# William Shakespeare and the lawyer quote **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 29, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567 "2013-10-29T16:49:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DrumBum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e79b87/32.png) [@DrumBum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrumBum)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567/1 "2013-10-29T16:49:20Z")
In Shakespeare’s play “Henry VI Part 2” is the reasonably famous line spoken by one of the characters that proposes killing all the lawyers, and I have always wondered what this would have meant to a late 14th century audience. Given his fathers occupation as an alderman I presume that young Bill would have a favorable view the legal profession, although this might have changed after his fathers legal troubles. I have done a few searches but I confess that I am not well read when it comes to the classics, so interpreting the lines and trying to figure out the context is not going well. There are several sites out there but they split pretty evenly along partisan lines so I thought I would tap the learned members of the SDMB. In case anyone was wondering this is not a homework assignment but rather, an attempt to fill one of the many gaping holes in my knowledge. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567/2 "2013-10-29T16:54:47Z")
Look at it in context of the play. Jack Cade is a troublemaker stirring up the mob, and his henchman, Dick the Butcher, says the line to egg him on and keep the mob stirred up. It was worth a laugh then (as now), but isn’t meant to be taken seriously by the audience. It’s not the considered words of a virtuous or likeable character; it’s just rabble-rousing. ---
**Author:** ![Fretful\_Porpentine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fretful_porpentine/32/2873_2.png) [@Fretful\_Porpentine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fretful_Porpentine)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2013, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567/3 "2013-10-29T19:20:20Z")
Well, first of all, the quote is unlikely to have meant anything to a late 14th-century audience, since the play wasn’t written until two centuries later 🙂 But as for what _sixteenth_-century audiences would have thought, it’s complicated. (Everything in Shakespeare is complicated!) Cade and his followers aren’t depicted as particularly good people (and they are also clueless enough to be manipulated into rioting by the Duke of York, who is using popular rebellion to sow dissent for his own purposes), but _no one_ in _2 Henry VI_ is a good person except the king, who is totally ineffectual. Their demands are a mixture of legitimate grievances, totally absurd fantasy, and pointless and destructive violence, sometimes almost in the same breath: > [@](#): > > Marry, thou oughtest not to let thy horse wear a cloak, when honester men than thou go in their hose and doublets. > [@](#): > > And here, sitting upon London-stone, I charge and command that, of the > city’s cost, the pissing-conduit run nothing but claret wine this first year of our reign. > [@](#): > > Away with him, I say! hang him with his pen and ink-horn about his neck. > [@](#): > > Thou hast appointed justices of peace, to call poor men before them > about matters they were not able to answer. Moreover, thou hast put them in prison; and because they could not read, thou hast hanged them; when, indeed, only for that cause they have been most worthy to live. Cade is putting his finger on some real social injustices, especially the abuse of the [benefit of clergy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benefit_of_clergy), which by the Elizabethan era is basically a free pass for offenders who are privileged enough to be literate. At the same time, the only solutions he can envision are senselessly and wantonly destructive (basically, they involve executing anybody who has more education than they do). Mixed in with all of this is a hefty dose of utopian fantasy, which is the immediate context for the “lawyers” quote: > [@](#): > > Jack Cade. Be brave, then; for your captain is brave, and vows reformation. There shall be in England seven halfpenny loaves sold for a penny: the three-hooped pot; shall have ten hoops and I will make it felony to drink small beer: all the realm shall be in common; and in Cheapside shall my palfrey go to grass: and when I am king, as king I will be,— > > ``` > All. God save your majesty! > > Jack Cade. I thank you, good people: there shall be no money; all shall eat and drink on my score; and I will apparel them all in one livery, that they may agree like brothers and worship me their lord. > > Dick the Butcher. The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers. > > Jack Cade. Nay, that I mean to do. Is not this a lamentable thing, that of the skin of an innocent lamb should be made parchment? that parchment, being scribbled o'er, should undo a man? Some say the bee stings: but I say, 'tis the bee's wax; for I did but seal once to a thing, and I was never mine own man since. > > ``` This is pretty clearly NOT a practical vision for running a kingdom – we’re supposed to see them as ignorant and naive – but it’s also not hard to imagine audiences cheering at some of these lines, especially in a culture where the law and most of the social institutions really ARE biased in favor of rich people. Cade and his followers also happen to be tremendously fun to watch on stage, and there’s a tendency for theatrical audiences to sorta-root for them even if they know they’re _supposed_ to be condemning them. They are anarchists who make us laugh, and that sort of thing tends to have a powerful appeal in the theater even if we’d be appalled at similar behavior in real life. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2013, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567/4 "2013-10-29T19:40:38Z")
That’s the greatness of Shakespeare, that each generation can interpret his works anew. “The more I think about it, old Billy was right / let’s kill all the lawyers, kill 'em tonight…” ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2013, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567/5 "2013-10-29T19:43:33Z")
> [@DrumBum](#): > > Given his fathers occupation as an alderman I presume that young Bill would have a favorable view the legal profession, although this might have changed after his fathers legal troubles. Yet more proof that Shakespeare’s plays were actually written by Sir Francis Bacon. \ ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2013, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567/6 "2013-10-29T20:43:52Z")
> [@tracer](#): > > Yet more proof that Shakespeare’s plays were actually written by Sir Francis Bacon. > > \ I thought they were written by Edward DeVere. But this is not the place for this very contentious issue. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2013, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/william-shakespeare-and-the-lawyer-quote/672567/7 "2013-10-29T20:51:02Z")
Yeah. We don’t want anyone suing anyone else here.