# Windows 8.1 vs 7 **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 6, 2014, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850 "2014-05-06T22:53:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Blakeyrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@Blakeyrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blakeyrat)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/41 "2014-05-08T01:05:26Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > I sincerely thank you for totally validating my suspicion that M$ cares more about selling more new stuff, and is not at all interested in what their current user base wants. Ok, first of all, I can’t take anybody who, in 2014, still types M$ with the dollar sign seriously. Just curious, Apple has a much higher market cap, do you spell it Appl$? Secondly, Microsoft’s current user base is north of a billion people. A lot of them are extremely crotchety people who hate to learn new things and abbreviate their company “M$” and would hate them no matter what they do. You try making that crowd all happy simultaneously. For those of us who are ok learning new things, there’s nothing at all wrong with Windows 8.1. Does it have warts? Yeah, a couple. Much fewer than 8.0 did, though, and not enough to seal yourself in a time capsule and pretend it’s 2002 for the next 30 years. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/42 "2014-05-08T04:08:51Z")
> [@Blakeyrat](#): > > Ok, first of all, I can’t take anybody who, in 2014, still types M$ with the dollar sign seriously. Just curious, Apple has a much higher market cap, do you spell it Appl$? I just want to second this. As much as I like some of Apple’s products (I’m typing this out on a MBP) they hardly ever pass up an opportunity to separate my wallet and money. MS is no better or worse than most other companies. ---
**Author:** ![jerez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c68b51/32.png) [@jerez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jerez)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/43 "2014-05-08T06:40:07Z")
> [@Shakes](#): > > Thank god for Google. You’re right, it was easy, it took me all of 2 minutes to do. > Thanks. Glad to help. Now that I’ve gotten rid of the unnecessary tiles and have set it to start with the desktop, W8.1 is much more to my liking. One thing’s still getting in my way, though: When I move the cursor to the upper right-hand corner of the screen to click on the “X” to close a window, I’m almost always blocked by the emerging vertical menu and have to reposition the cursor and try again. I imagine there’s a way to deactivate that upper right-hand corner and the real problem is that I haven’t taken the time to look carefully enough for a solution. ---
**Author:** ![JustinC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justinc/32/8083_2.png) [@JustinC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JustinC)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/44 "2014-05-08T06:54:11Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > In my experience, even non-geeks learn this trick pretty quickly, and they don’t say that Windows loaded faster, because they’ve learned from bitter experience that even though you can SEE the Start button, you can’t DO anything with it yet. They learn that this is a good time to go for a cup of coffee. **For decades, the top item on my wish list has been for Windows to give a message box saying, “Windows is now finished starting up. You may now get to work.”** - because until I get that message, my only way to know whether or not bootup is complete is to try clicking stuff - which just slows it down even more. Have you tried Soluto? It’s free, can reduce the time your 'puter takes to start up and tells you how long there is left. It ain’t perfect but it isn’t bad, either. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/45 "2014-05-08T07:15:47Z")
> [@FordPrefect](#): > > Windows 8.1 Start screen kicks freaking butt over the old digging through Start Menu options, filtering out the Read Me shortcuts, app uninstallers, etc… Commonly used programs get pinned to the Start Screen or task bar pretty much as before. So, why the whining? I don’t know. > > Throw in a few little things like ISO mounting being built in and no prompting when recycling files confirming you want to do that. You still are prompted when a delete action will be permanent. One less annoying click that has always annoyed me. My brother is using Win 8 on a touch screen games machine. My wife is using IOS on a touch screen games machine and a touch screen video streaming machine. The kids are using touch screen android devices. I don’t use my computer for those things. My job is actually 4 very different jobs I use my computer for, and I also have the cover off of my computer every week. I have scores of different programs I use, and hundreds I use very rarely. I need access to a lot of different things, and a system designed to hide unwanted details is not helpful for me. So, no problems with Win 8.1, but it just isn’t very suitable for me, or for a lot of the tech people who saw it first. And of course, being a tech person, I turned off the confirmations 10 or 15 years ago. And I can also tell you that MS has been telling people not to put uninstallers in the menus for at least 10 years: either you’ve been using old programs, or you’ve been using programs from people who don’t really like MS. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/46 "2014-05-08T07:19:57Z")
> [@jerez](#): > > the real problem is that I haven’t taken the time to look carefully enough for a solution. no–the real problem is that Microsoft has brainwashed you. You think it’s your fault that their product doesn’t work. There is logic in adding new functions to software–but there is zero reason to remove simple things that the public already knows how to use.Such as the red X to close a window. This has been standard ever since you bought your first computer with a dialup modem to AOL in 1995, and the public overwhelmingly says that they still want it. In most industries, companies use focus groups and market research to test their products before shipping. Microsoft doesnt even care–they just ship it out, and wait till the public boycotts it (8.0 was a failure, and was blamed for causing a [14% drop in sales of new computers).](http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9238326/Windows_8_takes_blame_for_brutal_PC_sales_slide?pageNumber=1) Then they bring out 8.1, and you still blame yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/47 "2014-05-08T07:34:01Z")
If Microsoft’s strategy was ‘look at our new product - it’s exactly the same!’, there would be no Microsoft. **jerez** - I believe the configuration for the hot corner that’s bothering you is accessed like this (writing this from memory, so may not be exact): [ul] [li]right click the task bar[/li][li]click properties[/li][li]in the ‘Taskbar/navigation properties’ window, there should be a checkbox labelled something like ‘show the charms menu when I move my mouse to the top right corner’ - uncheck it[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![jerez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c68b51/32.png) [@jerez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jerez)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/48 "2014-05-08T08:01:43Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > no–the real problem is that Microsoft has brainwashed you. You think it’s your fault that their product doesn’t work. (…) This has been standard ever since you bought your first computer with a dialup modem to AOL in 1995… (…) Then they bring out 8.1, and you still blame yourself. I don’t think any of those statements apply to me, but you might want to ask this question, as posed by Rico Rodríguez in his portrayal of Manny Delgado: “Who are you really mad at, Larry?”🙂 ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/49 "2014-05-08T10:00:44Z")
> [@Blakeyrat](#): > > Ok, first of all, I can’t take anybody who, in 2014, still types M$ with the dollar sign seriously. Just curious, Apple has a much higher market cap, do you spell it Appl$? The advent of the euro has provided us with a more parsimonious snark option: Appl€ 🙂 . ---
**Author:** ![jerez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c68b51/32.png) [@jerez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jerez)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/50 "2014-05-08T10:23:57Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > **jerez** - I believe the configuration for the hot corner that’s bothering you is accessed like this (writing this from memory, so may not be exact): > [ul] > [li]right click the task bar[/li][li]click properties[/li][li]in the ‘Taskbar/navigation properties’ window, there should be a checkbox labelled something like ‘show the charms menu when I move my mouse to the top right corner’ - uncheck it[/li][/ul] Thank you, **Mangetout**! Just the fix I was looking for, as it hasn’t affected the lower right-hand corner. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/51 "2014-05-08T12:02:31Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > …companies use focus groups and market research to test their products before shipping. Microsoft doesnt even care–they just ship it out, and wait till the public boycotts it… I just want to ask if you really believe this happened. Do you really believe MS releases products without testing or market research? ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/52 "2014-05-08T12:53:33Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I very quickly discovered that my previous use of the Start menu had been a horrible, inefficient thing. I had a great many installed applications and launching them from within the Start menu had meant navigating across multiple nested, scrolling/collapsing columns to try to find the thing I wanted. In fact, this had already become such a chore on XP that I had taken to the habit of creating themed desktop folders containing all my application shortcuts. This was my experience of the start menu, too. The top dozen applications I used got pinned to the taskbar, the next couple of dozen got shortcuts on the desktop, and I only went to the start menu for the obscure ones because it was so very awkward navigating that tiny nested menu. The start screen, as I use it now, is just a start menu that isn’t afraid of occupying some screen real estate and letting me customize it to better meet my needs. ---
**Author:** ![Keeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@Keeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keeve)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/53 "2014-05-08T13:03:47Z")
> [@Blakeyrat](#): > > Secondly, Microsoft’s current user base is north of a billion people. A lot of them are extremely crotchety people who hate to learn new things I enjoy learning new things. I’ll even pay money for a book which would teach them to me. The problem is that when I go looking for a “Intro to Windows XP” or “Intro to Windows 8” or whatever, they are all designed for total novices who know nothing about computers. What I’d absolutely love is something titled “Windows 8 for People Who Already Know Windows XP Very Well”. Any suggestions? It is true that in many cases, I can go to the Internet and search Google for the solution to my problem. But that takes time, and the quality of the answers varies widely. I’d love a single reference work that would cover even 50% of my questions. ---
**Author:** ![Keeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@Keeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keeve)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/54 "2014-05-08T13:07:26Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I just want to ask if you really believe this happened. Do you really believe MS releases products without testing or market research? I have no personal knowledge of these facts. But it is my opinion that if they do in fact conduct market research, the quality of that research is not as good as the quality of the research that led to [New Coke](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_coke). ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/55 "2014-05-08T13:52:09Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Do you really believe MS releases products without testing or market research? Well, it’s hard to believe that intelligent people can do stupid things. I’m sure somebody, somewhere, in the Microsoft headquarters asked for some market research to be done.Then he published a contract, and accepted bids from market research companies. But I’m guessing that when he signed the contract with the research company, he also told the researcher what answers he expected to get…and sure enough, he got 'em. Microsoft almost admits it, too: When they released 8.1,they did us a favor, and [explained why:](http://www.express.co.uk/news/science-technology/437529/Microsoft-release-Windows-8-1-update-in-reaction-to-customer-complaints)" We listened to your feedback and are delivering many of the improvements you asked for." Note that they only started listening AFTER they realized that 8.0 failed to give people what they wanted… The whole fiasco could have been avoided just by telling their market researchers to hold a few hands-on focus groups with real people, and not with experienced computer geeks. Just take a laptop with windows 8 beta version to a church, and ask the sunday school teachers to try it out.Then _listen_ to their complaints. (on edit: I just realized this thread is in GQ . sorry!) 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/56 "2014-05-08T14:11:05Z")
I wonder what the overlap is between “people who think Microsoft rammed something they don’t want down their throats” and “people who think we should do away with the penny?” Other than a problem that lies more with vBulletin than 8.1.1, I really like the new OS. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/57 "2014-05-08T16:25:59Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > The whole fiasco could have been avoided just by telling their market researchers to hold a few hands-on focus groups with real people, and not with experienced computer geeks. Just take a laptop with windows 8 beta version to a church, and ask the sunday school teachers to try it out.Then _listen_ to their complaints. As it happens, I’m a Sunday school teacher myself. (Although I am also a computer geek). I recently bought Windows 8 laptops for my mother (who previously only used XP for 3 years), my wife (who hasn’t used a computer before) and my two nieces (who previously used Windows 7. Results: Mum: Absolutely loves it. Can’t understand why XP was so unfriendly. Wife: Struggles with it (but honestly, is not likely to fare better with any other computing platform) Nieces: hated it for exactly a day, then adapted - now it’s normal for them. Me: Hated it for half a day, then discovered its strengths and now like it at least as much as Win7 (more in some ways) Most of the people I hear complaining about Win8 _haven’t used it_. ---
**Author:** ![Keeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@Keeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keeve)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/58 "2014-05-08T16:45:52Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I recently bought Windows 8 laptops for … Laptops or tablets? In other words, do they use a mouse (or equivalent pointer) or a finger? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/59 "2014-05-08T16:50:00Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > Laptops or tablets? In other words, do they use a mouse (or equivalent pointer) or a finger? Mostly laptops with trackpads. Only my wife’s machine is touchscreen. ---
**Author:** ![Keeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@Keeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keeve)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2014, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850/60 "2014-05-08T17:23:52Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Mostly laptops with trackpads. Only my wife’s machine is touchscreen. Okay. Color me impressed! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windows-8-1-vs-7/687850.md?page=4)