# Will the Tesla Model 3 revolutionize Amercan driving? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 30, 2015, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537 "2015-07-30T00:07:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/361 "2015-10-07T00:08:13Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Ladies and gentlemen, we have achieved peak goofy assertion. uh huh. Name one thing his company has designed or built that is remotely difficult on an engineering basis. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/362 "2015-10-07T00:55:30Z")
He produced the best reviewed car in history. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/363 "2015-10-07T01:11:44Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > He produced the best reviewed car in history. Aside from the fact that statement is meaningless it doesn’t answer my question. What has Tesla done that is an engineering achievement? That should be an easy question to answer if Tesla produced “the best reviewed car in history”. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/364 "2015-10-07T01:13:38Z")
Building a nearly flawless car is an exercise in… Healthcare? Physics? Music? No, it is an engineering achievement. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/365 "2015-10-07T03:01:19Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Building a nearly flawless car is an exercise in… Healthcare? Physics? Music? > > No, it is an engineering achievement. So, you can’t point to anything spiffy that they invented and have resorted to the Chevy Volt argument. It’s the world’s greatest car ever. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/366 "2015-10-07T03:30:46Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > So, you can’t point to anything spiffy that they invented and have resorted to the Chevy Volt argument. It’s the world’s greatest car ever. You asked for engineering. That doesn’t mean invention - it means innovation. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/367 "2015-10-07T04:07:40Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > You asked for engineering. That doesn’t mean invention - it means innovation. So we’re now down to defining words. No chance of anyone posting an innovation, invention, or engineering work of note. So far we’ve established it’s the most awesome car in the universe (next to the Volt of course). ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/368 "2015-10-07T10:27:07Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > So we’re now down to defining words. No chance of anyone posting an innovation, invention, or engineering work of note. > > So far we’ve established it’s the most awesome car in the universe (next to the Volt of course). As much as I’m down on them, they implemented good cell management software to get better performance out of batteries that aren’t anything special. I’m not up to speed on the background, so maybe you’ll tell me they borrowed that from elsewhere. If not, I will concede an engineering achievement, and an important one. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/369 "2015-10-07T10:39:52Z")
**Magiver** , making a car is literally the work of automotive engineering. It isn’t an argument over definitions, it is literally the meaning of the word. As for why you don’t think the Model S is almost certainly the best reviewed car in history, it isn’t worth arguing with you about it because you literally change the subject to the Volt in 80% of your posts in this thread. It’s like the Benghazi “let’s parachute motorcycles into a warzone” obsession all over again. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/370 "2015-10-07T10:42:59Z")
Well, it seems like the company has succeeded in designing a touch-screen interface for a car that people actually like. Check out the reviews for my Ford touch (or whatever they call it) for comparison. And the GM touchscreen interface US even more annoying, too judge by the experience of my volt-driving friend. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/371 "2015-10-07T21:46:42Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > **Magiver** , making a car is literally the work of automotive engineering. It isn’t an argument over definitions, it is literally the meaning of the word. yet you can’t cough up a single example of engineering work that is noteworthy. So I’ll say it again, Tesla has not produced anything of note that other manufacturers have. When electric cars become popular they will be bulldozed over by the major car manufacturers who have the capital and the engineering to deal with it. When you get over your love affair with them you’ll understand that. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/372 "2015-10-07T21:50:03Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Well, it seems like the company has succeeded in designing a touch-screen interface for a car that people actually like. Check out the reviews for my Ford touch (or whatever they call it) for comparison. And the GM touchscreen interface US even more annoying, too judge by the experience of my volt-driving friend. Yes, and that’s along the lines of what I asked for. It’s nothing beyond any other car manufacturer’s engineering skill but there is something to be said for good ergonomics. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/373 "2015-10-07T22:22:11Z")
I’ve been refraining from answering since I don’t think the question was asked honestly, but I will say this. Good engineering isn’t reductionist. Instead, it’s about the quality and function of the entire product. If anything, fantastic engineering is anything _but_ notable: when you can look at any individual component, and see that the arrived at solution was so simple and obvious that anyone should have been capable of replicating it, then you are probably looking at a well-engineered system. The signals of Tesla’s excellent engineering cannot then be pointed out individually. Doing so, you miss the forest for the trees. The Model S is well-regarded and for good reason, and so far, other manufacturers have been unwilling or unable to replicate it. The fact that every individual component uses straightforward engineering principles tells you nothing by itself. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/374 "2015-10-07T23:27:40Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > yet you can’t cough up a single example of engineering work that is noteworthy. > > So I’ll say it again, Tesla has not produced anything of note that other manufacturers have. It is faster than quite a few cars costing eight times as much while seating 5 people instead of two, and it has ten times the luggage space of those supercars. Which other car has that? ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/375 "2015-10-08T00:53:06Z")
Magiver you honestly can’t think of any noteworthy engineering achievements? What about an electric car with [3 times the range of the car in #2](http://www.cheatsheet.com/automobiles/top-10-electric-vehicles-with-the-longest-driving-range.html/?a=viewall)? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/376 "2015-10-08T02:21:53Z")
Tesla has not produced anything of note that other manufacturers have. I don’t know what is so hard about this sentence. When these cars become popular Tesla will not have the resources to keep up. They can’t deal with the low volume they have now. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/377 "2015-10-08T02:23:26Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Magiver you honestly can’t think of any noteworthy engineering achievements? What about an electric car with [3 times the range of the car in #2](http://www.cheatsheet.com/automobiles/top-10-electric-vehicles-with-the-longest-driving-range.html/?a=viewall)? It’s a car with more batteries. There is no engineering efficiency that gives it an edge. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/378 "2015-10-08T03:14:32Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > It’s a car with more batteries. There is no engineering efficiency that gives it an edge. So because it could have been created if someone tried hard enough, the act of creation is meaningless? That’s a particularly silly way to think of things. “I built the highest building in the world!” “So, it uses beams and windows. No innovations.” :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/379 "2015-10-08T05:02:04Z")
They’re putting out an SUV model that has surprisingly good safety ratings, considering the floor is a giant, flammable battery. That implies some armor engineering. It’s a bizarre question, though, coming after the amazing reports from _Consumer Reports._ Tesla builds cars established car companies didn’t want to build, and at a price point other companies don’t want to sell at, and they sell them faster than they can make them. That’s not a failure. That’s good business success, even if they are a niche product for now. Petrol-burning engines were a niche product once, too. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2015, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/380 "2015-10-08T13:20:20Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > So because it could have been created if someone tried hard enough, the act of creation is meaningless? > > That’s a particularly silly way to think of things. > > “I built the highest building in the world!” > > “So, it uses beams and windows. No innovations.” I’m 99 and 44/100ths percent sure that **Magiver** is applying a “no true Scotsman” test to what constitutes an engineering innovation, but it makes me even more curious as to what he thinks constitutes an engineering innovation. So help us out, **Magiver** , give us a few examples of recent automaker engineering innovations that count in your book. ETA: And I’m not asking about hypothetical innovations, like “If Tesla had included a fusion reactor, that would count.” I would like to know what Ford/GM/BMW/Toyota/etc have done in recent times that counts as an engineering innovation in your mind. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537.md?page=20)