# Will there be race riots if Zimmerman is found not guilty? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 29, 2013, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201 "2013-06-29T14:00:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/121 "2013-07-02T14:39:28Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Yes, you do. It’s a conclusion about a racial group based on stereotypes and cherry-picked examples, and this thread shows that the predictions are pretty much immune to evidence. Since the prediction is that the group will riot if they’re unhappy, that’s more than enough to sustain the description of racism. It sounds like your prediction is that nothing will happen. My prediction is that an acquittal will trigger a small number of flash mobs in the weeks that follow the trial. I base that on the of [protests](http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-03-24/news/chi-protest-calls-for-trayvon-martin-case-prosecution-20120324_1_protest-daley-plaza-skittles) [around](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/10/trayvon-martin-protest-la_n_1415208.html)the [country](http://clayduda.com/portfolio/atlanta-community-members-protest-trayvon-martin-shooting/)demanding a trial for Zimmerman. It takes a lot for people to rally for a cause so far away. Add to that groups like the New Black Panthers openly offering a bounty for the capture of Zimmerman and it’s evident that emotions run high on this case. This is already a nation where riots occur over a sports victory and kids flash-mob stores for entertainment. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/122 "2013-07-02T14:47:59Z")
> [@tralfamidor](#): > > You assert that riots will not happen, based on incidents when they did not. However, you ignore incidents when they DID happen. Isn’t making such an assertion the exact equivalent of the error you accuse me of, i.e., confirmation bias? No, because I am not ignoring anything. I’m using more information than you are, and I’m able to offer my opinion without saying goofy things like this: > [@](#): > > I have also observed that the Zimmerman trial is viewed by black commentators as a racial referendum: if Zimmerman walks, that ipso facto will prove that the oppression of the black man continues. > [@](#): > > I believe I’ve addressed why I think this case is unusually volatile. You haven’t. Like a couple of other posters, you’ve _asserted_ it’s unusually volatile based on your purported insight into what black people think about the case. Let’s say your insight seems really dubious. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/123 "2013-07-02T14:53:11Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > My prediction is that an acquittal will trigger a small number of flash mobs in the weeks that follow the trial. What’s the difference between a flash mob and a demonstration? ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/124 "2013-07-02T15:52:15Z")
> [@tralfamidor](#): > > Yes. But step back for a moment–just a moment–if you can–if you’re intellectually capable: Let’s everyone cool down a bit, please, and debate ideas rather than attacking one another. ---
**Author:** ![Doggo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/87869e/32.png) [@Doggo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doggo)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/125 "2013-07-02T15:56:26Z")
Has there been any support for Zimmerman in the Hispanic community? It’s like it’s a “white” against “black” thing when he’s actually Hispanic. Can we expect to see the woman politician wearing a pink hat that said “Tryavon was gunned down in the street like a rabid dog” making any more statements? I thought she was very entertaining. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/126 "2013-07-02T16:35:05Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > What’s the difference between a flash mob and a demonstration? as they’re not related I don’t understand your question. And while you answer that what is your prediction? Nothing? The end of the world? a revival of Disco music? A third term for Bush? ---
**Author:** ![tralfamidor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@tralfamidor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tralfamidor)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/127 "2013-07-02T17:53:27Z")
> [@Ellen\_Cherry](#): > > Let’s everyone cool down a bit, please, and debate ideas rather than attacking one another. Sure. But based on the amount of name-calling directed at me in this thread, I think you should have used one of those dozen or so examples to illustrate. That said, the people on these Straight Dope message boards–the moderators who choose to participate in the debates included (!)–are utterly incapable of addressing anyone who disagrees with them without scorn, derision, sarcasm, and name-calling. I’m sorry I even partially descended to their level. In the case of the abovereferenced post, I was in error in attempting to point out that person’s cognitive bias: one signal aspect of a cognitive bias is that the person suffering from it will steadfastly refuse to admit that such bias exists, even when it is pointed out to him. That’s what happened here, and I was wasting my time to point it out to him. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/128 "2013-07-02T18:43:32Z")
> [@tralfamidor](#): > > Sure. But based on the amount of name-calling directed at me in this thread, I think you should have used one of those dozen or so examples to illustrate. > > That said, the people on these Straight Dope message boards–the moderators who choose to participate in the debates included (!)–are utterly incapable of addressing anyone who disagrees with them without scorn, derision, sarcasm, and name-calling. I’m sorry I even partially descended to their level. In the case of the abovereferenced post, I was in error in attempting to point out that person’s cognitive bias: one signal aspect of a cognitive bias is that the person suffering from it will steadfastly refuse to admit that such bias exists, even when it is pointed out to him. That’s what happened here, and I was wasting my time to point it out to him. You’ll excuse me if I don’t immediately stop what I’m doing and conduct my moderating specifically to your wishes. What I am doing now is giving you a warning for failure to follow moderator instructions. I’ll add that your posting here is going to be short unless you decide to follow our rules instead of your own. You can find them [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=650726) and [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=562482). ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2013, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/129 "2013-07-02T19:03:47Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > as they’re not related I don’t understand your question. I’m trying to understand the relevance of this prediction or what it would even look like. (And you did bring up demonstrations as a reason for predicting flash mobs.) You don’t expect demonstrations, but you expect flash mobs… which basically means some people will gather someplace, hang out there for a little while, and then leave? If it’s done in response to the trial that does sound kind of like a demonstration. If not, it’s just chilling out. 😛 > [@](#): > > And while you answer that what is your prediction? At the risk of coming off like a scold, I’m going to go ahead and say that the idea of turning this into a prediction game is really distasteful. Of course it’s no worse than the original thread topic, but there you have it. If Zimmerman is acquitted, there will probably be some small demonstrations and that’s it. My other prediction is that the next time there’s some kind of controversial criminal case that touches on racial themes, a bunch of people will suggest black people will riot if they’re displeased with the verdict. I’m even more confident in the second prediction than I am in the first. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/130 "2013-07-03T00:51:15Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > If Zimmerman is acquitted, there will probably be some small demonstrations and that’s it. So would you say that property damage is out of the question as a result of these small demonstrations? ---
**Author:** ![MrBurger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@MrBurger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrBurger)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/131 "2013-07-03T01:28:43Z")
I just hope everyone will be calm and civil no matter what the verdict is. I’ve been watching videos from the 92 riots since the trial started and its been pretty chilling remembering seeing it on the news when it happened. I suppose either way the verdict goes, there’ll be plenty of opinions on how far this country had come in race relations. The U.S. in 2013 is very different than in 1992. Just comparing the comments of the news anchors back then to today shows a lot. One anchor said they didn’t have to worry about people trying to get to work in South Central because they’re aren’t any jobs there anyway and another asked the black man who saved Reginald Denny’s life if he was the one who beat him. Then the clueless anchor why he thought Denny was beaten and his rescuerer paused in disbelief and said “Um…because he was white?!?”. The coverage back then was amazingly out of touch. There’s also the possibility if Zimmerman is found guilty some lone nut could decide to go on rampage shooting or something. Remember that the most recent mass attacks have been by deranged white guys (Colorado theater shooting, Sandy Hook, etc.). God help us this country has seen too much violence. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/132 "2013-07-03T01:31:30Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > So would you say that property damage is out of the question as a result of these small demonstrations? Again, I haven’t developed any detailed racial disharmony fantasies. I don’t think anyone’s going to throw a garbage can through the window of Sal’s Pizza and I don’t think you’d see anything on any significant scale. Was there any property damage in the demonstrations after Martin was killed or in any of the other recent examples I mentioned? If there was any it didn’t get much attention. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/133 "2013-07-03T02:20:28Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > So would you say that property damage is out of the question as a result of these small demonstrations? I would (locally, anyway). Why? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/134 "2013-07-03T02:26:17Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’m trying to understand the relevance of this prediction or what it would even look like. (And you did bring up demonstrations as a reason for predicting flash mobs.) > You don’t expect demonstrations, but you expect flash mobs… which basically means some people will gather someplace, hang out there for a little while, and then leave? If it’s done in response to the trial that does sound kind of like a demonstration. If not, it’s just chilling out. 😛 well I didn’t use the word demonstration, I said protest. But working off that a protest is an organized group of people expressing a common point. A flash mob could be a group of people who burst into song in public but I’m referring to a mob of people who show up at a designated location to cause general mayhem. Call it riot light. But as I stated earlier, this has generated national protests. That’s pretty significant. The story itself has international status. > [@Marley23](#): > > At the risk of coming off like a scold, I’m going to go ahead and say that the idea of turning this into a prediction game is really distasteful. Of course it’s no worse than the original thread topic, but there you have it. If Zimmerman is acquitted, there will probably be some small demonstrations and that’s it. Well there you go, you think there is a demographic link to the trial that will be unhappy with an acquittal. > [@Marley23](#): > > My other prediction is that the next time there’s some kind of controversial criminal case that touches on racial themes, a bunch of people will suggest black people will riot if they’re displeased with the verdict. I’m even more confident in the second prediction than I am in the first. Forgive me for busting your chops but your response registers a bit on the PC scale. Why would black people be different than any other group who feels disenfranchised by something. Certainly there’s a history of getting screwed over in the court system. And unless somebody is following the trial the media narrative is Hispanic/white male chases after black teen and guns him down for the crime of walking-while-black. I certainly felt animosity towards Zimmerman when I heard about the event. Finally, the Miami-Dade County’s [Community Relations Board](http://wlrn.org/post/miami-dade-knows-riots-too-well-plans-zimmerman-verdict)has been working behind the scenes to avoid problems specific to this trial. They’ve been doing it from day one. their awareness of the situation is going to be better than ours. So if nothing else, preparations have been in the works to dilute the situation. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/135 "2013-07-03T03:01:06Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > well I didn’t use the word demonstration, I said protest. I’m not seeing a lot of distinction there, but let’s move on. > [@](#): > > But working off that a protest is an organized group of people expressing a common point. A flash mob could be a group of people who burst into song in public but I’m referring to a mob of people who show up at a designated location to cause general mayhem. Call it riot light. That’s not very mayhem-y, nor is it comparable to a riot. This is why I asked you to be a little more specific about the flash mob idea: a bunch of people showing up in one place and listening to the same song on their iPods (I think that’s the only type of flash mob I’ve seen in person) is miles and miles away from a riot. If they’re just standing there, you could call it a demonstration. If they’re attacking people and breaking stuff, it’s something like a riot. > [@](#): > > But as I stated earlier, this has generated national protests. That’s pretty significant. Yes, it is a major news story. But even when it was being reported that Zimmerman shot an unarmed guy to death and hadn’t been arrested - and perhaps couldn’t be arrested - nobody rioted. > [@](#): > > Forgive me for busting your chops but your response registers a bit on the PC scale. I hope it does, since this pattern of speculation is kinda racist. > [@](#): > > Why would black people be different than any other group who feels disenfranchised by something. They wouldn’t, and that’s my point. The only time I hear people in the U.S. speculating about riots is when they think a bunch of black people are going to be unhappy. It does turn into a pattern eventually- especially when the speculation is wrong over and over again. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/136 "2013-07-03T03:49:59Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > They wouldn’t, and that’s my point. The only time I hear people in the U.S. speculating about riots is when they think a bunch of black people are going to be unhappy. It does turn into a pattern eventually- especially when the speculation is wrong over and over again. what other cases of this magnitude can you list? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/137 "2013-07-03T04:05:51Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > what other cases of this magnitude can you list? I’ve already posted several times about the Sean Bell and Amadou Diallo cases. In both cases cops shot a black guy to death and were acquitted of all wrongdoing, and there were protests but no riots. There were not riots in the earlier stages of this case either. The last time this delightful thread topic came up (early 2012) I also listed… well, why retype it? > [@Duke Lacrosse, DSK, Trayvon Martin ...](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/duke-lacrosse-dsk-trayvon-martin/616952/22): > > I realize that if you lived through the riots in the '60s and/or saw the Rodney King or the Crown Heights riots up close, this kind of thing is more likely to be at the forefront of your mind. Still, I can’t help noticing that people are quick to suggest that black people might start rioting if they’re upset with something. Anything, really. It was suggested many times on this board that black people would riot if Obama lost in 2008, and there was never any concrete reason that it might lead to riots - it just seemed reasonable to some people to speculate that black people would riot if they didn’t get their way. As a reminder, there were no riots over the Amadou Diallo shooting, none over the sexual assault of Abner Louima by police (and I realize there were convictions in that case), none over the Sean Bell shooting, none over the Duke case, and I’m sure I’m forgetting my share of other controversial criminal cases that involved race in one way or other. > There have already been marches, and nothing bad happened. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/138 "2013-07-03T04:53:01Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’ve already posted several times about the Sean Bell and Amadou Diallo cases. In both cases cops shot a black guy to death and were acquitted of all wrongdoing, and there were protests but no riots. There were not riots in the earlier stages of this case either. The last time this delightful thread topic came up (early 2012) I also listed… well, why retype it? You’ve posted 2 cases and they did not generate the level of protest on the level of Rodney King. But I wasn’t clear in my question. What other cases that didn’t involve a black person can you list? Considering sports enthusiasts riot over a season finally why do you find it strange that people would worry over rioting when someone like the Reverend Jackson has demanded justice? This is the kind of thing that can be ramped up with poor reporting as was done with the edited version of the NE phone call that NBC presented. Discounting hate groups like the New Black Panthers who offered a bounty for Zimmerman, do you not see the possibility that public opinion can get ramped up and why do you think it would only be black people? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/139 "2013-07-03T04:58:23Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > You’ve posted 2 cases and they did not generate the level of protest on the level of Rodney King. Why is Rodney King the comparison instead of events that were more recent and more similar to this case? > [@](#): > > why do you think it would only be black people? The thread title is “Will there be race riots if Zimmerman is found not guilty?” That’s the question I’m responding to. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201/140 "2013-07-03T05:09:10Z")
Just remembered the student walkout over this in Miami. HS students left their school and [ransacked a Walgreens](http://www.local10.com/news/Police-Trayvon-protesters-ransack-store/-/1717324/9719674/-/xctonpz/-/index.html). Not nearly as damaging as the [Walmart flash mob in Jacksonville](http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/2012-07-17/story/saturday-night-flash-mob-takes-over-jacksonville-walmart). That was just the spillover from a party. This is the worst I would anticipate barring any jackass fanning the flames. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-there-be-race-riots-if-zimmerman-is-found-not-guilty/662201.md?page=8)