# Will this discovery \[of mineral deposits in Afghanistan\] mean the end of al Quaida? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 14, 2010, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087 "2010-06-14T02:55:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/21 "2010-06-14T10:26:02Z")
Assuming it is true, you would still need to find the companies willing to throw those big bucks in that direction. Right now, not exactly where I would throw any money. But still- once again, assuming it is all true - this might mean some major money and investments could provide some backing and a reason to end the war ASAP. Hate to say it, but money talks. Throw a few million around in the right places and people tend to like you and chat a bit more. “I have no idea where Osama is hiding and…oh…really? Cash? Uh, come to think of it - 500 meters south of that big hill 12 kilometer from here, with the sign on the cave that says ‘if the rocks are blockin’ don’t come a’knockin’. Bin Laden lives in cave 349.” The idea of a potentially “rich” Afghanistan is certainly intriguing. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/22 "2010-06-14T10:29:53Z")
Natural resources don’t make a country rich. There are plenty of poor countries with abundant natural resources, and plenty of rich countries without. ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/23 "2010-06-14T11:23:57Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > How come nobody ever noticed this before? Plenty of advanced nations have ruled or at least passed through the country; why are we now learning about huge reserves of iron and copper for the first time? This is not news. Thousands of years ago Afghanistan was mining gold and precious stones and metals. Egyptian pharoahs had Afghani stones and gold in their treasury. You don’t invade a country looking for WMD’s if it doesn’t have oil or a resource you can plunder. You don’t invade Afghanistan to stop a war on terror, or halt opium production. There’s gold in the hills of Sinai and other parts of Egypt left over from ancient times. Can we expect an invasion here soon if we don’t follow Washington? ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/24 "2010-06-14T11:27:18Z")
> [@DMark](#): > > Assuming it is true, you would still need to find the companies willing to throw those big bucks in that direction. > Right now, not exactly where I would throw any money. > But still- once again, assuming it is all true - this might mean some major money and investments could provide some backing and a reason to end the war ASAP. > Hate to say it, but money talks. > Throw a few million around in the right places and people tend to like you and chat a bit more. > “I have no idea where Osama is hiding and…oh…really? Cash? Uh, come to think of it - 500 meters south of that big hill 12 kilometer from here, with the sign on the cave that says ‘if the rocks are blockin’ don’t come a’knockin’. Bin Laden lives in cave 349.” > > The idea of a potentially “rich” Afghanistan is certainly intriguing. what is the current ransom on his head? $25 million no one turned him in yet? wonder why? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/25 "2010-06-14T11:34:11Z")
If the U.S. knew of these resources all along, why hasn’t it been mining them for the past 9 years? (And the only parts of the Sinai Israelis care about are Dahab and Nuweiba). ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/26 "2010-06-14T13:16:28Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Exactly. I mean, the Victorian British needed iron as much as we do today, and they certainly didn’t lack surveyors. How come they didn’t make this discovery? British Armies tended to die when they went to Afgnanistan. And there are other places where you have minerals. Its very easy to sepculate sitting on a computer in Tel Aviv pn why. Quite another when you have the highest mountains and the worst terrain in the world to navigate. You say “fuck it, find some place better”. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/27 "2010-06-14T13:57:48Z")
Obviously the environment - both natural and human - is a factor. Still, there have been plenty of periods throughout history when Afganistan was a relatively peaceful and orderly country. Surely at some point local surveyors, or surveyors from Persia, India or further afield would have noted huge deposits of valuable metals like iron, copper and gold. Is it simply that they are located in the most inaccessable parts of the country? Or are there certain geological circumstances that prevented their earlier discovery? ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/28 "2010-06-14T14:21:40Z")
Wealth does equal education but not in Islamic countries. A quick review of countries like Saudi Arabia and the UAE show that around 90% of college grads have bachelor degrees in Islamic Studies. They’re not getting educated in anything new. This also accounts for why Arab Gulf countries have to pull in graduates of universitites from other nations to run the oil companies. This is an irritating issue for the governments. On one hand they are actively trying to end the dependence on foreign workers through education but they cannot openly steer young students from Islam. You can also look at the most educated Arabs outside of the Gulf Region and you get -\> The Palestinians. Yet they are not rich by any means, nor do they use their degrees to promote the welfare of their people. The Palestinian grads are just another pawn in the game. Remember the US Government has no issue with the Taliban, people forget this. GW Bush told the Taliban government, hand over Osama and that’s all we want. If they had done that the Taliban would be in power today. It’s not like the US government said “Taliban is a bad thing, so we’re gonna oust them.” Also remember Afghanistan isn’t really one country, it’s many tribal countries. Each part of the country has a different tribe and they just move their allegiance accordingly. If the US is winning they shift sides. If the US is losing, they shift back. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/29 "2010-06-14T14:56:10Z")
Moving thread from IMHO to Great Debates. **Ellen Cherry IMHO Moderator** ---
**Author:** ![Dick\_Dastardly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c4cdca/32.png) [@Dick\_Dastardly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dick_Dastardly)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/30 "2010-06-14T16:26:52Z")
This was first made public in 2007, I posted it ages ago, the Pentagon are only publicising it now because things are getting desperate over there and they’re scrabbling for anything that will keep any level of public support for us being there. It’ll make no difference to AQ, it’ll take decades to get mining infrastructure built up over there and it’ll be squalid deals with the warlords who control various territories (who’ll obviously be fighting over various mineral-rich regions) so the money won’t really get into the Afghan economy in the way it should. They’ll still be growing poppies for decades and AQ will be funded by Gulf billionaires and centimillionaires for as long as there’s an AQ. They’re funded from the Gulf and based in Pakistan now so they don’t need Afghanistan anyway. The future fighting over the various mineral resources might grow so intense it splinters the country even more anyway and that would give AQ opportunities to move back in should they wish to. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/31 "2010-06-14T16:47:54Z")
> [@](#): > > Remember the US Government has no issue with the Taliban, people forget this. GW Bush told the Taliban government, hand over Osama and that’s all we want. If they had done that the Taliban would be in power today. It’s not like the US government said “Taliban is a bad thing, so we’re gonna oust them.” I think that train left the station. Prior to 2001, the United States didn’t like the Taliban but there was no direct conflict between us. Then Al Qaeda attacked the United States and the Taliban was supporting Al Qaeda. The United States offered the Taliban a chance to denounce Al Qaeda and seperate themselves from that group. The Taliban chose not to do so. Since then the United States has regarded the Taliban and Al Qaeda as allied enemies of the United States. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/32 "2010-06-14T16:48:25Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > If the U.S. knew of these resources all along, why hasn’t it been mining them for the past 9 years? > > (And the only parts of the Sinai Israelis care about are Dahab and Nuweiba). Because they’re not ours. Being the de facto ruling force in a territory isn’t the same as being the legitimate government of the land and the people who live there. We didn’t annex Afghanistan, and the Afghani people aren’t US citizens, so what right do we have to those resources? It’s not like they have a functional government we could make binding agreements with. Just a bunch of poppinjays who talk big while most people are keeping their heads down and waiting for the current wave of white men to get tired of dying in their mountains and to go home. Or at least that’s what I’d like to imagine the motives were. Odds are we were just too busy to set up strip mining operations. So far the thing that has saved Afghanistan from the U.S.'s bloated desire for natural resources is probably the insurgency. Ironically, very much like when the Russians were the occupiers. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![wmfellows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c2a13f/32.png) [@wmfellows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wmfellows)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/33 "2010-06-14T16:56:05Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Could [this discovery](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/14/world/asia/14minerals.html?hp) change the entire dynamic of the Middle East and possibly mean the end of Al Quaida? Why would Afghanistan need the poppy trade with bazillions in mineral wealth at their disposal? Why would they have to continue to put up with al Quaida’s bully tactics. It would seem that this is a huge incentive to turn these fuckers out and start telling the government where they’re holed up, especially if the citizens stand to have jobs and a share of the wealth. No, as first of all Afghanistan is not in the Middle East. It is Central Asia and/or Indian Sub Continent. Anyway it looks rather more like a huge incentive for the various factions to fight on harder to roust out the Americans and allies and get the whole pie for themselves. > [@Alessan](#): > > Exactly. I mean, the Victorian British needed iron as much as we do today, and they certainly didn’t lack surveyors. How come they didn’t make this discovery? Because of the charming Afghan habit of ambushing and destroying British army columns. Very hard to survey due to that. > [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > This is not news. > > Thousands of years ago Afghanistan was mining gold and precious stones and metals. Egyptian pharoahs had Afghani stones and gold in their treasury. Mate thousands year old examples are not proof of currently exploitable mineral wealth. > [@](#): > > There’s gold in the hills of Sinai and other parts of Egypt left over from ancient times. > > Can we expect an invasion here soon if we don’t follow Washington? I shouldn’t think so, given gold is not that rare relative to demand. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/34 "2010-06-14T17:01:27Z")
Don’t see why it would mean the end of Al Quaeda, but it certainly holds the promise of a legitimate Afghan economy for the first time - well, ever really. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/35 "2010-06-14T17:08:09Z")
Yes, Afghanistan would be a paradise if you could just get rid of all those pesky Afghans. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/36 "2010-06-14T17:42:39Z")
It is supposed to be rich with lithium. The auto batteries for electric cars use lithium. It is a resource with future importance. We knew it was there in 2007. It is not a sudden discovery. But we want it. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/37 "2010-06-14T17:44:41Z")
Sounds like the problem will get worse. It’s just more incentive for the battling factions to take control of the country. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/38 "2010-06-14T19:09:15Z")
Are there any actual examples where a mining operation has been _good_ for the people of the region? I hear about a mining operation and I immediately mourn the death of the local culture and population. Doesn’t the life expectancy take a severe drop? [http://www1.american.edu/projects/mandala/TED/NAURU.htm](http://www1.american.edu/projects/mandala/TED/NAURU.htm) > **[Coal mining](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal_mining)** > > Coal mining is the process of extracting coal from the ground or from a mine. Coal is valued for its energy content and since the 1880s has been widely used to generate electricity. Steel and cement industries use coal as a fuel for extraction of iron from iron ore and for cement production. In the United Kingdom and South Africa, a coal mine and its structures are a colliery, a coal mine is called a 'pit', and the above-ground structures are a 'pit head'. In Australia, "colliery" generally ref... [http://laht.com/article.asp?ArticleId=343999&CategoryId=14919](http://laht.com/article.asp?ArticleId=343999&CategoryId=14919) As for education, one does not create a new generation of miners by educating local children. If you want someone to go down into close quarters and dig all day in a dark suffocating hole, you’ve pretty much got to make sure it’s their only prospect. I’ve never heard of a mining company that paid a good wage with good benefits and brought it’s people a better standard of living. If I’m missing something, I hope y’all will enlighten me. It seems to me that the discovery of local mineral deposits is the worst thing that can happen to any populace. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/39 "2010-06-14T19:45:23Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > Are there any actual examples where a mining operation has been _good_ for the people of the region? I hear about a mining operation and I immediately mourn the death of the local culture and population. The local culture revolves around growing opium, weaving, and being blown up. Is that something you’ll really mourn? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087/40 "2010-06-14T19:46:47Z")
It sounds more exciting than working down a mine though, you’ve got to admit. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-this-discovery-of-mineral-deposits-in-afghanistan-mean-the-end-of-al-quaida/543087.md?page=3)