# Without looking it up, do you know of these two events? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 27, 2013, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293 "2013-08-27T13:54:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Doggo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/87869e/32.png) [@Doggo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doggo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/81 "2013-08-28T09:30:53Z")
I’m not an American. I knew about John Brown because of the rhym ( John Brown’s body ) and the movie with Ronald Regan that had John Brown in it. I don’t remember much about the movie, except for one very strange scene where a couple of freed slaves decided to go back to slavery because they felt safer than with the rebellion. Frankly, it seemed as though the film was on the side of slavery and against John Brown. Certainly, the government was, as they sent the army to hang him. I also thought of the MLK march straight away. I wonder what he’d think of today’s USA? ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 10:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/82 "2013-08-28T10:24:58Z")
Male, 54, knew about both. I’m from West Virginia, an in school we learned pretty extensively about the raid on the federal arsenal at Harper’s Ferry. I think people today may be less aware of Brown’s actions and legacy because historians have wavered on how they felt about him. We were basically taught that he was a nut, a wild-eyed fanatic, but there seems to be more recent acknowledgement that Brown acted out of (admittedly extreme) principles. Fanatic, yes; wild-eyed, no. And I would take exception to claims made upthread that he didn’t have an impact. I assumed the ‘march’ in question was the 1963 civil rights march, possibly because of the recent extensive anniversary coverage. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/83 "2013-08-28T10:32:56Z")
(bolded by me for focus) > [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > Just wanted to point out that he scared the livin’ hell out of lots of northern whitefolks, too (and back then, that was essentially all northerners). It was the last thing anyone one (even most of the abolitionists, who were definitely a minority in the north) wanted. **Nobody wanted a slave revolt** , which is why John Brown failed so miserably. At least, that is what I’ve learned (I wasn’t alive at the time). Especially the slaves- he hadn’t asked them first. “You want us to do _what_?!?” ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/84 "2013-08-28T10:44:43Z")
1. I know who John Brown is and what happened at Harper’s Ferry. I’ve never heard of anything called “The” March on Washington and there have been a lot of marches there so I found the question vague to the point of meaninglessness. ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Boods](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5e9695/32.png) [@Ms\_Boods](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms_Boods)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/85 "2013-08-28T11:14:00Z")
Knew both; 47; history professor (albeit not in American history) John Brown from 8th and 10th grade history class in the States (and also from the \*Little House on the Prairie \*books, oddly enough); MLK and march on Washington was part of my lectures when I taught history of rock, also in the States. Neither of them feature in the modules I current teach, although MLK and the Civil Rights movement could show up as a student presentation in the annual spring senior seminar I team-teach on the presentation of history in the media. ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Boods](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5e9695/32.png) [@Ms\_Boods](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms_Boods)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/86 "2013-08-28T11:17:34Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > I wasn’t surprised that non-Americans would think of the war of 1812, because they are not as exposed to all the media this week about the anniversary. The anniversary of King’s speech, &c., has been covered on the BBC; it’s been on the front page of the home page for the BBC news website. (sorry about the double post) ---
**Author:** ![fanganga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/58f4c7/32.png) [@fanganga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fanganga)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/87 "2013-08-28T11:35:57Z")
> [@Ms\_Boods](#): > > The anniversary of King’s speech, &c., has been covered on the BBC; it’s been on the front page of the home page for the BBC news website. > > (sorry about the double post) The BBC article I found refers to the speech in the head and calls the march “The March for Jobs and Freedom”. As a Brit, I didn’t know of the march under any name until I saw this thread - my knowledge of the US civil rights movement is limited to Rosa Parks and the Bus Boycott, Martin Luther King and the I Have a Dream speech (but not the context of the march and the rally), and images of newsreel footage of black men with “I am a man” placards being bullied by authorities. ---
**Author:** ![DeweyDecibel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d26b3c/32.png) [@DeweyDecibel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeweyDecibel)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/88 "2013-08-28T11:36:14Z")
I’m still confused about the “March on Washington” name. Was this a known term before the anniversary coverage started? As I said above, I’m quite familiar with MLK and the Dream speech, and the march (lowercase m). I’ve read about it in multiple classes, and generally feel I have a decent knowledge of the civil rights movement. Yet I’ve never heard of it referred to as **The** March on Washington. I wasn’t aware any one march rose above the others to get the title of _The_. So, everyone else…was this a common descriptor until recently, or were you guessing because it’s the most famous march, or know due to the recent coverage? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/89 "2013-08-28T12:14:39Z")
John Brown was a crazy motherfucker whose life Django Unchained was based on. (Yeah, I know he’s white). I live near DC, the march stuff is on NPR 24/7 right now. Not quite fair. I’m a 29 year old engineer. ---
**Author:** ![DrumBum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e79b87/32.png) [@DrumBum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrumBum)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/90 "2013-08-28T12:18:58Z")
I knew both of these but not because I remember them from my High school history class. Our daughter is attending school in Virgina and we stopped in Harpers’ Ferry while driving around. It is quite a scenic area and I visited John Brown’s fort. As to your second query, given today’s date I assume the answer you are seeking is the events of 50 years ago. Male, age 52 ---
**Author:** ![Billy-o](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e8c25b/32.png) [@Billy-o](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billy-o)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/91 "2013-08-28T12:22:07Z")
Yep, I knew both. 42-year-old white male. My childhood public school was darn good when it came to history, though. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/92 "2013-08-28T12:26:22Z")
Yes to both. But I’m a history buff who frequently visits Harpers Ferry, and I work in downtown Washington, DC. So I ought to know. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/93 "2013-08-28T14:31:49Z")
> [@Doggo](#): > > I knew about John Brown because of the hymn (John Brown’s Body) and the movie with Ronald Reagan that had John Brown in it. _ **Santa Fe Trail** _, WB, 1940. Directed by Michael Curtiz and starring Errol Flynn, Olivia de Havilland, Raymond Massey and Ronald Reagan. > **[Santa Fe Trail (film)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Fe_Trail_(film))** > > Santa Fe Trail is a 1940 American western film directed by Michael Curtiz and starring Errol Flynn as J. E. B. "Jeb" Stuart, Olivia de Havilland, Raymond Massey as John Brown, Ronald Reagan as George Armstrong Custer and Alan Hale. Written by Robert Buckner, the film is critical of the abolitionist John Brown and his controversial campaign against slavery before the American Civil War. In a subplot, Jeb Stuart and George Armstrong Custer—who are depicted as friends from the same West Point gra... ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/94 "2013-08-28T14:36:36Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > I’m surprised they didn’t know what the march on Washington was - or rather, that they couldn’t make a guess. There’s been a lot of marches on Washington, but that’s the most famous. > > I only know of John Brown and Harper’s Ferry because I’m from Kansas, and we were taught about him since he’s a native son and in all the social studies books. I usually change my profile pic on Facebook to [this image](http://www.onthisdeity.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/hf-john-brown.jpg) on Kansas Day, and most of my Indiana friends have no idea who he is. John Brown a native son of Kansas? Important to the early pre-statehood history of Kansas, something of a wild-eyed killer for political reasons, I guess, but I don’t think he was born there. Vermont? Upstate Adirondack New York? ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/95 "2013-08-28T14:39:35Z")
I’m from the era when geography/ history/ economics were actually taught in schools. I’m well over 60. Yes, I know very well what you were talking about, Brown and his followers seizing the arsenal at harper’s ferry, getting shot or hung for their trouble I honestly don’t know, still, what he thought he would accomplish. I think he was more than a bit bemented by that time. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/96 "2013-08-28T14:39:52Z")
Yeah, I know about both of them. I’m an Australian aged 60. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/97 "2013-08-28T14:47:07Z")
> [@crucible](#): > > John Brown a native son of Kansas? Important to the early pre-statehood history of Kansas, something of a wild-eyed killer for political reasons, I guess, but I don’t think he was born there. Vermont? Upstate Adirondack New York? Connecticut. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/98 "2013-08-28T15:19:32Z")
> [@DeweyDecibel](#): > > I’m still confused about the “March on Washington” name. Was this a known term before the anniversary coverage started? As I said above, I’m quite familiar with MLK and the Dream speech, and the march (lowercase m). I’ve read about it in multiple classes, and generally feel I have a decent knowledge of the civil rights movement. Yet I’ve never heard of it referred to as **The** March on Washington. I wasn’t aware any one march rose above the others to get the title of _The_. > > So, everyone else…was this a common descriptor until recently, or were you guessing because it’s the most famous march, or know due to the recent coverage? Yes. Referring to the MLK speech as “The March on Washington” is \*not \*something that just started this year. I work for a company that provides stock footage to documentaries and filmmakers and the speech has \*always \*been called “The March on Washington” for at least the past 9 years I’ve worked there. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/99 "2013-08-28T15:34:54Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Yes to both. Mid-50s. With all this talk about other marches on Washington, I must admit my very first thought was the [Bonus Army](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonus_Army) in 1932, but since I knew this is the 50th anniversary of MLK’s, I figured it was that one. Which I also already knew about anyway. (I even remember it being in the news at the time.) ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293/100 "2013-08-28T16:07:37Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > …1. What did John Brown do at Harper’s Ferry?.. Did it involve a boat ride? Yes, I know about both, but my first thought was also about the post WWI veteran’s march for their benefits. Which was not really sensible of me, since that became a veteran’s camp out until Dugout Doug and George Patton busted some heads. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/without-looking-it-up-do-you-know-of-these-two-events/667293.md?page=6)