# Windshield wipers are archaic. Why no advancements? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 24, 2018, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827 "2018-09-24T12:53:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![jjakucyk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3d9bf3/32.png) [@jjakucyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjakucyk)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/41 "2018-09-24T18:40:13Z")
I never found RainX to be all that long-lasting. It’s borderline miraculous when first applied (after a lot of buffing to get rid of the streaks) but before long it needs to be reapplied, which can be quite a chore. The RainX windshield washer fluid helps to solve that, but more of it gets on the wiper blades. That causes them to stutter in heavier rains. It does make scraping off ice a lot easier too though, which is a big plus. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/42 "2018-09-24T18:46:44Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > The technology of eating utensils is much, much older than windshield wipers. Why aren’t you clamoring for some modern, new & improved, high-tech way of eating food? > [@Wikipedia](#): > > In the US, patents for sporks and proto-sporks have been issued. A combined spoon, fork, and knife closely resembling the modern spork was invented by Samuel W. Francis and issued U.S. Patent 147,119 in February 1874. … ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/43 "2018-09-24T18:57:01Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > The technology of eating utensils is much, much older than windshield wipers. Why aren’t you clamoring for some modern, new & improved, high-tech way of eating food? Ah, [but I am](https://www.amazon.com/Hog-Wild-Twirling-Spaghetti-Fork/dp/B001HXD4U2). ---
**Author:** ![Hermitian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hermitian/32/470_2.png) [@Hermitian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermitian)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/44 "2018-09-24T19:17:04Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Why aren’t you clamoring for some modern, new & improved, high-tech way of eating food? Be [very careful](https://xkcd.com/419/). You are toying with powerful forces. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/45 "2018-09-24T19:38:24Z")
We had a thread not too long ago in which wipers on commercial aircraft were discussed. Apparently they have an extra fast speed setting compared to car wipers and are a lot more heavy-duty and a lot louder, but otherwise much the same and neither better nor worse in effectiveness. If that’s the best they can do on a $200 million jetliner, you probably shouldn’t expect much better on your car. > [@kayaker](#): > > I’ve yet to get a definitive answer on my Rain-X/headlights question. > > Pennsylvania state law specifically says drivers must have their headlights on _when you have your wipers going._ That’s how the law is worded. I think it’s a good law. > > _But_, it could be raining buckets and a Rain-X treated car will not need the wipers running at highway speeds. Do my headlights need to be on?😕 You’ve already got some good answers, but look at it this way. Suppose you were driving an old shitbox in Pennsylvania in the pouring rain, and the wipers weren’t on because the wipers on this particular shitbox were, like, busted. So you couldn’t see ten feet in front of your fogged-up rain-soaked windshield, and nobody could see you, either, in the pouring rain, because your headlights were off. Do you think a judge would say, “this exemplary citizen is not guilty of the headlight violation because his wipers weren’t on”? As an aside, IMHO your headlights should be on all the time anyway. In some jurisdictions it’s an automotive standard. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/46 "2018-09-24T21:53:09Z")
This thread reminded me of [Ford’s Instaclear/Quickclear technology](https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/heres-story-fords-unusual-heated-windshield-281474979834206). In the mid-1980s, Ford engineers got the brilliant idea to add a micro-wire mesh between the layers of windshield glass, basically an invisible version of a rear window defroster. The good news, it cleared snow and ice remarkably well. The bad news: 1. Like a rear defroster, it would overheat after a few minutes, so it had to have an automatic shutoff, which meant the car still had to have a standard front defroster. 2. The wiring harness was fragile and broke frequently 3. The mesh interfered with the RFID sensors that were beginning to become popular (EZ-Pass, etc.) 4. Anytime anything happened to either the unit or the windshield, both had to be replaced, at a cost that was IIRC, 2x - 3x that of a standard windshield. The technology never really caught on in the North American market, although it’s somewhat more popular in Europe. The moral of the story is that _better isn’t always better_. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/47 "2018-09-24T21:55:08Z")
Guess what kind of windshield you can get on the Transit Connect 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/48 "2018-09-24T22:10:00Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Repeat after me: “Old” does NOT equal “obsolete.” > > Write that down on paper 100 times, or as long as it takes to sink in. Paper? Hey old man, how about I just tweet it and ask everyone to retweet it? ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/49 "2018-09-24T22:14:17Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > This thread reminded me of [Ford’s Instaclear/Quickclear technology](https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/heres-story-fords-unusual-heated-windshield-281474979834206). In the mid-1980s, Ford engineers got the brilliant idea to add a micro-wire mesh between the layers of windshield glass, basically an invisible version of a rear window defroster. > > The good news, it cleared snow and ice remarkably well. The bad news: > > 1. Like a rear defroster, it would overheat after a few minutes, so it had to have an automatic shutoff, which meant the car still had to have a standard front defroster. > > 2. The wiring harness was fragile and broke frequently > > 3. The mesh interfered with the RFID sensors that were beginning to become popular (EZ-Pass, etc.) > > 4. Anytime anything happened to either the unit or the windshield, both had to be replaced, at a cost that was IIRC, 2x - 3x that of a standard windshield. > > The technology never really caught on in the North American market, although it’s somewhat more popular in Europe. > > The moral of the story is that _better isn’t always better_. I think they may have improved on the original now. On a frosty morning, my screen clears in about three or four minutes and I can watch my neighbours scraping away with plastic scrapers and de-icer. One guy I knew used hot water to clear his and had to drive to work with no windscreen. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/50 "2018-09-24T22:45:08Z")
Good responses. Thanks. O.K., now here’s something from left-field: Why even have a windshield? Why can’t we mount a couple cameras on the car and look at a screen? Or VR googles? Cameras won’t require wipers. (Or if they do, they could be edited out using a digital filter). And without all that glass I would think the car would be safer. Nutty? ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/51 "2018-09-24T23:11:23Z")
Glass doesn’t fail by suddenly turning opaque. ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [September 24, 2018, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/52 "2018-09-24T23:33:28Z")
Well, you wouldn’t need to get rid of the glass, but cameras and other sensors could be used to create an augmented reality, perhaps with a heads up display, to assist in seeing the road when windshield conditions are less than ideal. It may be pricey, but not too farfetched. Our Subaru already has two forward facing cameras, so part of the hardware is there. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/53 "2018-09-25T00:02:15Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > O.K., now here’s something from left-field: > > Why even have a windshield? Jeep Wrangler. Decades ahead of its time. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/54 "2018-09-25T00:44:14Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > Guess what kind of windshield you can get on the Transit Connect 😉 Which was developed and manufactured in Europe for the European market and wasn’t imported into the U.S. until five years later.😉 ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/55 "2018-09-25T01:41:54Z")
> [@california\_jobcase](#): > > One thing I will lament is the loss of refillable wiper blades. Now we have to buy the whole blade and not just the rubber wipey part. When I had cars with rear wipers, I did figure out how to disassemble the wiper and refill it with a piece of the rubber from the old front wipers. It worked great and I got three refills out of one old insert. It does seem that there are probably better polymers out there to make the blades out of so they would last longer. > . I noticed those are gone too. I wonder why they aren’t made now. You used to be able to just buy the rubber wiper part and switch that out, now everywhere only sells the entire wiper apparatus including the metal handle. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/56 "2018-09-25T01:52:13Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > Good responses. Thanks. > > O.K., now here’s something from left-field: > > Why even have a windshield? Why can’t we mount a couple cameras on the car and look at a screen? Or VR googles? Cameras won’t require wipers. (Or if they do, they could be edited out using a digital filter). And without all that glass I would think the car would be safer. Nutty? Probably because the technology of ever present cameras is new. Plus a small screen doesn’t provide the clarity of a window. Fwiw, many newer cars do have back up cameras which are nice, I think they just became mandatory on new cars. But those are for seeing in areas you can’t see even with a window. Several car models have 360 degree cameras. But what’s the appeal of taking out the windshield and replacing it with a windshield sized display? Unless you have a display that can digitally remove environmental hazards like fog, rain, snow, etc. Or one that has excellent night vision. I could see a display that shows what you’d see out the windshield but removes the effects of snow, rain and fog. That is more of an additional display than a replacement for the windshield. But I guess one that totally eliminated a windshield just isn’t here. ---
**Author:** ![am77494](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d2c977/32.png) [@am77494](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/am77494)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/57 "2018-09-25T02:43:08Z")
Part of the reason why there are no advancements is the removal of dirt/water from a surface (windshield) is a fluid mechanics boundary layer problem. If you apply soap to your hands and don’t rub the hands, they won’t get as clean. You can wash a wine glass many times with detergent/water but a single good scrub will clean it. A ceiling fan will collect dust on its blades even though there is high air flow around the blades. Fluids behave very differently in the thin film on any surface than in the bulk. I doubt there will be anything as effective as the wiper blade simply because it breaks the boundary layer. ---
**Author:** ![Steven\_G](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steven_g/32/5080_2.png) [@Steven\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steven_G)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/58 "2018-09-25T11:50:08Z")
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear\_view\_screen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear_view_screen) [https://gizmodo.com/mclaren-is-using-fighter-jet-technology-for-wiper-free-1484213049](https://gizmodo.com/mclaren-is-using-fighter-jet-technology-for-wiper-free-1484213049) ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/59 "2018-09-25T13:42:32Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > Cameras won’t require wipers. (Or if they do, they could be edited out using a digital filter) Why do you think the cameras won’t require wipers? Sure, you could have a recessed mount and avoid a lot of the direct rain, but that truck splashing a puddle onto your car is going get the lens or lens cover wet. And people generally don’t have a problem with the visual presence of wipers. ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2018, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827/60 "2018-09-25T15:11:53Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > I noticed those are gone too. I wonder why they aren’t made now. You used to be able to just buy the rubber wiper part and switch that out, now everywhere only sells the entire wiper apparatus including the metal handle. I think my dealer still sells the rubber inserts, but they charge a lot for them. You can also get them on the Internet (but Costco is currently selling aftermarket replacement blades for $9 each, cheaper than many rubber refills). It’s the aftermarket auto parts stores that don’t sell refills anymore. The only type I see in Advance Auto, for example, are one-size-fits-all where you have to cut it to size. Those suck. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windshield-wipers-are-archaic-why-no-advancements/821827.md?page=4)