# Woman calls police. They brutalize and arrest her. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 22, 2010, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653 "2010-07-22T23:10:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/61 "2010-07-23T20:06:21Z")
> [@MTCicero](#): > > Oh, and they’ve bidden me to tell you to bend over more, as they can’t penetrate with the shaft’s full length and girth. I’m not defending the cops, you dumb fucking cow. I was defending Dewey against accusations that he was on the cops’ side. He wasn’t. I pointed that out. Could you be any worse at reading comprehension? ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/62 "2010-07-23T20:14:51Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > I thought tazing was meant to be equivalent to deadly force, like a gun. If you wouldn’t shoot someone for resisting arrest, especially when they haven’t even shown themselves to be dangerous, why would you taze them? > > It’s not like we’re talking about a dangerous criminal who’s resisting arrest. This is someone who’s either an innocent person calling about a prowler or someone who may have lied but who is still a domestic abuse victim. She hasn’t harmed anyone. She isn’t about to. It sounds like running away was out of fear. And frankly, considering their reaction, it doesn’t sound like this fear was unwarranted. Yes, you can certainly argue whether tazer equals gun and when either should or should not be used. But currently, tazing is generally considered an option that ranks more with strong arming and pepper spray than with shooting people (though this obviously varies by region/department). But when she ran and resisted it was time for physical force. And she caused it. And of course, a good video could still make the difference as there is resisting and there is resisting if you know what I mean. Don’t RESIST people. Its not that complicated. ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/63 "2010-07-23T20:16:18Z")
Although the first cop’s car might not have been in a good position for the dash cam, what about the microphone? Couldn’t we at least get an audio recording of what went down with the first cop before the second cop arrived? That might give us a clearer picture of what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/64 "2010-07-23T20:40:28Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > I’m not defending the cops, you dumb fucking cow. I was defending Dewey against accusations that he was on the cops’ side. He wasn’t. I pointed that out. > > Could you be any worse at reading comprehension? Don’t bother – this is his “I’m fucking useless to the discussion” topic. ---
**Author:** ![Spit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/76d3ee/32.png) [@Spit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spit)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2010, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/65 "2010-07-23T21:03:29Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > Even if she is lying, and the cop knows she is lying, there is no justification for tasering. That’s essentially using torture to get information out of her. Wow, I even put a disclaimer at the bottom of that post. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/66 "2010-07-24T02:22:08Z")
> [@Hal\_Briston](#): > > Naaa…the details here are very much lacking, but even with our limited info it sure looks to me like those two were Grade-A fuckwits. > > My comment was regarding the other case, in which the cops took reasonable action, along with the way these threads tend to bring out the “fuck _all_ cops” contingent Yeah. I agree with you. In fact, I can mostly sympathize with Ryan Smith. He was a young cop (22), responding to assist an older cop (52), the older cop was apparently injured when he got there, & he tried to get things under control. I think he screwed up by using excessive force, but he was following the misleading presentation of the situation by his colleague. Worth a reprimand, but I don’t know that his career should end. But it’s still horrifying what he did. Tim Murphy completely hosed the situation & then Smith failed to stop it, instead contributing to it. (Though arguably Smith managed to get things under control in his way, & maybe things would have gone worse if he hadn’t responded. I don’t have enough information on Murphy to say; he may have been confused & angry after he bumped his knee, or he may have been a confused, angry, racist pig.) Understandable, but horrible. Citing this link that Projammer provided in post #22 again, & thanks: [http://www.ajc.com/news/2-officers-out-of-568967.html](http://www.ajc.com/news/2-officers-out-of-568967.html) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/67 "2010-07-24T02:48:53Z")
FYI, I linked to that same article in post number 5. And as the article said, Officer Smith got a job with the Chattahoochee County Sheriff’s office, so clearly his career isn’t over. (I’d think that the sheriff in Chattahoochee County would want to wait for the investigation to be complete before hiring that officer. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/68 "2010-07-24T04:34:04Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Like nearly ALL the other cops did wrong threads, it boils down to this. When a COP TELLS you to do something, you DO IT. If you don’t do, he is pretty much required to FORCE you to comply. To allow otherwise would defeat the very concept of a cop. I’m a cop, and I’m telling you to suck my dick. On your knees, bitch. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/69 "2010-07-24T04:41:58Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Yes, you can certainly argue whether tazer equals gun and when either should or should not be used. But currently, tazing is generally considered an option that ranks more with strong arming and pepper spray than with shooting people (though this obviously varies by region/department). > > But when she ran and resisted it was time for physical force. And she caused it. > > And of course, a good video could still make the difference as there is resisting and there is resisting if you know what I mean. > > Don’t RESIST people. Its not that complicated. But then you’re giving cops a huge amount of power that I don’t think a lot of them warrant. Many of them do abuse power. If you’re saying that being a cop means people _have_ to submit, then they can pretty much tell you to do anything you want, which I find kind of scary. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/70 "2010-07-24T06:30:33Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Like nearly ALL the other cops did wrong threads, it boils down to this. When a COP TELLS you to do something, you DO IT. If you don’t do, he is pretty much required to FORCE you to comply. To allow otherwise would defeat the very concept of a cop. > > She didnt get tazed because she was lying. She got tazed because she ran and was resisting. > > DO WHAT the cop says, take a ride ride downtown. Behave yourself. And if you think the whole thing was a crock of shit get hold of a lawyer, or the ACLU, the local paper, or Al Sharpton or something. This is wrong and bullshit. Cops are not allowed to use any force they choose to get you to answer a question. Tazers are defensive weapons like guns. They can not be legally used to make someone answer a question or get into a car. I would think the fact that one cop was fired, one resigned and the higher ups agreed it was wrong would make this obvious to you. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/71 "2010-07-24T06:57:20Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > A woman calls the police because there is a prowler outside the house, right now, as she is making the call. And her friend from ten miles away gets to her place before the cops do? In retrospect there probably was more to the story re the “friend” and the prowler/unwanted guest reason for the call, but it is interesting on one level as to what extent you can tell the police to “MYOB” if they suspect a domestic abuse scenario. It would be interesting to get the audio of the original 911 call to see what she is telling the 911 operator. There has to be more to this. Based on the police car video she should be suing the crap out of them, and the tasering policeman should be up on charges, but that doesn’t seem to be happening. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/72 "2010-07-24T07:00:35Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > It also seems to me that if you’re going to encourage a culture of cops being above the law (not informing on each other, not giving each other tickets when laws were obviously broken), then cops feeling they have a _carte blanche_ is going to be the downside of that. Are you suggesting that there is also an upside? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/73 "2010-07-24T07:16:57Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > This is wrong and bullshit. Cops are not allowed to use any force they choose to get you to answer a question. The cop wasn’t using it to get answers. He was using it to get her to stop resisting arrest so that she could be taken back and put in jail. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 9:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/74 "2010-07-24T09:54:24Z")
> [@straight\_man](#): > > but credit the Richland PD for doing the right thing. You don’t get credit for doing “the right thing”. That is their fucking job! If they could have found a way to spin this, they would have. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/75 "2010-07-24T10:39:49Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > > [@PlainJain](#): > > > > This is wrong and bullshit. Cops are not allowed to use any force they choose to get you to answer a question. > > The cop wasn’t using it to get answers. He was using it to get her to stop resisting arrest so that she could be taken back and put in jail. And the only reason he arrested her was because she refused to answer a question. Therefore, the only reason she was tased was because she didn’t answer the question. And notice that these guys were FIRED. That means—THEY WERE WRONG! So shut the fuck up, you Taser apologists. You people who think it’s morally correct to obey all sources of authority–well, you’re essentially Nazis, so I have no problem wishing that you would get tasered repeatedly. Since apparently overloading your body with pain so severe that you pass out is not torture, and LESS that police brutality, I can, by the rules of this board, wish it upon you. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/76 "2010-07-24T11:13:58Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > > [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > > > The cop wasn’t using it to get answers. He was using it to get her to stop resisting arrest so that she could be taken back and put in jail. > > And the only reason he arrested her was because she refused to answer a question. Therefore, the only reason she was tased was because she didn’t answer the question. Technically true. And if I use a salt lick to lure a cow to be brought in for slaughter, then technically one could say that a salt lick is a murderous device. She did get tased because she refused to answer questions. But that’s not actually relevant. Presuming that the cop was right that she was legally mandated to give the information he was asking for, on penalty of jail time, then he was perfectly in his right to arrest her and take her back whereupon either fines or jail time would have been used to coerce the information from her. These are considered to be legal and acceptable methods of coercion if undertaken by the court. One may _not_ use a taser as a method of inducing a person to give up information, but there’s no indication that this was the case. That’s not an argument in favor of nor against the use of tasers for any purpose what-so-ever, that’s just stating the facts of the situation. The cop was presumably justified in arresting her, and presumably at some point there would have been a method of coercion used to get her to give information. But the taser was, so far as we can tell, used as a method of subduing her so that she could be brought in, whereupon legal methods of coercion would have been used to compel her to talk. It was not literally used as a torture device to compel her to speak. And again, this doesn’t mean that his use to subdue her was acceptable nor legal. It’s entirely possible, and even likely, that he used unnecessary force and deserves to have been fired or to be thrown in jail. But, the point remains that the force he utilized was in subduing her, not in coercing information from her. That’s just factually inaccurate, except through a tortured train of logic. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/77 "2010-07-24T12:29:40Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > > [@billfish678](#): > > > > Like nearly ALL the other cops did wrong threads, it boils down to this. When a COP TELLS you to do something, you DO IT. If you don’t do, he is pretty much required to FORCE you to comply. To allow otherwise would defeat the very concept of a cop. > > I’m a cop, and I’m telling you to suck my dick. > > On your knees, bitch. Funny. You first. But you know what I really meant. And if you don’t your a fucktard. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/78 "2010-07-24T12:38:49Z")
Not all crimes are the same though and tasering a suspect in a petty shoplifting arrest is less justifiable than in a suspected armed robbery arrest. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/79 "2010-07-24T12:54:29Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Not all crimes are the same though and tasering a suspect in a petty shoplifting arrest is less justifiable than in a suspected armed robbery arrest. I wouldn’t agree with that at all, personally. A single officer trying to subdue someone who is fighting for long enough to get handcuffs on and get them in the back of the police cruiser, has the option of wrestling with the person, tasing them, or simply letting them get away with the crime. Of those three, imperfect, options the best one is to tase the person. If you let them get away rather than fight with them, then the police lose their power to enforce anything. If you do fight them, there’s good odds that both the suspect and the police man will be physically damaged. Tasing hurts like hell and is a very bad thing to do to someone, but so is punching them, breaking their arm, accidentally jabbing a finger through their eye, or anything else that can happen in an all-out bought of wrestling. The idea that policemen are martial arts experts who can simply evade all hits, grab a person in a magical martial arts way, and move them into the desired position regardless of all struggling is simply not reality. In most cases where a larger person subdues a smaller person, it’s because the smaller person recognizes that they’re going to lose and simply gives in. If the two were to actually go and see the fight through, the bigger, better trained person will almost certainly win, but there’s still a good chance of broken bones, lost digits, hair having been torn out, shrapnel jutting out of their body, etc. A taser isn’t an ideal solution. But, it is still the better solution of everything in a polceman’s arsenal for a _resisting_ suspect for both of their sake. Again, this doesn’t mean that a police officer can’t proceed to use a taser as a torture device or as a way to effectively beat a person up without leaving a mark. Misuse is by all means a _bad thing_. The police related to the incidence in question may well have been guilty of abusing this woman. But, to say that a person doesn’t deserve to be tased if they performed a minor crime is silly. The only other options – presuming the person resists arrest – are again to beat them or to let them go. Neither of those is a better option. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2010, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653/80 "2010-07-24T13:00:21Z")
I suppose you agree with police officers breaking numerous motoring laws and endangering the general public in order to catch a car thief, too? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-calls-police-they-brutalize-and-arrest-her/547653.md?page=5)