# Will The Republicans ever figure out why they lost? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [December 26, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224 "2012-12-26T21:33:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 103
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2041 "2013-08-07T16:37:08Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > All my nieces and nephews that are straight A students and are finishing college will become the taxpayers that will fund your medicare and social security, you are welcome. And the unemployed natives won’t pay into the system at all. Almost all of the job growth in the last ten years has been importing foreign labor, while native employment has declined. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2042 "2013-08-07T16:43:13Z")
Easy to say with no cites. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2043 "2013-08-07T16:49:33Z")
The opinions expressed here in support of the GOP are precisely why the GOP will not ever understand why they lost in 2012. They spawned and raised a monster that is now eating their party from the inside out. By appealing to the lowest common denominator of their base, they have transformed a party of moderation that once balanced the forces of rampant change-for-the-sake-of-change into a millstone that is dragging down the entire system in its intransigence. Og knows I don’t want the process to develop into a single party tyranny, but having one of the major political parties in the US devoted to anti-intellectualism, racism, sexism and fear of The Other certainly doesn’t seem like a viable solution either. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2044 "2013-08-07T16:53:59Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And the unemployed natives won’t pay into the system at all. Almost all of the job growth in the last ten years has been importing foreign labor, while native employment has declined. As you are forgetting that medicare and other items help the unemployed, you are welcomed again, again, stop depending on the Tea Party pamphleteers, they only omit the big picture to mislead people like you. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2045 "2013-08-07T17:13:34Z")
More low cost labor= lower wages. Not hard to figure out, it’s in the CBO report you cited in another thread. Now if were mainly importing high wage labor, that would be helpful to everyone, and progressive, since it would only reduce the wages of wealthy professionals. As for the cite: > **[Immigrant Gains and Native Losses In the Job Market, 2000 to 2013](https://cis.org/Report/Immigrant-Gains-and-Native-Losses-Job-Market-2000-2013)** > > New analysis of government data shows that all of the net gain in employment over the last 13 years has gone to immigrants. While jobs are always being created and lost, and the number of workers rises and falls with the economy, a new analysis of government data shows that all of the net gain in employment over the last 13 years has gone to immigrants (legal and illegal). From the first quarter of 2000 to the first quarter of 2013, the number of natives working actually fell by 1.3 million while the overall size of the working-age (16 to 65) native population increased by 16.4 million. Over the same time period, the number of immigrants working (legal and illegal) increased by 5.3 million. In addition to the decline in the number of natives working, there has been a broad decline in the percentage holding a job that began before the 2007 recession. This decline has impacted natives of almost every age, race, gender, and education level. The total number of working-age (16 to 65) natives not working — unemployed or out of the labor force entirely — was nearly 59 million in the first quarter of this year, a figure that has changed little in the last three years and is nearly 18 million larger than in 2000. Now this stuff doesn’t bother me much, being a right-winger and all. What I find funny is that it also doesn’t bug the left, mainly because in the end, it’s votes that matter, not the well being of those who vote for them. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2046 "2013-08-07T17:33:53Z")
That is ok, it is precisely why it does not bother you the issue, and the reason why moderates will not vote for you guys in the future. For evidence one has to look at the “insult to ones intelligence” way the house republicans named the de-funding of obamacare and other votes as “job creation”. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2047 "2013-08-07T17:35:24Z")
Since Obamacare is job destroying and the evidence can no longer be denied, yes, Obamacare repeals are job creators. And now you also know why you’re losing white working class voters by a 40 point margin. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2048 "2013-08-07T17:43:02Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Since Obamacare is job destroying and the evidence can no longer be denied Gonna have to help us out a little on that, chum. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2049 "2013-08-07T17:46:08Z")
In case you havent’ kept up on the news, the employer mandate was delayed and even governments and public universities are limiting hours to avoid having to provide health insurance. Oh yeah, it was delayed over “paperwork” concerns. LOL. Nah, the effect on the job market and delaying it until just after the election was just coincidence. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2050 "2013-08-07T17:46:35Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Since Obamacare is job destroying and the evidence can no longer be denied, yes, Obamacare repeals are job creators. > > And now you also know why you’re losing white working class voters by a 40 point margin. Once again you only can do that by depending on the demagogues pamphlets, only by ignoring how the rise in costs has prevented many jobs from coming to America or created is that one can do that misleading calculation of yours here. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2051 "2013-08-07T17:48:12Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > In case you havent’ kept up on the news, the employer mandate was delayed and even governments and public universities are limiting hours to avoid having to provide health insurance. > > Oh yeah, it was delayed over “paperwork” concerns. LOL. Nah, the effect on the job market and delaying it until just after the election was just coincidence. Once again, the truth is that employers requested that delay and Obama helped them, being wrong is just a motto of yours. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2052 "2013-08-07T17:50:10Z")
Denying reality seems to be your MO. The reports of hours limitation is widespread. Your denial is ironic considering you were just going on about climate change denial. Do you only pay attention to empirical evidence when it suits your politics? I’d love to hear your opinion on why working class whites have abandoned the Democratic Party. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2053 "2013-08-07T17:53:53Z")
Piffle, denying reality is what will do the Tea Party and many other Republicans. [http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2013/07/25/2290901/poll-three-quarters-of-young-independent-voters-describe-deniers-as-ignorant-out-of-touch-or-crazy/](http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2013/07/25/2290901/poll-three-quarters-of-young-independent-voters-describe-deniers-as-ignorant-out-of-touch-or-crazy/) > [@](#): > > A new poll has found climate science denialism in Congress is quickly losing favor among young voters, both Republican and Democrat. The poll, conducted by Democratic and Republican firms for the League of Conservation Voters, found 73 percent of respondents associate climate change deniers with words like “ignorant,” “out-of-touch” or “crazy.” Taken on the whole, the loss of white voters is not as dire as you want to make it > **[Poll: Outside the South, Obama's Doing Well With the "White Working Class"](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2012/09/poll-outside-the-south-obama-s-doing-well-with-the-white-working-class.html)** > > Via John Sides (read him, every day), this new study from the Public Religion Research Institute does a lot to correct some lazy ideas about the "white... And no, I saw plenty of empirical evidence that the current irrational health care with items like job lock, retroactive denial of care, extra expenses compared to other nations demonstrate that the ones fighting against reform are in reality the ones \*\*fighting \*\*against the freedoms of Americans. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2054 "2013-08-07T17:54:39Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Since Obamacare is job destroying and the evidence can no longer be denied, yes,\*\* Obamacare repeals are job creators. > \*\* > And now you also know why you’re losing white working class voters by a 40 point margin. Bullshit, Congress does not create jobs and those blaming Obamacare don’t give two shits about their employees, it just gives them an excuse to to not give their employees what they deserve. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2055 "2013-08-07T18:21:32Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Bullshit, Congress does not create jobs and those blaming Obamacare don’t give two shits about their employees, it just gives them an excuse to to not give their employees what they deserve. Didn’t Papa John’s cut hours to prevent their workers from getting healthcare, after giving away two million free pizzas? I seem to remember the average cost of a pizza would have to go up 40¢ or so to cover all of Papa John’s employees in the new health insurance plan. I’m sure the conservatives will point to the onerous burden this places on the economy, consumers, and employers, but to me, that sounds like a pretty damn cheap way to ensure my fellow Americans, and more specifically the people handling my food, are healthy. I get that there are two sides to this issue, but as I’ve posted before, I would gladly pay a tiny bit more for goods and services to ensure every American had health insurance. I’m not gonna bother looking up what a Papa John’s large pizza costs, but let’s say it’s $16. I can handle a 2.5% increase in pizza costs. I bet healthcare would even be free to Papa Johns if they gave away a few less free pizzas, if they’re worried about raising costs. $32 million in market-price free pizzas is a pretty big cut to their bottom-line, surely a more onerous burden than healthcare. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2056 "2013-08-07T18:38:49Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > In case you havent’ kept up on the news, the employer mandate was delayed and even governments and public universities are limiting hours to avoid having to provide health insurance. So, in other words, some organizations were willing to have people work more hours when part of the cost of that labor was offloaded to society (in the form of emergency room visits that might or might not be paid for - which drives up healthcare costs for all), but now that they’re being asked to shoulder some of the burden, “well fuck that bucko!” Sounds about right. ---
**Author:** ![CJJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecc23a/32.png) [@CJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CJJ)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2057 "2013-08-07T18:42:20Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Since Obamacare is job destroying and the evidence can no longer be denied, yes, Obamacare repeals are job creators. > > And now you also know why you’re losing white working class voters by a 40 point margin. Since Obamacare increases the number of minorities who have health insurance and the evidence can no longer be denied, yes, Obamacare repeals are racist. And now you also know why the Republicans are winning white working class voters. The point is that sloganeering is worthless on such a complex issue. Sure, we can play this rhetorical game all day…but do you really want to go there? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2058 "2013-08-07T18:58:03Z")
Dude, **adaher** lives there. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2059 "2013-08-07T19:21:27Z")
Otherwise, he’s homeless… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2060 "2013-08-07T20:08:43Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Otherwise, he’s homeless… In any case, he’s hopeless. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224.md?page=102) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224.md?page=104)