# Will we be allowed to criticize CDCK/Discourse/Jeff Atwood? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [June 18, 2020, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886 "2020-06-18T04:41:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/1 "2020-06-18T04:41:43Z")
CDCK is the company behind Discourse, our new forum software. I don’t have any beef with them (right now) but I did notice this little bit in the [Discourse Standard Hosting Terms](https://www.discourse.org/standard-hosting-terms): "\*Customer agrees not to: 1. […] 2. post or permit content on Customer’s Forum that harms the reputation of CDCK, or leads to unwanted or unfavorable publicity for CDCK\*" I understand the rationale behind such terms, why would I agree to host a forum that harms my reputation or leads to unfavorable publicity? Just curious if we’ll see a new sitewide rule not to bite the hand that feeds us. Also, will such a rule apply to CDCK employees who have accounts here? Are they immune from pittings? I have nothing against **codinghorror** (I usually like his blogs) but he is a registered member of the Dope. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Crap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.crap/32/3131_2.png) [@Dr.Crap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Crap)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/2 "2020-06-18T07:34:41Z")
I’m a big fan of Discourse from way back and remember when Jeff changed it from “COCK” on account of all the criticism. I’m sure he’ll do the right thing here too. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/3 "2020-06-18T17:51:44Z")
Oh FFS, they aren’t doing us a favor. We are paying customers. Let me be the first to say, Jeff Atwood is a dick. ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/4 "2020-06-18T19:03:04Z")
While we certainly do not want to defame or libel Jeff Atwood or Discourse, we also do not want as a general rule to interfere with open, honest, frank discussion. I have asked for clarification of the Hosting Terms and how that applies to us. In the meantime I ask that you belay criticism of the man or the company as we work through all the issues around us, including the legal ones. I don’t even understand why anyone here would instantly want to go to kicking them around before we’ve even fully begun this process. Please desist and hold your fire until we get something going and some ruling and understanding here. I do not expect an instant answer and you shouldn’t either; management is kinda busy right now, ya dig? Be reasonable and let us sort this out. Jenny your humble TubaDiva Administrator ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/5 "2020-06-18T20:03:11Z")
> [@TubaDiva](#): > > In the meantime I ask that you belay criticism of the man or the company as we work through all the issues around us, including the legal ones. Can’t do it. You cannot discuss Discourse in any useful way without criticizing it–especially right after a changeover. And most of the things that people are most critical of are Jeff’s fault. > [@](#): > > I don’t even understand why anyone here would instantly want to go to kicking them around before we’ve even fully begun this process. Discourse may be new to you, but it’s not new to everybody. > [@](#): > > Please desist and hold your fire until we get something going and some ruling and understanding here. I do not expect an instant answer and you shouldn’t either; management is kinda busy right now, ya dig? Be reasonable and let us sort this out. Not going to be able to do that. And once we move, you’ll find that you aren’t able to do that, either. Not saying that you’ll hate it, but there are parts of it where all you can do is say _shit!_ But the Discourse hate flows pretty freely in most of the D-boards I’m familiar with. Nobody’s ever told us to stop. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/6 "2020-06-18T20:19:14Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > Can’t do it. You cannot discuss Discourse in any useful way without criticizing it–especially right after a changeover. And most of the things that people are most critical of are Jeff’s fault. She said not to criticize the man or the company. I think it’s perfectly fine to criticize the software during a transition to the software - it is unreasonable to impose a restriction on that. Just don’t take that extra step and disparage the company or its employees until the legal issue is sorted out. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/7 "2020-06-18T20:22:59Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > She said not to criticize the man or the company. I think it’s perfectly fine to criticize the software during a transition to the software - it is unreasonable to impose a restriction on that. Just don’t take that extra step and disparage the company or its employees until the legal issue is sorted out. It’s all unreasonable, barring actual libel. I didn’t sign up at the Dope to champion or stay silent about a product I don’t really like and a corporate philosophy I fundamentally disagree with. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/8 "2020-06-18T20:27:33Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > It’s all unreasonable, barring actual libel. I didn’t sign up at the Dope to champion or stay silent about a product I don’t really like and a corporate philosophy I fundamentally disagree with. Imagine your company is moving from office building A to office building B. Basically, you can criticize the new arrangements, and you can criticize your own boss for making you move. But please don’t criticize the landlord until we get him to sign a contract saying he can’t kick us out for criticizing him. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/9 "2020-06-18T20:32:56Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > Imagine your company is moving from office building A to office building B. Basically, you can criticize the new arrangements, and you can criticize your own boss for making you move. But please don’t criticize the landlord until we get him to sign a contract saying he can’t kick us out for criticizing him. Even if the roof leaks, snakes infest the sewage system, and the electricity goes off every day at noon, but the new landlord refuses to make repairs? ---
**Author:** ![Hermitian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hermitian/32/470_2.png) [@Hermitian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermitian)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/10 "2020-06-18T20:38:33Z")
I love it. This is so SDMB. Mom (with 10 packages in her arms): “Jr, can you just sit tight for a second and let me put these things down first.” Jr (as he throws a cup of gasoline on the stove): “DON’T TELL ME WHAT TO DO!” ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/11 "2020-06-18T20:42:29Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > Even if the roof leaks, snakes infest the sewage system, and the electricity goes off every day at noon, but the new landlord refuses to make repairs? We haven’t even made the move yet. ETA: Somehow you managed to convey all the problems in this hypothetical without disparaging the landlord. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/12 "2020-06-18T20:44:16Z")
> [@Max\_S](#): > > We haven’t even made the move yet. Again, some of us are already quite familiar with Discourse. > [@](#): > > ETA: Somehow you managed to convey all the problems in this hypothetical without disparaging the landlord. ETA: “…the new landlord refuses to make repairs.” ---
**Author:** ![Max\_S](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@Max\_S](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_S)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/13 "2020-06-18T20:53:54Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > ETA: “…the new landlord refuses to make repairs.” Pretend we start getting constant 502 errors on the new host and CDCK descends from on high, registers an employee here, and threatens to shut us down because God forbid, somebody somewhere wrote “the company behind Discourse won’t fix our 502 errors”. I have confidence that Jenny will realize it is not in the board’s best interest to ban said user or to continue with said host. ~Max ---
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/14 "2020-06-18T21:10:17Z")
> [@TubaDiva](#): > > I don’t even understand why anyone here would instantly want to go to kicking them around before we’ve even fully begun this process. Force of habit. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/15 "2020-06-18T21:56:17Z")
We knew going into this that not everyone would agree with the decisions made. It is impossible to please everyone. We knew that some of you would be opposed to the change. Dopers tend to be disputational by their nature, some more so than others. As this is a place where people proclaim their opnions (sometime full-throatedly so) we do expect posters to share with us on most any subject, including our hosting site, the software it uses, and at least one of the owners of that company, someone who has a little bit of history on this board in the past. You are expected to act appropriately on these subjects just as we expect you to act appropriately in every other subject in this space. We will moderate this like we do everything else. We will step in when appropriate and in full context of where and how posts appear. All that we ask is that you act within our rules. Just like always. And hey, give this site a chance. We are using Discourse but we are custom tailoring the site to more closely conform with our nature. What you might have seen on someone else’s site or in the Discourse demo sandbox is not necessarily what you will encounter here. Keep an open mind and be willing to try something new. For those of you who only want what we’ve always had, my apologies. I note that when we left AOL there were people who refused to make the transition with us, some so attached to the AOL site and unwilling to go anywhere else that they spent years thereafter living in the AOL servers looking at old board posts. Don’t be those people. Jenny your humble TubaDiva Administrator ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/16 "2020-06-18T22:23:42Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > Even if the roof leaks, snakes infest the sewage system, and the electricity goes off every day at noon, but the new landlord refuses to make repairs? Sez the guy visiting here free of charge. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/17 "2020-06-18T22:31:50Z")
> [@TubaDiva](#): > > For those of you who only want what we’ve always had, my apologies. I note that when we left AOL there were people who refused to make the transition with us, some so attached to the AOL site and unwilling to go anywhere else that they spent years thereafter living in the AOL servers looking at old board posts. Don’t be those people. I don’t have a problem with the move. I’d rather we use something else, but it’s happening, and I’m on board. ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2020, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/18 "2020-06-22T00:35:32Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > I don’t have a problem with the move. I’d rather we use something else, but it’s happening, and I’m on board. Test. this is a test. this is a test. Disregard. Jenny ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2020, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/19 "2020-06-22T02:35:17Z")
I still don’t like Jeff Atwood. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2020, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886/20 "2020-06-22T03:14:02Z")
Having never heard of him before, I would like to know more. Why? Who? And whatevers…please. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/will-we-be-allowed-to-criticize-cdck-discourse-jeff-atwood/855886.md?page=2)