# Will the Tesla Model 3 revolutionize Amercan driving?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [July 30, 2015, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537 "2015-07-30T00:07:51Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 7
### Author:  [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)
#### Post date: [August 5, 2015, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/121 "2015-08-05T22:02:50Z")
Every vehicle has trade offs. You aren’t doing to find a vehicle that is large enough to haul a softball team, easy to park, low gas mileage, super-safe, fun to drive, low maintenance, affordable, good the snow, good off-road, fast, luxuriously appointed, etc.
Everyone chooses. Nobody gets a car that does it all.
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [August 28, 2015, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/122 "2015-08-28T19:29:07Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#):
>
> Assuming it lives up to its promises.
[Some of them, apparently.](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-08-27/tesla-with-insane-mode-busts-curve-on-consumer-reports-ratings-idu1hfk0)
> [@](#):
>
> This score is kind of insane.
>
> Tesla Motors Inc.’s all-wheel-drive version of the battery-powered Model S, the P85D, earned a 103 out of a possible 100 in an evaluation by Consumer Reports magazine.
>
> The combination of power and efficiency was so off-the-chart that the group had to recalibrate its ratings methods “to account for the car’s exceptionally strong performance,” according to a statement. Ultimately, the car was given a score of 100 that set a new standard for perfection.
>
> The Tesla sedan is the quickest Consumer Reports ever tested, accelerating to 60 miles (97 kilometers) per hour from a stop in 3.5 seconds using the car’s “insane mode.” (Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk has since released an even-faster “ludicrous mode.”) The P85D is a high-performance, all-wheel-drive version of the all-electric Model S that achieved the equivalent of 87 miles per gallon of gasoline.
Now the bad news:
> [@](#):
>
> The starting price for a P85D is $105,000.
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### Author:  [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)
#### Post date: [August 28, 2015, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/123 "2015-08-28T19:43:57Z")
Yes, that’s a lot of money. But I think if you compare the price against a Mercedes S-class sedan, or a Lexus LS600 or the flagship sedan of any other company, it’s not that outrageous.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [August 28, 2015, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/124 "2015-08-28T22:45:10Z")
> [@bengangmo](#):
>
> Do they?
>
> As a second car in a family situation 300 mile range with overnight charging should be more than enough right?
>
> Or I could imagine “fast charge” for two hours while at the mall working equally well in a family situation.
>
> I saw an article recently where somebody with a long term test of the Tesla tried to take it road tripping - with rather poor results.
>
> However - if it’s the family second car, with maybe an SUV or similar also in the family for longer trips then it could work out well
it needs to charge in 2 minutes. When that happens it’s a game changer. People don’t spend $35 grand on a 2nd car so they can drive to a select number of locations with chargers and wait 2 hrs. The Volt is already a long distance vehicle and you can’t give them away.
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### Author:  [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)
#### Post date: [August 28, 2015, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/125 "2015-08-28T22:50:09Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> it needs to charge in 2 minutes. When that happens it’s a game changer. People don’t spend $35 grand on a 2nd car so they can drive to a select number of locations with chargers and wait 2 hrs. The Volt is already a long distance vehicle and you can’t give them away.
it’s a perfect second car. We have one car for trips over 100 miles and a Volt for commuting and errands around town. I go weeks without ever entering gas mode and I only have a 35 to 40 mile electric range. If I had a Tesla, and I will some day, I would be comfortable charging it overnight.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [August 28, 2015, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/126 "2015-08-28T23:36:36Z")
> [@Procrustus](#):
>
> it’s a perfect second car. We have one car for trips over 100 miles and a Volt for commuting and errands around town. I go weeks without ever entering gas mode and I only have a 35 to 40 mile electric range. If I had a Tesla, and I will some day, I would be comfortable charging it overnight.
Volt sales are extremely poor. It’s not up for debate. When electric cars can be charged in 2 minutes they will replace gasoline cars overnight. It won’t be a subtle change.
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### Author:  [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)
#### Post date: [August 28, 2015, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/127 "2015-08-28T23:55:21Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> Volt sales are extremely poor. It’s not up for debate. When electric cars can be charged in 2 minutes they will replace gasoline cars overnight. It won’t be a subtle change.
I agree Volt sales are extremely poor. I disagree that it has anything to do with charging times. The car only seats four, it is a bit pricey, it is very poorly marketed, and it isn’t designed for frequent trips over 50 miles or so. [It can operate forever in gas mode, but there are better cars if you want to run on gas.] In other words, it’s not for everyone. But for many people, it’s a perfect car. It’s well designed, a pleasure to drive, and I’m getting 230 mpg.
A Tesla would not have many of the same limitations, and I can’t imagine charging times to be much of a factor in whether to buy one or not. Remember, you’re starting every day with a “full tank.” With a gas engine, you drive for a few days or more, then go to a gas station to fill up when you’re down to 1/4 tank or so. So, you care how long it takes to fill your tank. Charging overnight at home, on the other hand, is easy and painless. It takes about 10 seconds when you arrive home. If you never drive more than 250 miles in a day (which I can say is probably true for many people) you don’t have to give a second thought to charging duration.
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### Author:  [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/128 "2015-08-29T03:10:52Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> it needs to charge in 2 minutes. When that happens it’s a game changer. People don’t spend $35 grand on a 2nd car so they can drive to a select number of locations with chargers and wait 2 hrs. The Volt is already a long distance vehicle and you can’t give them away.
I understand what you’re saying but I don’t think it necessary to have 2-minute chargers. If people can easily charge their cars at home (and maybe at work) then 95% of the problem goes away. (I’d love to be able to park, plug the car in, and never worry about going to the gas station.) The remaining issue would be drives \> 200-300 miles in a single day; how many people do that?
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### Author:  [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/129 "2015-08-29T15:44:52Z")
Here is the problem that electric car enthusiasts don’t seem to understand: That “5%” of the problem is _100%_ of the problem when it’s your 5%.
Leave aside the fact that I heavily doubt Elon Musk’s numbers in the first place. My opinion of the man could go lower, but he’d really have to work at it. Let’s leave aside the fact that the economics make this a very expensive commuter car in the first place. Let’s leave aside the fact that.
Let’s bring this down to one thing. You don’t need to go that far _until you do_. I know more than one person who drives those kind of distances regularly for personal or work purposes. I’ve done it from time to time. Do you know what I did with the last car that met 95% of my needs? I left it on the lot and didn’t take a second glance. My car meets 100% of my needs, or I’m not going to buy it.
The response of the Electric Car Enthusiast is for me to change my life around in such a way that I can buy an electric car. My response (the one which can be printed here, anyway), is for the Electric Car Enthusiast to either put up a model which can meet my needs, when I want them, at my convenience, on my budget - or kindly rethink their position.
Things like technical challenges, economic cost, and consumer convenience cannot be handwaved away, no matter how much you would like them to begone from this world.
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### Author:  [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/130 "2015-08-29T16:00:15Z")
No, “the response of the Electric Car Enthusiast” is to understand that an electric car isn’t for you. Many people don’t drive long distances regularly for personal or work purposes. Many people own two cars, so if they have to, they can use their gas car.
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### Author:  [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/131 "2015-08-29T16:18:56Z")
While there may be some drawbacks for some people with electric cars, there are also some significant advantages for others. Great performance, less maintenance, zero emissions, and NO GAS. I buy “green power” from my electric company, and I actually feel like I’m making a bit of a difference. Thus, you’re not getting 100% of what you can have with any one type of car.
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### Author:  [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/132 "2015-08-29T16:20:31Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#):
>
> Here is the problem that electric car enthusiasts don’t seem to understand: That “5%” of the problem is _100%_ of the problem when it’s your 5%.
>
> Leave aside the fact that I heavily doubt Elon Musk’s numbers in the first place. My opinion of the man could go lower, but he’d really have to work at it. Let’s leave aside the fact that the economics make this a very expensive commuter car in the first place. Let’s leave aside the fact that.
>
> Let’s bring this down to one thing. You don’t need to go that far _until you do_. I know more than one person who drives those kind of distances regularly for personal or work purposes. I’ve done it from time to time. Do you know what I did with the last car that met 95% of my needs? I left it on the lot and didn’t take a second glance. My car meets 100% of my needs, or I’m not going to buy it.
>
> The response of the Electric Car Enthusiast is for me to change my life around in such a way that I can buy an electric car. My response (the one which can be printed here, anyway), is for the Electric Car Enthusiast to either put up a model which can meet my needs, when I want them, at my convenience, on my budget - or kindly rethink their position.
>
> Things like technical challenges, economic cost, and consumer convenience cannot be handwaved away, no matter how much you would like them to begone from this world.
I bet you also think Zip Cars are a bad idea.
Except around here, people use them all the time. I know quite a few people whose only access to a vehicle is through a Zip Car. These people are happy, and it works for them.
People do not all live like you. People have different vehicle needs. And some people are perfectly happy with vehicle situations you consider inferior.
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### Author:  [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/133 "2015-08-29T16:49:01Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#):
>
> Do you know what I did with the last car that met 95% of my needs? I left it on the lot and didn’t take a second glance. My car meets 100% of my needs, or I’m not going to buy it.
Wow. I’ve never had a car that met more than 65% of my needs. 95% would be a damned fantasy Homermobile.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/134 "2015-08-29T17:14:44Z")
> [@Procrustus](#):
>
> I agree Volt sales are extremely poor. I disagree that it has anything to do with charging times. The car only seats four, it is a bit pricey, it is very poorly marketed, and it isn’t designed for frequent trips over 50 miles or so.
The only thing missing from the marketing effort was the second coming of Jesus driving it into town. No other car in history got the exposure this car got.
> [@Procrustus](#):
>
> [It can operate forever in gas mode, but there are better cars if you want to run on gas.] In other words, it’s not for everyone. But for many people, it’s a perfect car. It’s well designed, a pleasure to drive, and I’m getting 230 mpg.
If it was it would sell better. So your opinion of what people want does not match sales. I have no doubt it’s a lovely car that’s a pleasure to drive. Doesn’t meet my needs for the cost.
> [@Procrustus](#):
>
> A Tesla would not have many of the same limitations, and I can’t imagine charging times to be much of a factor in whether to buy one or not. Remember, you’re starting every day with a “full tank.” With a gas engine, you drive for a few days or more, then go to a gas station to fill up when you’re down to 1/4 tank or so. So, you care how long it takes to fill your tank. Charging overnight at home, on the other hand, is easy and painless. It takes about 10 seconds when you arrive home. If you never drive more than 250 miles in a day (which I can say is probably true for many people) you don’t have to give a second thought to charging duration.
but I will ALWAYS have a need for a vehicle that drives over 250 miles a day. It might not be every day. It might not be every week. But I’m not buying another car to back it up.
The Tesla will certainly pick up better numbers if it can go 250 miles but it still can’t be used as an average car because it can’t be charged in a timely manner on trips. The increase in numbers will come from people who can afford to buy toys. They buy them as second cars and drive them on the weekend or when it’s nice out. But you can buy a nice Mustang for $35,000 and it has no restrictions. in the summer the AC will freeze you out and in the winter the heater will roast you.
When you can charge batteries in 2 minutes then electric vehicles will quickly replace gas powered vehicles. There will be an immediate crisis because we can’t begin to produce enough electricity to handle it. The current state of E-power in most states are environment mandates to reduce consumption. That mandate has reduced the construction of new power plants.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/135 "2015-08-29T17:22:24Z")
> [@Ravenman](#):
>
> Wow. I’ve never had a car that met more than 65% of my needs. 95% would be a damned fantasy Homermobile.
Well either you’re a special-needs driver or the Volt doesn’t meet 65% of other driver’s needs.
My cars meet 100% of my needs.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/136 "2015-08-29T17:36:33Z")
> [@Procrustus](#):
>
> While there may be some drawbacks for some people with electric cars, there are also some significant advantages for others. Great performance, less maintenance, zero emissions, and NO GAS. I buy “green power” from my electric company, and I actually feel like I’m making a bit of a difference. Thus, you’re not getting 100% of what you can have with any one type of car.
I actually envy you. I would love to have a Volt as a second car. I’ve given the Volt a lot of crap because it doesn’t replace the average car. It doesn’t mean I hate the car it just doesn’t meet my needs and I can’t afford it as a toy. I’d love a Tesla even more. It’s wicked fast in the speed range people can enjoy in every day driving. I had to settle for a used motorcycle for something that gets 50 mpg and is fun to operate. Zero to 70 mph is fun entertainment.
But the day that these cars meet the needs of most people we are in a serious crisis. These cars are going to instantly replace gas cars. When that happens we will be placing our reliance on electricity in great jeopardy. The day they announce 2 minute battery charging I’m going to buy a whole house generator. Might start looking at them now.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/137 "2015-08-29T17:40:35Z")
If our nation was even remotely serious about global warming then we would be building nuclear power plants yesterday in anticipation of the almost certain introduction of electric cars on a mass scale. Fast charging batteries could happen any time in the near future and we aren’t prepared for the natural response to it.
What I’m saying is that it’s a GIVEN we will switch to electric cars in the near future.
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### Author:  [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/138 "2015-08-29T17:42:31Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> but I will ALWAYS have a need for a vehicle that drives over 250 miles a day. It might not be every day. It might not be every week. But I’m not buying another car to back it up.
Many families have two cars. When I need to drive 300 miles, I take my wife’s car.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/139 "2015-08-29T18:26:13Z")
> [@Procrustus](#):
>
> Many families have two cars. When I need to drive 300 miles, I take my wife’s car.
Which you can’t do if both of you drive. And many people have only one car. All you’re doing is reinforcing a scenario that works for you.
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### Author:  [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)
#### Post date: [August 29, 2015, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-the-tesla-model-3-revolutionize-amercan-driving/726537/140 "2015-08-29T18:31:55Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> Well either you’re a special-needs driver or the Volt doesn’t meet 65% of other driver’s needs.
>
> My cars meet 100% of my needs.
I live in the city so I require a car as small as practical so I can find parking spaces.
I also do a fair amount of moving shit around so I need a car I can use to move drywall or furniture. So I need a big car that can carry big, awkward things.
Also, I won’t buy a car that gets poor gas mileage.
What car meets 100% of those paradoxical needs?
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