# Wizard of Oz (1939) Q: Brown (stain?) on Lollipop Guild shirt **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 23, 2014, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014 "2014-12-23T15:28:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/1 "2014-12-23T15:28:27Z")
[For example](https://www.google.com/search?safe=active&hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1024&bih=763&q=lollipop+guild&oq=lollipop+guild&gs_l=img.3..0l10.1930.4021.0.4106.14.10.0.3.3.0.132.713.5j3.8.0.msedr...0...1ac.1.60.img..3.11.757.rD1xeeq1T8w). The Guild member with the Satanic appearance in the blue shirt appears to have some brownish splotch on his shirt. Any idea what it is? Looks simliar to a stingray swimming south. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/2 "2014-12-23T15:33:15Z")
I’m not sure it’s a “splotch”. It looks too clear and deliberate. You can’t tell from the angle of the shot, but the other side of the shirt that would match if this was the case is hidden from us. Maybe further googling or watching the original movie will show. I notice that none of the re-creations has this. But it certainly looks intentional to me. I have no idea what it’s supposed to bed though. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/3 "2014-12-23T15:46:30Z")
What a sharp eye you have! I’m guessing a laundry problem. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/4 "2014-12-23T16:06:31Z")
It looks like a pipe that Bilbo Baggins might use, but it’s a patch attached to the shirt. It might also be an insignia for a quill pen & ink pot, and he’s the secretary for the guild. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/5 "2014-12-23T17:21:43Z")
I was going to say it’s a holster of some sort but looking more closely it’s clearly completely on the shirt like a patch, and not a holster. Hmm. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/6 "2014-12-23T20:21:23Z")
I don’t know what it is, [but here’s a wardrobe test still shot,](http://img2-3.timeinc.net/ew/i/2014/02/26/Little-Tough-Boys-test.jpg) and the mark is already there (and on the same actor, Harry Earles (Harry Doll)). Either the other actors weren’t available that day, or weren’t cast yet. I don’t know why it’s two young boys and one adult dwarf. But the mark is clearly intentional. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/7 "2014-12-23T20:47:15Z")
If it was a stain the costume dept. would have given him a new shirt in minutes. It must be intentional, or no one cared. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/8 "2014-12-23T20:57:42Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I don’t know what it is, [but here’s a wardrobe test still shot,](http://img2-3.timeinc.net/ew/i/2014/02/26/Little-Tough-Boys-test.jpg) and the mark is already there (and on the same actor, Harry Earles (Harry Doll)). Either the other actors weren’t available that day, or weren’t cast yet. I don’t know why it’s two young boys and one adult dwarf. > > But the mark is clearly intentional. Well, in that picture, it looks like he’s giving someone the finger… ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2014, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/9 "2014-12-23T22:14:49Z")
There’s gotta be a Monica Lewinsky joke in there somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![kferr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71e660/32.png) [@kferr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kferr)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/10 "2014-12-24T15:48:23Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > There’s gotta be a Monica Lewinsky joke in there somewhere. That would be a low blow. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/11 "2014-12-24T15:59:40Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I don’t know what it is, [but here’s a wardrobe test still shot,](http://img2-3.timeinc.net/ew/i/2014/02/26/Little-Tough-Boys-test.jpg) and the mark is already there (and on the same actor, Harry Earles (Harry Doll)). Either the other actors weren’t available that day, or weren’t cast yet. I don’t know why it’s two young boys and one adult dwarf. > > But the mark is clearly intentional. And, conveniently, the other side of the shirt is also not visible in that shot. It almost seems intentional. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/12 "2014-12-24T16:02:53Z")
I don’t know what you and \*\*CalMeacham \*\*are talking about. Isn’t the left side of the shirt plainly visible (and unsplotched) [in this shot](https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/lollipop-guild-299-sized.jpg)? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/13 "2014-12-24T16:34:10Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I don’t know what you and \*\*CalMeacham \*\*are talking about. Isn’t the left side of the shirt plainly visible (and unsplotched) [in this shot](https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/lollipop-guild-299-sized.jpg)? If you look carefully at that picture, you can see that the blotch is textured or detailed in some way. I’m wondering if maybe it isn’t a representation of the twister that brought Dorothy to Oz. (The shaft at the top is curved somewhat, and the blob at the bottom could be a cloud of dust and debris.) ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/14 "2014-12-24T17:07:56Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > There’s gotta be a Monica Lewinsky joke in there somewhere. That’s not a lollipop… ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/15 "2014-12-24T18:05:05Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I don’t know what you and \*\*CalMeacham \*\*are talking about. Isn’t the left side of the shirt plainly visible (and unsplotched) [in this shot](https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/lollipop-guild-299-sized.jpg)? Maybe. It could be just out of view, but it does seem like the one we can see is nearer to the midline than that, so there probably isn’t one on the other side. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/16 "2014-12-24T18:11:30Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I don’t know what it is, [but here’s a wardrobe test still shot,](http://img2-3.timeinc.net/ew/i/2014/02/26/Little-Tough-Boys-test.jpg) and the mark is already there (and on the same actor, Harry Earles (Harry Doll)). > … Looking at that test shot, with him standing there wearing that ridiculous outfit, next to two children in similar outfits, I have to wonder just how humiliating it was for him. He looks almost angry. This was probably the only work he could get. Look at the name of the shot (on the sign): “3 Little Tough Boys”. ---
**Author:** ![Wheelz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wheelz/32/5718_2.png) [@Wheelz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wheelz)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/17 "2014-12-24T19:13:54Z")
To me, it looks like a silhouette of a hat with a long feather in it. [Something like this](http://us.123rf.com/450wm/saddako/saddako1103/saddako110300244/8982270-a-straw-hat-with-feather.jpg). Why, I don’t have a guess. ---
**Author:** ![Wallet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e99b99/32.png) [@Wallet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallet)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/18 "2014-12-24T20:16:00Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > Looking at that test shot, with him standing there wearing that ridiculous outfit, next to two children in similar outfits, I have to wonder just how humiliating it was for him. He looks almost angry. This was probably the only work he could get. > > Look at the name of the shot (on the sign): “3 Little Tough Boys”. Those aren’t two children next to the adult actor - all three were actors in the movie, and all were in the Lollipop Guild. They were Harry Doll, Jerry Maren, and Jackie Gerlich. I don’t know why the names were misspelled on the clapboard. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/19 "2014-12-24T20:21:21Z")
> [@Wallet](#): > > Those aren’t two children next to the adult actor - all three were actors in the movie, and all were in the Lollipop Guild. They were Harry Doll, Jerry Maren, and Jackie Gerlich. I don’t know why the names were misspelled on the clapboard. That’s my fault - I said they were boys. I thought they were stand-in boys, not recognizing they were the actors themselves (Maren was only 19 and looked younger, in my defense). In Maren’s case, at least, that’s not a misspelling - his last name at birth was [Marenghi](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Maren). ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014/20 "2014-12-24T20:31:09Z")
I’m noticing that in some of the shots - like the first one in the fourth row - there’s been a (poor) attempt to paint over the stain. So at least one person believed it was there accidentally. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wizard-of-oz-1939-q-brown-stain-on-lollipop-guild-shirt/708014.md?page=2)