# Will The Republicans ever figure out why they lost? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [December 26, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224 "2012-12-26T21:33:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 92
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2013, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1821 "2013-07-27T15:45:46Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Oh yeah, we just hate people, that’s why we laud successful people regardless of their race, sex, etc. You mean like how you laud successful people like, oh, the current President of the United States? I know I’ve been real impressed with all the accolades you and the rest of the conservatives have showered him with, despite his being black and a Democrat. What’s that? At least one of those things precludes him from being lauded despite his obvious success? Which one and why is that? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2013, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1822 "2013-07-27T18:38:53Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > You mean like how you laud successful people like, oh, the current President of the United States? And George Soros. They love him! ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2013, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1823 "2013-07-27T18:40:10Z")
> [@user\_hostile (addressing WillFarnaby)](#): > > What kind of abuses are we talking about? Perhaps you should declare the causes which would impel them to the separation. The Federal government wastes resources on irrelevant trivia like eradicating smallpox. They print banknotes, a service obviously better left to entrepreneurs: consumers should decide whether or not Wells Fargo Dollars trade at a discount to Citibank Dollars without confusion from the corrupt and unconstitutional Federal Reserve Dollars. I think Farnaby considers himself a moderate (:eek:) and would disagree with Mr. Rod7, who would let individuals choose which police and judges to use, and to select highways which have the private traffic laws that the given individual prefers. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2013, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1824 "2013-07-27T19:52:49Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > We hate underachievers, that much is probably true. Well, that’s pretty shameful all by itself, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1825 "2013-07-27T20:18:04Z")
> [@user\_hostile](#): > > What kind of abuses are we talking about? Perhaps you should declare the causes which would impel them to the separation. Attempted conscription, overly burdensome taxation of a particular region, attempted nationalization of property. These are some scenarios under which I would support secession. As I said before I don’t support secession, but only the legal acceptance of secession under certain conditions. The threat of secession would be an adequate check on federal power. As it is, the people have no check on federal power. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2013, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1826 "2013-07-27T21:08:40Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Attempted conscription, overly burdensome taxation of a particular region, attempted nationalization of property. These are some scenarios under which I would support secession. As I said before I don’t support secession, but only the legal acceptance of secession under certain conditions. The threat of secession would be an adequate check on federal power. As it is, the people have no check on federal power. Are you saying that the people can’t vote anymore? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2013, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1827 "2013-07-27T23:28:29Z")
It appears to me that the Republican strategy in previous elections was to play to its devoted base, which has become more and more radicalized by such influences as the Tea Party. Since the GOP is aware that they can’t win an election with only their true believers who make up about 30-35% of the electorate, they have attempted to expand their base. The results have been mixed at best. To \*\*adaher \*\*and the other GOP proponents in this debate: What strategy or strategies would you employ to expand the GOP’s base? What has the GOP done well since the last election in terms of attracting voters? What has it done that has alienated potential voters? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1828 "2013-07-28T02:19:12Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > If only Democrats would be as up front about their socialist tendencies as the liberal Dopers. We’d never have to ask why we lost elections because we’d never lose. [Socialism is more popular in the U.S. than you think.](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/29/young-people-socialism_n_1175218.html) (Or at least the **word** is.) But the [Democratic Party is actually very limited in “socialist tendencies.”](http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Democratic_party#Internal_factions) > [@](#): > > **Internal factions** > > While the Democrats have a substantial liberal wing among the public at large, the party’s inability to coordinate itself properly results in a political platform that consists of rolling over to Republican schemes and failing to provide effective leadership. The sectarian violence appears below. > > **Progressive Democrats** > European-styled social democrats. In the House they are organized in the Congressional Progressive Caucus (CPC), the largest in the House of Representatives. Some are descendants of the New Left: > > - Sherrod Brown > - Howard Dean > - Keith Ellison > - Russ Feingold (the only Senator to vote against the original manifestation of \* the PATRIOT Act) > - Barney Frank > - Dennis Kucinich > - Barbara Lee > - Jim McDermott > - Cynthia McKinney > - Bernie Sanders (self-described socialist; not a Democrat, but caucuses with them) > - Pete Stark (the first openly atheist member of Congress[4]) > > **Traditional liberals** > Constitute half of the voter base, and take pain to avoid infighting between the separate Democratic coalitions. Centre-left, and don’t share many differences with the progressives anyway: > > - Joe Biden > - Barbara Boxer > - Kirsten Gillibrand > - The Kennedys > - John Kerry > - Nancy Pelosi > - Jay Rockefeller > - Elizabeth Warren > - Anthony Weiner > > **New Democrats** > The Third Way moderates. They’ve increased their clout since the Dems’ neoliberal exploits since the 90s. Roughly equivalent to the British New Labour. Represented by the New Democrat Coalition (an affiliate of the Democratic Leadership Council): > > - The Clintons > - John Edwards > - Dianne Feinstein > - Al Gore > - Joe Lieberman (independent since 2006) > \*\*\* Some random black guy[5] \*\* > - Harry Reid > - Debbie Wasserman Schultz > > **Blue Dogs** > Here’s where the shit starts to break out. Those in the Blue Dog Coalition are often accused of being DINOs, siding with conservative thought whenever they wish, most commonly on social issues and deficit hawkery. Officially they are a coalition in the House but a few ideologically aligned Senators are listed as well. They’re typically elected in Jesusland, and are considered flaming lefties there: > > - Joe Donnelly > - Mary Landrieu > - Gabrielle Giffords > - Joe Manchin > - Ben Nelson > - Collin Peterson > - Heath Shuler > > **Dixiecrat leftovers and boll weevils** > To the right of the Blue Dogs. Not a significant feature in the party anymore, although occasionally one will turn up here and there as a failed Senate candidate, or a centrist Democrat will go haywire and swing far to the right.[6] > > - Virgil Goode (left the Democrats in 2000, was the Constitution Party presidential nominee in 2012) > - Zell Miller > > **Random populists** > These often vote with the progressive and traditional liberal wings of the party, but have their conservative quirky bits. Not easily categorized elsewhere: > > - Jon Tester > - Jim Webb > > **The libertarians** > Yes, they exist too, probably upset about Dubya’s stance on civil liberties and the Republicans’ constant juggling between pro-business interests and the Religious Right: > > - Mike Gravel > - There is also an erstwhile “Democratic Freedom Caucus” influenced by Georgism whose actual influence in the party is negligible Not even the “Progressive Democrats” fit the bill – they’re mostly what Euros would call social democrats, not socialists. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1829 "2013-07-28T03:08:27Z")
That’s their public positioning. Thus my statement, if only they’d be as upfront. I do agree that socialists have less representation than their supporters would warrant. But I also think that most socialists are willing to tolerate deception on the part of the candidates they favor. It’s that little secret between socialists and candidates like Liz Warren. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1830 "2013-07-28T03:14:07Z")
Do be sure to check under your bed and see that there aren’t any socialists under there. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1831 "2013-07-28T03:28:07Z")
I don’t need to. Socialism is outlawed by the US Constitution. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1832 "2013-07-28T03:33:02Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > That’s their public positioning. Thus my statement, if only they’d be as upfront. I do agree that socialists have less representation than their supporters would warrant. But I also think that most socialists are willing to tolerate deception on the part of the candidates they favor. It’s that little secret between socialists and candidates like Liz Warren. In other words, according to you, nearly everyone who doesn’t agree with you is a liar, deceiving not only other voters and other candidates, but deceiving themselves. Also, they willfully tolerate and promulgate deception in order to infiltrate the ranks of government representation. Your post is quite possibly the most delusional thing you’ve yet written. I wouldn’t bet that it will forever be the most delusional thing you’ll post here, tho; you seem to always find a way to be more fallible all the time. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1833 "2013-07-28T03:33:34Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I don’t need to. Socialism is outlawed by the US Constitution. Where? The word isn’t even in the Constitution. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1834 "2013-07-28T03:43:15Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I don’t need to. Socialism is outlawed by the US Constitution. No, it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1835 "2013-07-28T03:44:41Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Where? The word isn’t even in the Constitution. The word had not even been **coined** in 1789. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1836 "2013-07-28T03:44:52Z")
The outlawing of private ownership of industry is most definitely unconstitutional. And let’s not be simplistic here. The word ‘abortion’ isn’t in the Constitution either. But guess what is there? The 9th amendment. Our rights are not limited to what is in the Constitution. The government’s power is limited, however. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1837 "2013-07-28T03:47:08Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The outlawing of private ownership of industry is most definitely unconstitutional. > > And let’s not be simplistic here. The word ‘abortion’ isn’t in the Constitution either. But guess what is there? The 9th amendment. Our rights are not limited to what is in the Constitution. The government’s power is limited, however. If you think _that’s_ Socialism, then stop bitching about welfare, food stamps, Social Security, Medicare, WIC and so on. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1838 "2013-07-28T03:48:29Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I don’t need to. Socialism is outlawed by the US Constitution. You are not even wrong, socialists parties were ans are not prohibited from being in the ballot, they are also not prohibited from being elected to office. > **[List of elected socialist mayors in the United States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_elected_socialist_mayors_in_the_United_States)** > > The following is a list of mayors who have declared themselves to be socialists or have been a member of a socialist party in the United States. > In 1911, one author estimated that there were twenty-eight such mayors and in 1913 another author estimated thirty-four. In 1967, however, James Weinstein's table of "Cities and Towns Electing Socialist Mayors or Other Major Municipal Officers, 1911–1920" counted 74 such municipalities in 1911 and 32 in 1913, with smaller peaks in 1915 (22) and 1917 (1... > **[Bernie Sanders](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Sanders)** > > Bernard Sanders (born September 8, 1941) is an American politician and activist who is the senior United States senator from Vermont. He is the longest-serving independent in U.S. congressional history, but maintains a close relationship with the Democratic Party, having caucused with House and Senate Democrats for most of his congressional career and sought the party's presidential nomination in 2016 and 2020. Sanders has been viewed as the leader of the modern American progressive moveme... So they were not and are not outlawed, even so, after having some traction in the past century, nowadays they are at the fringe, and not driving much of the policies (If that was the case then we already would had single payer in the USA) And then public schools, publicly maintained roads, electrification to rural areas and the majority of NATO member nations could all be considered socialist programs or entities. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1839 "2013-07-28T03:51:55Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I don’t need to. Socialism is outlawed by the US Constitution. Holy shit you already topped yourself! ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2013, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224/1840 "2013-07-28T03:52:34Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > If you think _that’s_ Socialism, then stop bitching about welfare, food stamps, Social Security, Medicare, WIC and so on. Those aren’t socialism. That’s social democracy. Socialism is government control of major industries and it was flirted with in Western nations in the immediate postwar era. Nowadays it’s completely discredited, of course. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224.md?page=91) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-republicans-ever-figure-out-why-they-lost/645224.md?page=93)