# Will The Republicans ever figure out why they lost? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [December 26, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224 "2012-12-26T21:33:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 113
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2241 "2013-08-15T12:58:08Z")
Ref: Pigs, Bay of. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2242 "2013-08-15T13:01:15Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > And that makes them acceptable? > If they had a country the size of the old U.S.S.R. or China to play with, I’m sure the tolls would be similar. When they had Cambodia they sure did a great job of filling the graves. Acceptable and better than the alternative are two different things. We still follow that policy today, although we haven’t really decided in the Middle East whether the military dictators or the Islamists are preferable. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2243 "2013-08-15T13:02:18Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > You’re joking, right? In what way was not intervening in Cuba worse, or even equivalent, than the Mossadeq/BP fiasco? Iran is what it is today because of US/GB intervention/aggression. And many other countries are democracies today because we either supported their military governments, or overthrew their Marxist governments. For every Iran there are five Chiles. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2244 "2013-08-15T13:24:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And many other countries are democracies today because we either supported their military governments, or overthrew their Marxist governments. For every Iran there are five Chiles. Why thank you, many USA democrats made advertisements that told the Chileans to vote against Pinochet and he lost the referendum that would allowed him to continue to be the dictator of Chile. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2245 "2013-08-15T14:51:50Z")
You act as if Democrats had a different foreign policy from Republicans during the Cold War. far from it. There was practically no daylight between Democrats and Republicans back then on how to handle the Third World. Kennedy and Truman did just as much covert action against unfriendly governments as Nixon and Eisenhower and Reagan. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2246 "2013-08-15T14:58:00Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > You act as if Democrats had a different foreign policy from Republicans during the Cold War. far from it. There was practically no daylight between Democrats and Republicans back then on how to handle the Third World. Kennedy and Truman did just as much covert action against unfriendly governments as Nixon and Eisenhower and Reagan. Of course it was not much different, but eventually it is clear who is trying to make amends and who is trying to sweep everything under the rug. Obama did visit the tomb of Monsignor Romero and he has not cut aid to the Salvadoran government just because it is now under the control of the former rebels right now. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2247 "2013-08-15T15:04:25Z")
Well yes, Democrats apologize more sincerely, that’s very nice of them.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2248 "2013-08-15T16:17:30Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Well yes, Democrats apologize more sincerely, that’s very nice of them.🙂 Aid speaks louder than the cowardice expressed by the ones that call for coups just when there is a whiff of political incorrectness, as one doper said in the past, “democracy is not for sissies”. ---
**Author:** ![Poto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ab992/32.png) [@Poto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Poto)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2249 "2013-08-15T16:44:28Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And while we’re on the subject of Obama’s liberalism, his latest proposal is more tax and spend: > > [http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obama-pushes-ambitious-internet-access-plan/2013/08/13/646bf410-f321-11e2-bdae-0d1f78989e8a\_story.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/obama-pushes-ambitious-internet-access-plan/2013/08/13/646bf410-f321-11e2-bdae-0d1f78989e8a_story.html) > > School internet access by imposing a tax on all consumers of mobile phones. Oh wait, a fee, sorry. > > Get money. Spend money. No real benefits from spent money. This is the type of liberalism that was discredited way back in the 1970s. Every civilized country has equipped their schools with internet. Here states and communities run schools. If Obama wants our schools in the 2000s for technology…our suburban scool already is…what tools does Obama have? Most European countries have gone into a partnership with industry to keep technology and infrastructure up to date. Germany is now winning with inovation. They can’t do it by cutting jobs. Wages were cut in many companies over the slump. Once unemployment is back to normal figures, we will be behind Europe. France will have the first running fusion reactor. Tax and spend does not all go in welfare mom’s pockets. The republicans are losing because cutting taxes does not work as a solution to all ills. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2250 "2013-08-15T16:46:11Z")
And speaking of the subject at hand, just in case one thinks that this issue of coups in Latin America is not relevant one has to remember clowns like DeMint and Mitch McConnell. [http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1009/27862.html](http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1009/27862.html) > [@](#): > > DeMint’s trip to Honduras has drawn fire from Democrats, who are concerned because of his position on the government coup. Senate Foreign Relations Committee Chairman John Kerry blocked his mission this week. But the trip was then approved by Senate GOP leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.). The point is that indeed, there are is a lot of stupid and undemocratic behavior coming from the Republicans nowadays, and it is one piece of the narrative that explains why the Republicans lost. Romney also supported that twisted old cold war mentality regarding military coups in Latin America. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2251 "2013-08-22T16:48:02Z")
> [@Poto](#): > > France will have the first running fusion reactor. On what grounds do you assume the **possibility** of a fusion reactor? ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2252 "2013-08-22T21:08:06Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > On what grounds do you assume the **possibility** of a fusion reactor? I don’t care who gets to it first if they can pull off a fusion reactor. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2253 "2013-08-22T21:13:58Z")
> [@Poto](#): > > The republicans are losing because cutting taxes does not work as a solution to all ills. And Democrats lost starting in the 1980s, because they thought government was a solution to all ills but often made problems worse. The Republicans lost in 2012. I am not convinced that the Republicans are “losing”. Talk to me after this November, or better yet, the November after. As for why they lost in 2012, there were many factors, any one of which might not be a problem in 2014 or 2016. And since the election was close, if any one of those factors doesn’t go the Democrats’ way as well as it did in 2012, the GOP wins. One of those factors being unusually high turnout by young people and minorities, and unusually high margins for the Democrats among those groups. If either turnout drops, or those groups go back to supporting Republicans at historical levels, the GOP is in good shape. Which is why I’ll be watching the exit polling in Virginia and New Jersey this November very closely. Who votes and in what numbers is going to tell us more about the state of the parties than the final results in those particular races. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2013, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2254 "2013-08-22T22:21:41Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And Democrats lost starting in the 1980s, because they thought government was a solution to all ills but often made problems worse. > > The Republicans lost in 2012. I am not convinced that the Republicans are “losing”. Talk to me after this November, or better yet, the November after. Please do not compare 1 data point to multiple ones If you are going to make some kind of a point, take the last 10 years of Congress and White House control vs. the 10 years in the 80’s. The Republicans lost and are losing. 10 years ago, they had all 3 branches of government, for the last 4 years, they’ve had 1, and 1 election was won by massive gerrymandering whereupon the Dems got a million more votes and still lost. And you can’t even claim the Dems are losing because they’ve upped their numbers in both the Senate and House from the last election vs. 2010, albeit by small amounts. In the 80’s, taking the 96th-100th Congresses (1979-1989) you had Republican presidents, 6 years of Republican Senate control in the middle, and a Dem House. People wanted government help, especially after seeing what kind of dog-eat-dog world the GOP thrust upon them, and went back early next decade to either a Dem House or Senate with Bill Clinton as president. So even if the Dems started losing in the 1980’s, they righted the ship by the end of the decade. > [@adaher](#): > > As for why they lost in 2012, there were many factors, any one of which might not be a problem in 2014 or 2016 LOL! There’s ALWAYS “many” factors, there’s never one single reason an election is lost. But the indisputable factors are demographic changes, the loss of the traditional Republican base, increased immigration, and the continual polarization of the extremist Republicans and infighting. Any one of those things can affect an election greatly. Taking all of them together along with the not-easily-corrected generational changes that are affecting voters and you have a perfect storm of liberal voters. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2013, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2255 "2013-08-23T00:19:42Z")
What \*\*YogSosoth \*\*said, and on the coming elections front: Funny to see \*\*adaher \*\*wanting to just look at exit polls, the current ones are not good. The gender gap is growing in Virginia, because Cuccinelli does the typically stupid shooting of their own foot as Republicans are so prone to do this days. [http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2013/08/21/214224092/gender-gap-doesnt-budge-in-virginia-governors-race](http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2013/08/21/214224092/gender-gap-doesnt-budge-in-virginia-governors-race) > [@](#): > > Here’s one takeaway from a released Wednesday: Republicans have their hands full if they hope to close the gender gap in the Virginia governor’s race. > > The poll of likely voters reports that Democrat Terry McAuliffe has a 6-percentage-point overall lead in his contest with Republican Ken Cuccinelli. > > The survey put McAuliffe’s lead among female voters, however, at twice that — 12 points. > [@](#): > > Cuccinelli is likely hurt by the Republican Party’s typical weakness with female voters, though his issue positions and actions probably haven’t helped and have given his Democratic opponents something to work with. > > For instance, Cuccinelli was one of only three state attorneys general who didn’t sign a letter asking Congress to renew the Violence Against Women Act. Virginia Democrats . Of course a single issue will not do, but Cuccinelli is still shooting himself in the \*\*other \*\*foot with his climate science denialism. > **[New McAuliffe ad highlights Cuccinelli's record on science](https://augustafreepress.com/news/new-mcauliffe-ad-highlights-cuccinellis-record-on-science/)** > > Virginia gubernatorial candidate Terry McAuliffe has released a new television ad highlighting Ken Cuccinelli's attacks on University of Virginia climate scientist Michael Mann. > [@](#): > > The new McAuliffe ad recounts the ideological witch hunt Ken Cuccinelli launched in 2010 against Michael Mann, a climate scientist then at the University of Virginia, for pursuing research with which Cuccinelli did not agree. The investigation, driven by Cuccinelli’s extreme anti-science agenda, was deemed baseless by the Virginia Supreme Court and cost the University of Virginia nearly $600,000 in legal fees. > > “Terry McAuliffe supports the critical research our scientists are doing all across Virginia. This work will ensure Virginia pursues a renewable and clean energy future, strengthen our economy, and protect Virginia’s economic competitiveness in the 21st Century,” said Jim Dillard, former Republican Chairman of the Virginia House of Delegates’ Education Committee and member of the Virginia League of Conservation Voters. “We need a governor who encourages this innovative work, not someone who puts his own ideological agenda ahead of what Virginia’s economy needs.” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2013, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2256 "2013-08-23T01:14:26Z")
**Some** Pubs get it. [Chad Brown, the co-chairman of the Polk County, Iowa, GOP just resigned, and registered as an independent, over Steve King’s “immigrant drug-mule” remarks, and over the GOP’s positions on gun control and climate change.](http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/iowa-gop-county-chairman-resigns-says-party-headed) > [@Chad Brown](#): > > In 2012, the Polk GOP lost Polk County by over 32,000 votes. Until 2002, Republicans were elected to the State House from Des Moines. In 2012, Republicans lost 2 State House seats in suburban, Republican-leaning districts and came two dozen votes from losing a third. Facts are stubborn things. I think we are now headed in the wrong direction on several fronts and regretfully must step aside. > > It’s my opinion that rather than fix the problems that led to such a massive 2012 defeat, the GOP does not seem to seriously want to fix the issues. I think helping a dysfunctional Party that does not want to address its problems is enabling. I do not believe in enabling. I debated this for weeks and am certain this is the only course. But the problem is, apparently, any Republican who does figure out why they lost . . . can no longer be a Republican. The party has gone too far to save. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2013, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2257 "2013-08-23T01:24:10Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > . > > LOL! There’s ALWAYS “many” factors, there’s never one single reason an election is lost. But the indisputable factors are demographic changes, the loss of the traditional Republican base, increased immigration, and the continual polarization of the extremist Republicans and infighting. Any one of those things can affect an election greatly. Taking all of them together along with the not-easily-corrected generational changes that are affecting voters and you have a perfect storm of liberal voters. Problem is, the same argument was made in 1976. Young people then became more conservative and an extremist Republican got elected President. Only takes one Democratic screwup President for young people to switch allegiances. It’s happening again. Notice how all of a sudden Obama’s shifting to college costs? He sees the same polls. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2013, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2258 "2013-08-23T02:14:13Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Problem is, the same argument was made in 1976. Young people then became more conservative and an extremist Republican got elected President. Only takes one Democratic screwup President for young people to switch allegiances. It’s happening again. Notice how all of a sudden Obama’s shifting to college costs? He sees the same polls. As pointed before, that is not the only factor, and I have see that while it is true that Obama has lost ground with the Young people, the reports I have seen tell us that the young dislike the Republicans even more. Again, the overall picture is that more than a single issue is affecting the Republicans negatively. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2013, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2259 "2013-08-23T02:21:52Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > As pointed before, that is not the only factor, and I have see that while it is true that Obama has lost ground with the Young people, the reports I have seen tell us that the young dislike the Republicans even more. And worse, [those young Republicans who exist can’t make any headway with the old guard](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/17/magazine/can-the-republicans-be-saved-from-obsolescence.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0). > [@](#): > > It was not long after the election that elder statesmen of the G.O.P. began offering assurances that all would soon be right. But younger Republicans were not buying it. On Dec. 6, Moffatt addressed an audience of party digital specialists at the R.N.C.’s Capitol Hill Club. Moffatt spoke confidently about how, among other things, the Romney digital team had pretty much all the same tools the Obama campaign possessed. Bret Jacobson was shocked when he read about Moffatt’s claim the next day. “That’s like saying, ‘This Potemkin village will bring us all prosperity!’ ” Jacobson told me. “There’s something to be said for putting on a happy face — except when it makes you sound like Baghdad Bob.” > > \ > > Equally galling to younger Republicans was the op-ed Stuart Stevens wrote in The Washington Post on Nov. 28. In it, Romney’s top strategist struck an unrepentant tone, proudly noting that the candidate “carried the majority of middle-class voters” and that the party therefore “must be doing something right.” From her office near the Capitol, Kristen Soltis Anderson, a 28-year-old G.O.P. pollster, tried not to come unglued. “But you didn’t win the election,” she told me she thought at the time. “I’m really glad you scored that touchdown in the third quarter, I am — but you lost the game!” > > \ > > Many young conservatives also said that technological innovation runs at cross-purposes with the party’s corporate rigidity. “There’s a feeling that Republican politics are more hierarchical than in the Democratic Party,” Ben Domenech, a 31-year-old blogger and research fellow at the libertarian Heartland Institute, told me. “There are always elders at the top who say, ‘That’s not important.’ And that’s where the left has beaten us, by giving smart people the space and trusting them to have success. It’s a fundamentally anti-entrepreneurial model we’ve embraced.” unheeded as the clever if somewhat lonely guy who told them so. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2013, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/2260 "2013-08-23T03:53:47Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > As pointed before, that is not the only factor, and I have see that while it is true that Obama has lost ground with the Young people, the reports I have seen tell us that the young dislike the Republicans even more. > > Again, the overall picture is that more than a single issue is affecting the Republicans negatively. Yet they still win or stay close, so they don’t have to solve all of even most of them to win in 2014 or 2016. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224.md?page=112) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224.md?page=114)