a small quibble with the design of Carol’s ship. Sure it’s fine for her and maybe Goose to have an always-open stern with a selectively-permeable forcefield but it doesn’t seem wise to me to have a ship designed so that a power loss or equipment failure will vent everything into space. Sucks for any passengers, y’know. I suppose there might be a physical door that Carol just leaves open all the time but wouldn’t it have been a good idea to close it while evacuating survivors, at least? An evasive maneuver or impact could’ve thrown someone out the back, nevermind when being shot at by enemy ships. Or did it close up at some point and I missed it? I was thinking the same thing about her ship, which is named the _[Hoopty](https://screenrant.com/the-marvels-hoopty-spaceship/)_, evidently. There was one scene later in the film where Captain Marvel is flying back into it through the rear portal and there was a panel sliding down. I think we can assume that there is a back window made from the same material that the cockpit windows are made from and reinforced by that selectively impermeable forcefield. And I should have thought of this but when I googled Captain Marvels ship I got a lot of results about who Carol Danvers should be dating. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/132 "2023-11-15T20:40:45Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > And I should have thought of this but when I googled Captain Marvels ship I got a lot of results about who Carol Danvers should be dating. 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![jadielyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jadielyn/32/8808_2.png) [@jadielyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jadielyn)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2023, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/133 "2023-11-15T23:08:21Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > There was one scene later in the film where Captain Marvel is flying back into it through the rear portal and there was a panel sliding down. Oh cool, nice catch! That makes more sense from a practicality standpoint, I’ll have to keep an eye out next viewing. > [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > when I googled Captain Marvels ship I got a lot of results about who Carol Danvers should be dating. lol, as long as you didn’t get Rule 34’d. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2023, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/134 "2023-11-18T18:58:51Z")
87% drop from last Friday to this Friday. Less than $700 per screen. > **[The Marvels - Box Office Mojo](https://www.boxofficemojo.com/release/rl247366145/?ref_=bo_hm_rd)** [![](https://www.snarkgifts.com/cdn/shop/products/5b355891b75c5155dee706af8f41887e265f9c6da52fb22996e55d6db8ae7b57.jpg?v=1658547166) ](https://www.snarkgifts.com/cdn/shop/products/5b355891b75c5155dee706af8f41887e265f9c6da52fb22996e55d6db8ae7b57.jpg?v=1658547166) ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2023, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/135 "2023-11-19T01:16:28Z")
Incels will rebel. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2023, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/136 "2023-11-20T14:30:07Z")
Saw it this weekend and here’s my question. Of those that saw it and gave bad reviews, how many say the miniserieses Ms Marvel and Secret Invasion? Both are necessary to understand what’s going on in the film. OK, second question. Why couldn’t Kamala use her hard light powers to block the holes created by the jumppoints? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2023, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/137 "2023-11-20T14:41:03Z")
It’s a hole in space and time. I don’t think one can just insert a giant plug, but who knows? Also: I don’t think _Secret Invasion_ was necessary viewing and I’ve forgotten most of the first Captain Marvel film but yeah, without _Ms Marvel_ a lot of context would be missing. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2023, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/138 "2023-11-20T15:59:22Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Both are necessary to understand what’s going on in the film. I disagree. Secret Invasion was not only completely unnecessary, this movie ignores it completely and even makes some of the plot from that show not make any sense. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2023, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/139 "2023-11-20T16:03:52Z")
I liked it, and only saw Ms. Marvel it its entirety, I gave up a couple episodes into Secret Invasion. I guess I can appreciate the need of some context, but people were panning the film way beyond some lost context. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2023, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837/140 "2023-11-20T16:38:05Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Of those that saw it and gave bad reviews, how many say the miniserieses Ms Marvel and Secret Invasion? The one and only reason I watched it was _because_ I watched _Mr. Marvel_ and am a fan of the character in the comics. Otherwise I would have skipped it like I have 28 other of the MCU movies. This one just confirmed to me that I’m not the audience for most MCU movies. I thought it was terrible, but I probably would have thought most other MCU movies are terrible, too. (I have also skipped the recent DC Universe movies except for the two Shamwow ones. I watched around a third if the first _Wonder Woman_ and switched it off from pure apathy.) As for _Secret Invasion_, I made it through around 1.5 episodes, but _The Marvels_ is set _before_ and was supposed to come out before _Secret Invasion_, so you really aren’t supposed to have seen it first. Meanwhile weekend-to-weekend boxoffice was better than the Friday-to-Friday drop of 87%. That was down only 78%. > **[Like It Or Not, ‘The Marvels’ Has Now Bombed In Every Way Possible](https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2023/11/20/like-it-or-not-the-marvels-has-now-bombed-in-every-way-possible/?sh=44556d20473d)** > > The Marvels is better than it's given credit for, but there is no disputing the numbers, and it's bombed on every single level relative to the rest of the MCU. For the people desperately saying that word of mouth would give it legs, it looks like it is a mute amputee. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-marvels-flop-open-spoilers-after-post-112-ish/992837.md?page=8)