# Woman killed on safari in Zambia **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 5, 2024, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896 "2024-04-05T18:38:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2024, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/1 "2024-04-05T18:38:10Z")
A bull elephant [attacked a vehicle full of tourists](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/04/africa/zambia-elephant-tourist-death-scli-intl/index.html) on a game drive in Kafue National Park in Zambia. A 79 year old woman from Minnesota was killed and five others injured, one of whom was hospitalized. The animals in those parks are generally habituated to the vehicles driving around, and the guides are very good at reading an animal’s temperament. All wildlife is ultimately unpredictable, of course, and I’m guessing they’ll never know what set the bull off. Perhaps it’s rutting season. We went on many game drives on our safari adventures and most animals ignored us completely. We were mock-charged by a young elephant once, and hippos are always unhappy with anything other than another hippo, but we never felt in danger. ---
**Author:** ![slowpony](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8e8cbc/32.png) [@slowpony](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slowpony)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2024, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/2 "2024-04-15T22:30:39Z")
A former friend of mine went to Africa over Christmas, caught an infection and died. Africa is dangerous. She was a very experienced traveler. Anything can happen. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2024, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/3 "2024-04-15T23:06:48Z")
Well thank heaves we’re going to Kenya, not Zambia! 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2024, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/4 "2024-04-15T23:33:10Z")
These kinds of incidents are very rare. Safari company employees are professionals and well trained. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/5 "2024-04-16T00:12:48Z")
It’s not the elephants fault. It’s not the woman’s fault. But how about humans stay out of their places? Seems prudent. You swim with sharks… ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/6 "2024-04-16T00:42:24Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > But how about humans stay out of their places? Seems prudent. When assholes quit paying for ivory and elephant feet and trying to get their peckers hard by carving up critters, then perhaps these game preserves won’t be necessary and the money that gets paid by tourists won’t be needed to pay for the wardens and other protections. Until that happens - in other words, never - this is a necessary evil. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/7 "2024-04-16T00:55:20Z")
Yep there’s a chain of criminal behavior. The local poachers getting paid. The buyers of ivory and other parts of the animal. The furriers and decorative arts makers. The companies who want these things. The individual who wants a cheetah coat or a zebra rug. And even the countries who allow these imports into their country. So maybe Safari rides are kinda, squint your eyes ok. I understand even the reserves are poached regularly. (I can’t find reliable stats). That’s what I’ve heard on National Geographic channel. We, as humans have a reckoning coming about the way we treat wild creatures. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/8 "2024-04-16T01:21:15Z")
> [@slowpony](#): > > Africa is dangerous. Oh good grief. Generalize much? EVERYWHERE is dangerous, if you are poor, careless, or just plain unlucky. Shit happens. We all set our own risk/reward standards, and some people are more cautious than others. But writing off an entire continent smacks of - well, less than positive traits I’m not going to even put a name to, as I wouldn’t want to run afoul of rules forbidding attacking other posters. FWIW, my son was born in South Africa and lived in Mozambique, Indonesia, and Egypt until age 18, when he went to live in the US for the first time as a college student. If we’d said, “nope, can’t do that … Africa is DANGEROUS (and Southeast Asia must be too!),” it is hard to imagine how his life, and that of his parents, would have been as rewarding. Plus I hope that his dad and I managed to do a little bit of good in the world by working on things like poverty reduction and infrastructure development. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/9 "2024-04-16T01:44:46Z")
Read a book recently about animals humans consider pests. Had a chapter about one of the national parks we are going to visit. Discussed the differing points of views WRT elephants of northern hemisphere tourists and folk living next door who get their entire crops eaten and their homes trampled by the beasts. No, the locals weren’t supporting killing them, but their attitudes towards management and control were somewhat different reflecting their immediate proximity. My latest question is, seemingly whenever I’ve told someone I’m going to Kenya, they respond, “Are you going on a safari?” To which I find myself responding, “What is a safari?” I mean, we intend to see some animals, but I’m not going to shoot any. Nor will we have troops of native bearers. I expect to sleep in a bed and have access to a flush toilet every night. Is that a safari? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/10 "2024-04-16T02:07:46Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Read a book recently about animals humans consider pests. Had a chapter about one of the national parks we are going to visit. Discussed the differing points of views WRT elephants of northern hemisphere tourists and folk living next door who get their entire crops eaten and their homes trampled by the beasts. Something like this was in the news very recently: > **[Botswana threatens to send 20,000 elephants to Germany](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-68715164)** > > Germany wants tougher limits on hunting the animals, but Botswana says it has too many of them. > Earlier this year, Germany’s environment ministry suggested there should be stricter limits on importing trophies from hunting animals. > > Botswana’s President Mokgweetsi Masisi told German media this would only impoverish people in his country. > > He said elephant numbers had exploded as a result of conservation efforts, and hunting helped keep them in check. > > Germans should “live together with the animals, in the way you are trying to tell us to”, Mr Masisi told German newspaper Bild. “This is no joke.” ---
**Author:** ![scudsucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scudsucker/32/14101_2.png) [@scudsucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scudsucker)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/11 "2024-04-16T04:05:44Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Discussed the differing points of views WRT elephants of northern hemisphere tourists and folk living next door who get their entire crops eaten and their homes trampled by the beasts. Sort of tangential… but related. There is some charity work being done to teach farmers to plant chillis on the boundary of their crops, mostly in Zimbabwe but a little in Mozambique. Unlike humans, who are masochistic (I am one! I have about 7 different hot chilli sauces at any time) elephants do not like chilli [http://elephantpepper.org/human-elephant-conflict-chilli.php](http://elephantpepper.org/human-elephant-conflict-chilli.php) Elephant overpopulation is a big issue for the environment. They destroy woodlands. I am not in favour of hunting per se, but it is necessary to cull the herds; they do not have enough space. If that is done by rich trophy hunters who bring in lots of money, or it is done by near-minimum wage Parks employees makes little difference. As majestic as it is to see a herd of maybe 100 elephants, in their trail is massive destruction. Unfortunately- and to my distaste - culling is the only viable option. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/12 "2024-04-16T08:09:16Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > “What is a safari?” I mean, we intend to see some animals, but I’m not going to shoot any. Nor will we have troops of native bearers. I expect to sleep in a bed and have access to a flush toilet every night. Is that a safari? Not really the answer to your question, but “safari” comes from an Arabic root word, _safar_, that means to travel. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/13 "2024-04-16T12:04:01Z")
To be fair, there’s Africa and then there is Africa as experienced by the diplomatic corps or by the people living in cities. As you know, once outside of a city, things become fairly primitive in a hurry, and trekking through jungle can still be quite dangerous. It’s not the big critters that are worrisome; it’s the microbes that do you in. But yes, I agree with your mini-screed for the most part. > [@Dinsdale](#): > > “What is a safari?” I mean, we intend to see some animals, but I’m not going to shoot any. Nor will we have troops of native bearers. I expect to sleep in a bed and have access to a flush toilet every night. Is that a safari? Try changing your answer to “A photo safari”. A lot of people think a safari means shooting animals, and there are those who do that (think Trump’s brats), but far and away, photo safaris are predominate. > [@Dinsdale](#): > > Discussed the differing points of views WRT elephants of northern hemisphere tourists and folk living next door who get their entire crops eaten and their homes trampled by the beasts. Elephants are extremely destructive to plant life. You may see trees that have been extensively damaged by tusks and abrasion and even completely uprooted. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/14 "2024-04-16T12:11:33Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Try changing your answer to “A photo safari”. My problem is that I personally think of safari as involving long lines of bearers and setting up camp in different places. At the worst we’ll be “glamping” and driving out for day trips. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/15 "2024-04-16T13:37:12Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > My problem is that I personally think of safari as involving long lines of bearers and setting up camp in different places. Too many dime novels in your past. That was true in the days of Stanley, Speke and Burton, but nowadays you fly in to a place that has strongback tents, a chef on board, in-tent toilets/showers, and you ride around in a multi-wheeled Land Rover. We even stopped for tea at mid-morning. There are less opulent safaris that involve trail camps, of course, but nobody does the Bwana thing any more. Honestly, I think they call them safaris because it imparts a sense of adventure for the tourist, and does evoke the sort of thing you mentioned. But, as **Carol** mentioned, it’s also an appropriate word for what you’re doing. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/16 "2024-04-16T13:56:31Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > > [@Dinsdale](#): > > > > What is a safari?” I mean, we intend to see some animals, but I’m not going to shoot any. Nor will we have troops of native bearers. I expect to sleep in a bed and have access to a flush toilet every night. Is that a safari? > > Try changing your answer to “A photo safari”. A lot of people think a safari means shooting animals, and there are those who do that (think Trump’s brats), but far and away, photo safaris are predominate. Really? To my mind, and in my experience, “safari” has come to mean “a trip to Africa, with the specific intent to see characteristic megafauna.” Insofar as I hear the word, I hear it used for that, rather than “hunting trip to Africa.” ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/17 "2024-04-16T13:59:00Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > Really? To my mind, and in my experience, “safari” has come to mean “a trip to Africa, with the specific intent to see characteristic megafauna.” Yeah - I think that is the currently accepted usage. But I find myself thinking, “No, we just figured we’d hang out in downtown Nairobi for a week or so. Why would we go to Kenya to experience nature?” ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/18 "2024-04-16T15:08:04Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > Really? To my mind, and in my experience, “safari” has come to mean “a trip to Africa, with the specific intent to see characteristic megafauna.” Insofar as I hear the word, I hear it used for that, rather than “hunting trip to Africa.” Which is also my definition, but on occasion, when talk has turned to travels and I’ve mentioned the various safaris we’ve been on, some people have been quick to ask if we were hunting animals. My answer is usually something along the lines of “Yes, but only to find and photograph them.” ---
**Author:** ![FloatyGimpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/floatygimpy/32/7750_2.png) [@FloatyGimpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FloatyGimpy)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/19 "2024-04-16T17:08:31Z")
When I was in Tanzania a bull elephant saw us coming and “hid” behind a tree. Picture a beach ball “hiding” behind an umbrella pole. Anyway as we approached he came charging towards the vehicle and our driver sped away. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2024, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896/20 "2024-04-16T17:20:13Z")
Safari = trip through African park to see and photograph wildlife. I’d _never_ automatically think “hunting.” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-killed-on-safari-in-zambia/999896.md?page=2)