# With the surging popularity of MMA, is boxing doomed? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 30, 2007, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734 "2007-12-30T21:22:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Shamozzle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shamozzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shamozzle)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2007, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/1 "2007-12-30T21:22:01Z")
Title says it all. ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2007, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/2 "2007-12-30T21:42:14Z")
Boxing is not doomed. Sometimes I’m amazed that it isn’t dead due to the clowns that run it, but it keeps on going. You’ll know that boxing is dead when the first few rows of an MMA fight are populated by the likes of David Beckham, Tiger Woods, Brad and Angie, Sylvester Stallone, Bruce Springsteen and Denzel Washington. And they pay $10K a seat for the privledge. There is no bigger event in sports that a title fight at the MGM Grand. 2007 was a resurgent year for boxing. (BTW, the above mentioned celebs were all present at the Mayweather - Hatton fight a few weeks ago.) ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2007, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/3 "2007-12-30T22:30:23Z")
MMA reminds me of a high-school fight. Lots of grappling and grunting, then a few seconds of action, then back to grappling and grunting. I know these are good athletes who could kill me in two seconds, but it’s boring to me. ---
**Author:** ![Mesquite-oh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a183cd/32.png) [@Mesquite-oh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mesquite-oh)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/4 "2007-12-31T05:49:13Z")
From my perception, boxing has been dying a slow death for some time now if you look at the media coverage that it generates compared to other sports. It appears as if it’s heyday has passed if you look at the amount of media interest. I could easily name dozens of football, baseball, and basketball players, but I could not name even three current boxers. I could probably name more golfers and tennis players (two sports I never watch) due to media coverage. I percieve pro boxing to be more fragmented fixed spectacle than sport. MMA is all over the place right now on television and it is starting to make some headway into mainstream sports media. It may take a couple of likeable personalities as well as a dying off of all of the weaker products for it to really shine and be accepted as more than a novelty. I agree that sometimes it can be boring- one guy gets the other guy on his back, gets between his legs, and then rubs his elbows into his face while the guy on the ground covers up as much as possible. They get up and do it again, and again, and again. Not exactly exciting. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/5 "2007-12-31T06:15:26Z")
[QUOTE=Mesquite-oh] …one guy gets the other guy on his back, gets between his legs… [/QUOTE] Or gets him on his stomach, sits on his ass, and moves like he’s butt raping the guy while repeatedly boxing his ears. WAY too gay, and not in the nice way like the florist down the street. Properly done, and with two well-matched, experienced fighters, boxing is kinda beautiful and fascinating to watch. However, the only place I can find it without cable is on one of the Spanish networks. Yeah, I know I don’t need to speak the language to follow the action or to read the stats, but one week one of the bums on the undercard had three–count 'em, THREE–professional fights! How the hell does a palooka like that get on network TV? He got the shit beat outta him, of course, standing up and without none of that gay stuff. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/6 "2007-12-31T06:22:27Z")
[QUOTE=Lamar Mundane] You’ll know that boxing is dead when the first few rows of an MMA fight are populated by the likes of David Beckham, Tiger Woods, Brad and Angie, Sylvester Stallone, Bruce Springsteen and Denzel Washington. And they pay $10K a seat for the privledge. [/QUOTE] This is already the case in Japan, although the front row seats are filled with A-listers at MMA, K-1 _and_ boxing events. MMA and K-1 events are also routinely broadcast during prime-time on network TV here. Boxing tends to be on only when there’s someone really popular in the ring. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/7 "2007-12-31T13:23:31Z")
[QUOTE=Mesquite-oh] I agree that sometimes it can be boring- one guy gets the other guy on his back, gets between his legs, and then rubs his elbows into his face while the guy on the ground covers up as much as possible. They get up and do it again, and again, and again. Not exactly exciting. [/QUOTE] It’s boring if you don’t understand the ground game. I hardly claim to be an expert, but even in my non-expert observation I can tell that what you’re calling “rubbing elbows in his face” is actually softening up the fighter with short elbow strikes while looking for an opening to pass his guard and/or slap on an arm bar or other submission. When you have two guys who are really strong Brazilian jiu-jitsu practitioners, watching them battle for dominance on the ground is fascinating. > [@dropzone](#): > > Or gets him on his stomach, sits on his ass, and moves like he’s butt raping the guy while repeatedly boxing his ears. WAY too gay, and not in the nice way like the florist down the street. How _enlightened_ your viewpoint is. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/8 "2007-12-31T13:36:07Z")
[QUOTE=Otto] It’s boring if you don’t understand the ground game. [/QUOTE] I understand the ground game very well. I even know how hard it is and how exhausting grappling is…I’ve done it. It’s still fucking boring as hell to watch on TV. I much preferred the PKA back in the day. Too bad that didn’t catch on the way MMA has. ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/9 "2007-12-31T14:12:43Z")
Regardless of what MMA is doing, all of boxings name stars are getting rather old- if they don’t get an influx of popular good young talent, they will struggle- the heavyweight division is now pretty much toast for this reason. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/10 "2007-12-31T14:23:03Z")
I don’t find the ground game boring at all. I find it highly technical and rather fascinating. Anyway, check out [thisi](http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/071220) Sports Guy column about going to the Mayweather-Hatton fight if you think boxing is dead. It’s one of those things that isn’t mainstream, but the people who like it really like it. I pretty much would buy HBO just for the fight package. I bought the last PPV fight. I guess I don’t see boxing growing like MMA, but I don’t really see it dying either. People who are into boxing aren’t going to stop watching it because they’re starting to watch MMA. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/11 "2007-12-31T14:35:03Z")
Doomed? No. It’ll never be as prominent as it was decades ago because there’s more competition, but that’s far from doom. And I think it’s popularity was in decline long before MMA was getting any significant attention. As far as I remember, people have saying the heavyweight division was in trouble due to a lack of personable and interesting champions since Mike Tyson’s heyday passed. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/12 "2007-12-31T14:47:51Z")
For those who find the ground game boring, I suggest [World Combat League](http://www.worldcombatleague.com/). It’s all striking, no ground game and it was invented by Chuck Norris. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/13 "2007-12-31T15:07:17Z")
[QUOTE=Otto] For those who find the ground game boring, I suggest [World Combat League](http://www.worldcombatleague.com/). It’s all striking, no ground game and it was invented by Chuck Norris. [/QUOTE] I’ve watched it a few times. It’s entertaining, but their heavyweights are all fat fuckers who can’t box or kick or kickbox worth a shit. ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/14 "2007-12-31T15:21:23Z")
[QUOTE=Lamar Mundane] There is no bigger event in sports that a title fight at the MGM Grand. 2007 was a resurgent year for boxing. [/QUOTE] ??? You can’t be serious? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/15 "2007-12-31T16:06:04Z")
[QUOTE=RikWriter] I’ve watched it a few times. It’s entertaining, but their heavyweights are all fat fuckers who can’t box or kick or kickbox worth a shit. [/QUOTE] Heavyweights just kind of suck for the most part regardless. That’s one thing I like about WEC, they’ve pretty much jettisoned the heavyweight division in favor of the lighter weight classes. Now if they would put out some new material a little more often instead of just repeating the same six sets of fights… ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/16 "2007-12-31T16:50:39Z")
[QUOTE=Otto] Heavyweights just kind of suck for the most part regardless. That’s one thing I like about WEC, they’ve pretty much jettisoned the heavyweight division in favor of the lighter weight classes. Now if they would put out some new material a little more often instead of just repeating the same six sets of fights… [/QUOTE] It isn’t the same six sets of fights, it’s Urijah Faber beating up every man in America between 140 and 145 pounds in weight. It just _looks_ like the same fight over and over… 😉 ETA: Ironically, one of the few MMA heavyweights who was ever an exception to the rule - Frank Mir - is now a color commentator for the WEC and barely fights. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/17 "2007-12-31T17:00:52Z")
Read a lengthy article about Wilfred Benitez the other day. The guy was amazing back in his prime. Took down Duran, and his bout with Sugar Ray was epic. He’s only a couple of years older than me. But he is essentially a child, not able to care for himself. I’ve been a big fan of boxing for a long time. And boxer’s dementia is nothing new. But this image of El Radar had quite an effect on me and my appreciation of boxing. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/18 "2007-12-31T17:08:35Z")
[QUOTE=OneCentStamp] It isn’t the same six sets of fights, it’s Urijah Faber beating up every man in America between 140 and 145 pounds in weight. It just _looks_ like the same fight over and over… 😉 [/QUOTE] Oh god, I fucking _hate_ Urijah Faber. More specifically, I hate the constant fawning over him that spews forth from the mouths of the commentators, especially the not-Frank-Mir commentator. Yes, I get it, not-Frank-Mir, Urijah Faber is the best thing to hit the fight game since the invention of the spit bucket, and he’s strong and powerful and handsome and you want to snuggle up next to him and whisper in his ear how much you _lurrve_ him. “Frank, wouldn’t you agree that Urijah is looking _particularly_ like the Lord God King tonight? That his eyes are blazing with a _special_ intensity and that little strip of facial hair he sports is _amazingly_ well-groomed and shapely for this fight?” There in fact is another fighter in the ring who every so often does something worthy of comment. “And Urijah goes to work!” Shut. The fuck. Up. ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2007, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/with-the-surging-popularity-of-mma-is-boxing-doomed/431734/19 "2007-12-31T17:16:31Z")
[QUOTE=Otto] Oh god, I fucking _hate_ Urijah Faber. More specifically, I hate the constant fawning over him that spews forth from the mouths of the commentators, especially the not-Frank-Mir commentator. Yes, I get it, not-Frank-Mir, Urijah Faber is the best thing to hit the fight game since the invention of the spit bucket, and he’s strong and powerful and handsome and you want to snuggle up next to him and whisper in his ear how much you _lurrve_ him. “Frank, wouldn’t you agree that Urijah is looking _particularly_ like the Lord God King tonight? That his eyes are blazing with a _special_ intensity and that little strip of facial hair he sports is _amazingly_ well-groomed and shapely for this fight?” There in fact is another fighter in the ring who every so often does something worthy of comment. “And Urijah goes to work!” Shut. The fuck. Up. [/QUOTE] I agree with every single thing in the above-quoted paragraph. During the fawning post-fight interviews where Mir kisses ass while Faber mugs for the camera and puts that _goddamned stupid baseball cap on sideways **ohgodI’dliketocavehisheadinwithapeatshovel** _, I wonder if Mir is secretly dying to pick the smug kid up by the scruff of his neck and chuck him over the cage and into about the 11th row.