# Windsor Knot or Windsor Not **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 17, 2013, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501 "2013-01-17T13:07:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/21 "2013-01-17T15:27:10Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > So, is it a tie “clip” or a tie “magazine”? The latter is for assault ties. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/22 "2013-01-17T15:33:20Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > The latter is for assault ties. I’m all choked up. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/23 "2013-01-17T15:35:39Z")
What’s the proper knot for ties that hang in the closet gathering dust until someone dies or gets married, at which time the wearer is (hopefully) far from the center of attention and considers the event a success if he doesn’t actually spill food on the tie? ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/24 "2013-01-17T15:39:26Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > What’s the proper knot for ties that hang in the closet gathering dust until someone dies or gets married, at which time the wearer is (hopefully) far from the center of attention and considers the event a success if he doesn’t actually spill food on the tie? I assume that these ties are 10-15 years old (or more), and possibly out of fashion? What ‘knot’ to wear, indeed. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/25 "2013-01-17T15:43:46Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > I assume that these ties are 10-15 years old (or more), and possibly out of fashion? Well, the newer ones, yeah. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/26 "2013-01-17T15:50:06Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > What’s the proper knot for ties that hang in the closet gathering dust until someone dies or gets married, at which time the wearer is (hopefully) far from the center of attention and considers the event a success if he doesn’t actually spill food on the tie? I wonder what years of having to wear a suit and tie does to you? Cutting off that flow of blood to your brain, and all… Well, now that I’m a teacher, my ties are waiting for a funeral. And some of them are still tied, ready to be slipped over my head. [OP’s head explodes] [or it will, as soon as he realizes that there are people out there without his devotion to “style”… who look better than he does!] ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/27 "2013-01-17T16:04:03Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > Your position seems to be based on the mistaken belief that there are lock step rules to style, when in fact there are not. Remember, fashion is for those with out taste and etiquette is for those without manners. This. It really shouldn’t surprise anyone that so many if these people inhabit the Straight Dope. ---
**Author:** ![brad\_d](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@brad\_d](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brad_d)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/28 "2013-01-17T17:08:17Z")
That’s a mighty impressive list of ways to knot a tie in **Gary Kumquat** ’s link. Back when I was teaching myself by trial-and-error how to tie a tie, I stopped worrying about it when I came across a method that appeared to work; it appears this method is known as the four-in-hand knot. On the increasingly-rare occasions where a tie is appropriate, I still just go with that. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/29 "2013-01-17T17:35:37Z")
Windsor knots are for blowhards and insurance salesmen (note:sets are not exclusive). I despise them. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/30 "2013-01-17T17:53:02Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > There is no such thing as a “Half Windsor”. > What you call a “Half Windsor” is more accurately described as “Not Knowing How to Tie a Fucking Tie”. > > Thank you for your attention. Now I’m sad. For about twenty years I tied my ties some crazy way my mother taught me. Then the Internet cam along and I taught myself to tie a half Windsor. I was so happy with the improvement. Even my wife noticed. Now, I’m a douch again… ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/31 "2013-01-17T17:55:41Z")
> [@digs](#): > > I wonder what years of having to wear a suit and tie does to you? Cutting off that flow of blood to your brain, and all… Well, now that I’m a teacher, my ties are waiting for a funeral. And some of them are still tied, ready to be slipped over my head. I wore ties as a requirement for the some of the positions I held. I never cinched them up or buttoned the top button of my shirt unless I had to go talk to the big boss or speak before the board. Hated the damn things, and they gave me headaches if I had to wear one cinched for any extended period. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/32 "2013-01-17T17:57:32Z")
Hi. My name is Alessan, I’m a 38-year-old middle-class urban college graduate, and I have no fucking idea how to tie a tie. What am I, a lawyer or something? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/33 "2013-01-17T18:00:19Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > What am I, a lawyer or something? [A farmer, perhaps?](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_P7yWnAAd0) ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/34 "2013-01-17T18:28:43Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Meh. Not my favourite, but definitely a recognised knot: > > [http://www.tcm.phy.cam.ac.uk/~tmf20/tieknots.shtml](http://www.tcm.phy.cam.ac.uk/~tmf20/tieknots.shtml) > > Pratt knot for the win (symmetrical, does less damage to the tie) According to that site, the half-Windsor is worn by Will Smith, beloved American actor, and the Windsor is worn by Vladimir Putin and other dictators. So I guess it comes down to how much you love America and freedom. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/35 "2013-01-17T18:40:00Z")
I wish more people dressed up for work and I have egalitarian reasons for wishing so. Notice that the dress down period has coincided with a time when your employer ‘gives’ you a device like a smart phone so that you can always answer emails. You are essentially expected to kind of always be at work, similarly you get to dress like down, more like you would if you didn’t have to come to the office. I like having work clothes that you wear at work and then not work clothes when you are not at work, but now your expected to kind of always be at work, the distinction in ‘my’ time and ‘their’ time has been erased. ---
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/36 "2013-01-17T18:49:50Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > I wish more people dressed up for work and I have egalitarian reasons for wishing so. Notice that the dress down period has coincided with a time when your employer ‘gives’ you a device like a smart phone so that you can always answer emails. You are essentially expected to kind of always be at work, similarly you get to dress like down, more like you would if you didn’t have to come to the office. I like having work clothes that you wear at work and then not work clothes when you are not at work, but now your expected to kind of always be at work, the distinction in ‘my’ time and ‘their’ time has been erased. It’s a shame that this problem couldn’t be remedied by something like buying different clothes for work/play and then turning off the fucking phone. ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/37 "2013-01-17T19:01:06Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Hi. My name is Alessan, I’m a 38-year-old middle-class urban college graduate, and I have no fucking idea how to tie a tie. What am I, a lawyer or something? _“You got city hands, Mr. Alessan. You been countin’ money all your life.”_ Quint from Jaws on tying knots. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/38 "2013-01-17T19:10:57Z")
> [@BubbaDog](#): > > It’s a shame that this problem couldn’t be remedied by something like buying different clothes for work/play and then turning off the fucking phone. Well, my point is that they have created a culture whereby employees have given up significant free time for not wearing ties. I wasn’t talking about my situation, but all of ours. Of course, its the Dope which prides its self on non-elective celibacy, wearing flip flops to funerals, owning too many cats and watching porn. ---
**Author:** ![prodicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d9b06d/32.png) [@prodicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/prodicus)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/39 "2013-01-17T19:16:14Z")
> [@lieu](#): > > Beats a Half Nelson though, at least in an interview. I feel like this comment deserves some recognition. It made me laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2013, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501/40 "2013-01-17T19:59:04Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > Windsor knots are for blowhards and insurance salesmen (note:sets are not exclusive). I despise them. At least they look better than the lopsided mess of a half-Windsor. Never saw he Pratt before. I’ll have to wear that to a funeral I’m going to on Saturday. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/windsor-knot-or-windsor-not/647501.md?page=3)