# With the Mets' loss and the Philly's win, we are on the cusp of a historic collapse. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 28, 2007, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768 "2007-09-28T02:59:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/1 "2007-09-28T02:59:11Z")
I don’t have any particular love or hate for either team. As a baseball fan, I find this collaspe fascinating as it is to the team that held the record collaspe, the 1964 Phillies. [QUOTE=wiki] [“Phold” of 1964](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philadelphia_Phillies#.22Phold.22_of_1964)… During 1962 and 1963, the Phillies began to climb back to respectability, and throughout the 1964 season, they seemed destined to make it to the World Series, with excellent performances from players such as rookie third baseman Dick Allen (called “Richie” in the news media of the time), starters Jim Bunning (obtained from the Detroit Tigers at the start of the season to shore up the pitching staff) and Chris Short, and star right fielder Johnny Callison. TV Guide went to press with a World Series preview that featured a photo of Connie Mack Stadium. **However, from a 6½-game lead on the Cincinnati Reds with 12 games remaining in the season, Philadelphia collapsed in a 10-game losing streak (the first seven played at home).** The crucial series came when the now second-place Phillies traveled to St. Louis to play the Cardinals after their losing home stand. They dropped the first game of the series to Bob Gibson by a 5-1 score, their eighth loss in a row, dropping them to third place. The Cardinals would sweep the three-game set and assume first place for good. [/QUOTE] So with only 3 games left and the Mets trailing San Diego for the Wild Card, the Mets could set the bar to a new low for blowing a late season lead. This is worth watch for any baseball fans. Jim ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/2 "2007-09-28T03:47:47Z")
[QUOTE=What Exit?] I don’t have any particular love or hate for either team. As a baseball fan, I find this collaspe fascinating as it is to the team that held the record collaspe, the 1964 Phillies. So with only 3 games left and the Mets trailing San Diego for the Wild Card, the Mets could set the bar to a new low for blowing a late season lead. This is worth watch for any baseball fans. Jim [/QUOTE] Dude, I stubbed my toe earlier tonight. Would you like to BASH IT WITH A HAMMER, while you’re here? ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/3 "2007-09-28T03:50:03Z")
Aw, c’mon. You live close enough to be aware of the tremendous power contained in _The Philadelphia Suck._ The Beagles are off to a terrible start, so it’s up to the Phillies to get the town hoping, sell the tickets, get fans tuned in to the games, and so forth. It will continue until a moment when they seem poised to savor the wine of victory, a heartbeat away from joy, and they will spin, flip, crash, and burn. You’ll step out onto your patio, cock your ear to the south, and hear a roar of disbelief and profanity, as millions of fans are left alone, cheated lovers on the altar of championship. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/4 "2007-09-28T03:50:11Z")
My closest co-workers are all Met fans - one was at the game tonight - and the tone of our baseball discussions has changed completely in the last week. I felt bad watching the game tonight. The crowd at Shea was almost silent, and you could almost hear them all thinking “This CAN’T be happening.” ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/5 "2007-09-28T03:51:24Z")
[QUOTE=storyteller0910] Dude, I stubbed my toe earlier tonight. Would you like to BASH IT WITH A HAMMER, while you’re here? [/QUOTE] 😃 , sorry, but it is news worthy, or at least Café worthy. I hope your toe is feeling better. Please remember, this is only the late season record. I am still recovering from the greatest collapse ever in sports. Jim ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/6 "2007-09-28T03:54:28Z")
The capability of the Phillies to really hose things up cannot be underestimated. Don’t put it past them to go ahead by a game tomorrow and then blow it in the last two games, possibly in some sort of comical fashion. I’m also not sure this collapse matches the 1964 collapse. The Mets weren’t that far ahead that late in the season. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/7 "2007-09-28T03:58:46Z")
Oh, one other cool thing: two Phillie batters, it seems, will break significant batting records this year. Jimmy Rollins now has 704 official at bats; the record is 705, set by Willie Wilson in 1980, so he will almost certainly break that record. Ryan Howard has, in fact, set the new single season record for strikeouts. He’s now at 197 whiffs and has a good shot of 200 whiffs before the season closes. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/8 "2007-09-28T04:01:36Z")
[QUOTE=RickJay] The capability of the Phillies to really hose things up cannot be underestimated. Don’t put it past them to go ahead by a game tomorrow and then blow it in the last two games, possibly in some sort of comical fashion. I’m also not sure this collapse matches the 1964 collapse. The Mets weren’t that far ahead that late in the season. [/QUOTE] It depends on how it is being measured. The Mets were up 7. No one up 7 that late in the season have ever eliminated themselves before apparently. My quote in the Op does not actually cover that fact, so I ask forgiveness. As to the Phillies ability to choke, I am well aware of it, what you describe would be in complete tune with everything that makes the Phillies the Phillies. Jim ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/9 "2007-09-28T04:05:12Z")
[QUOTE=RickJay] The capability of the Phillies to really hose things up cannot be underestimated. Don’t put it past them to go ahead by a game tomorrow and then blow it in the last two games, possibly in some sort of comical fashion. I’m also not sure this collapse matches the 1964 collapse. The Mets weren’t that far ahead that late in the season. [/QUOTE] The joke in town during the early 90’s was, “What do Mitch Williams and Billy Graham have in common? They’re both capable of making 60 thousand people leap to their feet and scream, “Jesus Christ!”” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Yorikke](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yorikke/32/4335_2.png) [@Yorikke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yorikke)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/10 "2007-09-28T05:31:12Z")
I never would have expected it to turn out like this, and, in fact, it ain’t over, but I couldn’t be happier. I despise the Mets and Yanks - it was bred into me by my dad, a Dodgers die hard - and, since moving away from Trenton, NJ, have grown to like the Phils a lot in the last 10 years or so. But I fully expected the Phillies to fade at the end. And even if they DO make the playoffs, will their hitting be enough? Joe ---
**Author:** ![Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e36b37/32.png) [@Not\_A\_Tame\_Lion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_A_Tame_Lion)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/11 "2007-09-28T06:46:50Z")
I’ve been having some hankerings for a taste of the old country lately. So I recently searched the web and found a joint, [jerseyporkroll.com](http://jerseyporkroll.com), that will ship Taylor pork roll anywhere in the country. Ordered eight boxes of the stuff (half for my sister–I’m not a total hog). My shipment arrived today, delivered to my office. As soon as I got home I fried up four slices, and as I sat down to dine on my plate of hammy delight, I turned on the TV and learned that the Mets had lost and that the Phillies had tied them for first place. And for a moment, I was nine years old and back on Frankford Avenue. An omen? Maybe not, but I’ve decided to take it that way. Here’s to the Team Of My Youth–they may get swept out of the playoffs, but I’m confident they’ll pull it off and win the division. Maybe I’ll order some Tastykakes for the playoffs… ---
**Author:** ![H3Knuckles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ba8739/32.png) [@H3Knuckles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/H3Knuckles)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/12 "2007-09-28T07:09:51Z")
Sports were never a big deal in my family, but growing up in SE-PA, I’m quite familiar with the reputation of Philadelphia sports teams. After all, isn’t that the _real_ reason the Rocky statue is so important to the city? We’ll take what champs we can get, even if they’re fictitious. 😛 PS. If I ever got into football, I’d probably root for the Steelers. My siblings all lived in Pittsburgh for at least a few years each (My brother and eldest sister got their Bachelors’ at University of Pittsburgh, and my other sister attended it for a time before transfering to ASU, where my brother has aquired a couple masters’ and is pursueing a PhD). My two sisters root for them (the eldest is very attached to the city now, and only moved because of the poor job market, the younger’s fiancee is from there), and this may be an understatement, but the black-and-gold seem to do pretty well for themselves. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Frosted\_Glass](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frosted_glass/32/3926_2.png) [@Frosted\_Glass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frosted_Glass)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/13 "2007-09-28T07:46:23Z")
This thread is far too depressing… ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/14 "2007-09-28T08:01:35Z")
[QUOTE=What Exit?] This is worth watching for any baseball fans. [/QUOTE] Ahem. Any _Mets fans_ are crying in their sleeves right now. I literally can’t look. I may avoid baseball news all weekend and just see how it shakes out on Monday. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Frosted\_Glass](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frosted_glass/32/3926_2.png) [@Frosted\_Glass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frosted_Glass)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/15 "2007-09-28T08:06:50Z")
[QUOTE=Justin\_Bailey] Ahem. Any _Mets fans_ are crying in their sleeves right now. I literally can’t look. I may avoid baseball news all weekend and just see how it shakes out on Monday. :mad: [/QUOTE] I just wish they would leave us the hell alone but I know thats not going to happen. My entire shift at the bar was dominated with coverage of the Mets collapse. I will be doing my best to avoid sports news outside of football games this weekend too. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/16 "2007-09-28T10:58:47Z")
[QUOTE=wheresgeorge04] But I fully expected the Phillies to fade at the end. And even if they DO make the playoffs, will their hitting be enough? [/QUOTE] You’re kidding with the last bit, yes? ---
**Author:** ![robardin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/43a26b/32.png) [@robardin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robardin)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/17 "2007-09-28T11:45:59Z")
I keep telling myself, “It’s just a game, and I’m not even playing it myself”. So why does it gnaw at me so much that I wake up at 5am and can’t fall back asleep, because the first thought in my head is _I can’t believe they’ve lost 4 in a row at home to the Nationals and Cardinals, and now the season is up to Oliver Perez, John Maine and Mike Pelfrey to win at least two out of three against the Marlins_? ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/18 "2007-09-28T12:09:08Z")
It ain’t much better being a Cubs fan right now either. The Cubs, who had a great few weeks, are trying as hard as possible to get pushed out of the playoffs by getting swept by the Marlins. Thankfully Mil is just as intent on not going to the playoffs as Chicago, so we are still in it, but I won’t be suprised if the Cubs go on to get swept by the REds this weekend just to ruin my October. ( I have left field bleacher seats for the Sat night game in Cinci. It’s going to be crazy at this rate.) ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/19 "2007-09-28T12:51:41Z")
[QUOTE=RickJay] Oh, one other cool thing: two Phillie batters, it seems, will break significant batting records this year. Jimmy Rollins now has 704 official at bats; the record is 705, set by Willie Wilson in 1980, so he will almost certainly break that record. Ryan Howard has, in fact, set the new single season record for strikeouts. He’s now at 197 whiffs and has a good shot of 200 whiffs before the season closes. [/QUOTE] Yeah, I thought that Adam Dunn’s record would stand a while. When Howard was on pace for it in July, I was still thinking, “no way.” Rollins has had an amazing season. Played every game at short, 30/30. Leads (or is second) in total bases. 19 triples, if I’m not mistaken. I love how he moves. I’d pay money just to watch him run around bases for a little while. What a great ball player. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2007, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768/20 "2007-09-28T13:07:00Z")
Well, since the Braves aren’t going to make the playoffs, the next best thing would be a Mets collapse. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-mets-loss-and-the-phillys-win-we-are-on-the-cusp-of-a-historic-collapse/420768.md?page=2)