# WKRP In Cncinnati Question **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 2, 2008, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683 "2008-11-02T05:19:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/21 "2008-11-03T22:44:00Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > For example, I think it’s perfectly reasonable that Disney wants to keep Mickey Mouse copyrighted even though he’s been around for 80 years… Trademarked. You can copyright works that feature Mickey, such as films and drawings. Mickey himself, however, can be trademarked but not copyrighted. ---
**Author:** ![Icerigger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icerigger/32/432_2.png) [@Icerigger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icerigger)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/22 "2008-11-03T22:59:07Z")
This even touched the original Star Trek. In City on the Edge of Forever, Kirk and Edith Keeler are walking along a sidewalk past a store playing Goodnight Sweetheart on a radio displayed in the storefront window. The DVD releases had to change that music to something else because of copyright. ---
**Author:** ![Ichbin\_Dubist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/51bf81/32.png) [@Ichbin\_Dubist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ichbin_Dubist)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/23 "2008-11-03T23:16:39Z")
I don’t think the problem is that royalties have to be paid, but that their cost is disproportionate to how they’re being used. I don’t mind Bernie Taupin getting a check if someone quotes his copyrighted line – tha’s how he earns his pay, mor eor less – but it’s absurd that the system seems to be set up so that nobody _can_ quote him because its too expensive to do so. That it would be too costly to quote five words from a 30-year-old lyric or 13 notes from a 50-year-old song in a DVD of an television show makes me think something is wrong with the way the law is written. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/24 "2008-11-03T23:18:03Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > If not that one then the one were Les is going out on a date with Jennifer and they changed the music when he was getting ready with the hairpiece. Originally it was “Hot Blooded”, which was perfect. What did they change it to? ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/25 "2008-11-03T23:35:57Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > What did they change it to? Nothing, IIRC. Not “silence” nothing, but “generic-background-music, not-an-actual-song” nothing. And upon further review, I’ll nominate as a tie for my earlier-espoused “most egregious example” the fact that they changed the snippets of music spliced together for the contest when they accidentally promised to give away their entire annual budget in one go. These were snippets that could not possibly have been a half-second long. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2008, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/26 "2008-11-03T23:48:54Z")
Just to be Devil’s Advocate, we don’t know what the royalties were that were proposed. It’s possible that the new WKRP editors balked at even modest fees and replaced any music that required ANY payment. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/27 "2008-11-04T00:02:39Z")
I remember a few years ago Tom Snyder (I think this was when he was still alive) opened a show with a rant about the old SNL impersonation of him with Dan Akroyd. It wasn’t the impersonation that bothered him- he was flattered by it- but the fact that he wanted to use a snip of it on the show that night (I forget why) and NBC wanted something like $25,000 just for 30 seconds usage. He talked about the ridiculousness of (paraphrasing) “_my_ producer having to pay $25,000 to show an actor playing _me_- I’m the _real_ me and I’ve never made $25,000 for 30 seconds work, let alone 30 seconds I did 20 years ago…”. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/28 "2008-11-04T00:04:42Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Just to be Devil’s Advocate, we don’t know what the royalties were that were proposed. It’s possible that the new WKRP editors balked at even modest fees and replaced any music that required ANY payment. Or that there was a disagreement over whether the licensing would be a once-and-forever deal or would be renegotiated after X time. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/29 "2008-11-04T00:21:54Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > He talked about the ridiculousness of (paraphrasing) “_my_ producer having to pay $25,000 to show an actor playing _me_- I’m the _real_ me and I’ve never made $25,000 for 30 seconds work, let alone 30 seconds I did 20 years ago…”. Yes. I don’t remember the exact details, but Alan Ball in his interview re Six Feet Under wanted to use a piece of a contemporary song for this one important scene (it’s the finale of one season where the Fisher family has a giant bonfire). He is on the DVD saying that whatever group it was wanted an exorbitant amount of money for a snippet of their song. He went with something else entirely–Claire Fisher is supposed to be halfway dancing to it and she’s off just a bit, which tells me that they had originally had another piece of music (perhaps the one in question) playing and then changed it. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/30 "2008-11-04T01:32:08Z")
> [@Baldwin](#): > > Originally it was “Hot Blooded”, which was perfect. What did they change it to? Good memory, I could not dredge up the song. They used generic almost but not quite sounds similar noname music by noname band. It really threw me completely out of the show as the was the best scene in a rather memorable episode. ---
**Author:** ![PastAllReason](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f07891/32.png) [@PastAllReason](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastAllReason)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/31 "2008-11-04T01:44:05Z")
> [@KneadToKnow](#): > > And upon further review, I’ll nominate as a tie for my earlier-espoused “most egregious example” the fact that they changed the snippets of music spliced together for the contest when they accidentally promised to give away their entire annual budget in one go. These were snippets that could not possibly have been a half-second long. That one really caught me offguard. Having seen it several times over the years, I was accustomed to how they sounded all strung together, and then suddenly, poof, no more Heart, etc. ---
**Author:** ![DooWahDiddy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e9bcb4/32.png) [@DooWahDiddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DooWahDiddy)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/32 "2008-11-04T06:02:46Z")
> [@dwtno](#): > > And, FWIW, “Northern Exposure” suffers from the same problem. As well as “The Wonder Years”. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/33 "2008-11-04T06:18:52Z")
> [@](#): > > There’s an episode of WKRP in which a local minister (played by character actor [and real life “thereapist to the stars”] Richard Paul that Arthur Carlson respects gradually censors much of the station’s play lists. Carlson finally has enough of it (though what makes it work as an episode is that Paul, who later played Falwell in a couple of movies, doesn’t play the character as one dimensional or hypocritical) and he reads the man the lyrics to Imagine, asking if he has a problem with them, which of course he does. Carlson informs him that he’s censoring thought- that the song doesn’t say there is no heaven, no hell, no possessions, etc., just to imagine it. Close but not quite. The Reverend was the leader of a group that wanted some songs eliminated. Carlson was torn between the idea of censorship and the need to serve the public. He figured if people really didn’t want to hear some songs he had no right to impose his will on them. After Carlson read the lyrics to “Imagine”, the Reverend said that song would be added to the list (which raises the issue of how it had been missed in the first place). Which is when Carlson said no to the list. He said that the Reverend had decided to ban the song not public opinion and that one person’s opinion wouldn’t control the playlist. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/34 "2008-11-04T14:15:47Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Close but not quite. The Reverend was the leader of a group that wanted some songs eliminated. Carlson was torn between the idea of censorship and the need to serve the public. He figured if people really didn’t want to hear some songs he had no right to impose his will on them. > > After Carlson read the lyrics to “Imagine”, the Reverend said that song would be added to the list (which raises the issue of how it had been missed in the first place). Which is when Carlson said no to the list. He said that the Reverend had decided to ban the song not public opinion and that one person’s opinion wouldn’t control the playlist. Immediately after which, as memory serves, Carlson has Fever cut the man’s throat in his chair. The scene later where he talks about how his mother abandoned him at an orphanage in Chicago to while Lucille Tarlek fellates him is one of the most moving scenes in the series. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/35 "2008-11-04T14:25:24Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Parodies have to pay royalties?:dubious: Yes – if they are sung. It’s no different than any other song. You’re paying for the music (as if it were done as an instrumental), not the words (though the lyricist does get paid). You can, however, write parody lyrics advising people “sung to the tune of” without paying royalties. Mad Magazine won that right in a Supreme Court case in the late 50s. (Essentially “ASCAP vs. Mad Magazine,” though the official name is different). At the same time, the songwriter can’t stop you from performing parodies as long as you pay the performance fees. That was decided in Campbell v. Acuff-Rose in 1994. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/36 "2008-11-04T14:47:07Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > Immediately after which, as memory serves, Carlson has Fever cut the man’s throat in his chair. The scene later where he talks about how his mother abandoned him at an orphanage in Chicago to while Lucille Tarlek fellates him is one of the most moving scenes in the series. It’s also where you find out why they call him “Big Guy.” ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683/37 "2008-11-04T20:40:37Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > You can, however, write parody lyrics advising people “sung to the tune of” without paying royalties. Mad Magazine won that right in a Supreme Court case in the late 50s. (Essentially “ASCAP vs. Mad Magazine,” though the official name is different). _Irving Berlin et al v. EC Publications_, to be exact. And that’s exactly what was judged. > [@RealityChuck](#): > > At the same time, the songwriter can’t stop you from performing parodies as long as you pay the performance fees. That was decided in Campbell v. Acuff-Rose in 1994. No, what _Campbell_ determined is that a parody was considered fair use, and thus the parodist _didn’t_ have to pay royalties, if it criticized or commented on the original work, which most parodies do, though not all. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/wkrp-in-cncinnati-question/470683.md?page=1)