# Woman raped on crowded Philadelphia train car; bystanders film it without intervening **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 19, 2021, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794 "2021-10-19T22:54:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2021, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/1 "2021-10-19T22:54:42Z")
I heard on NPR earlier today that the suspect had her clothes already torn off when they boarded the train! I’m sure hoping that nobody intervened because they feared collaborators. > **[A woman is raped and onlookers record it: the story beyond the outrage | CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/19/opinions/philadelphia-train-rape-bystander-effect-filipovic/index.html)** > > The now-viral story of a sexual assault aboard a SEPTA train in Philadelphia is a brutal reminder that it remains too easy to turn away from violence against women, says Jill Filipovic. It's also a crucial moment for difficult questions, she writes -... This story makes me wonder if he’s done this, and gotten away with it, before! ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/2 "2021-10-20T12:24:29Z")
That’s beyond fucked up. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/3 "2021-10-20T12:32:51Z")
Given the lack of detail or clarity in the story, I would advise caution in assuming it’s accurate. As this article notes, the Kitty Genovese story turned out to be a stack of lies (this article actually understates just what a myth that is) so you don’t really know just yet. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/4 "2021-10-20T12:49:55Z")
If I was married to a man who stood by and did that, I’d divorce him. I’d put it all over Facebook. He’d have to go into hiding. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/5 "2021-10-20T12:58:36Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > I’m sure hoping that nobody intervened because they feared collaborators. Is it possible that the bystanders believed that they were witnessing consensual sex? ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanubv.2/32/3260_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/6 "2021-10-20T13:42:23Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Is it possible that the bystanders believed that they were witnessing consensual sex? This was my first thought, possibly because it’s so horrifying to think that people stood around and watched an obvious sexual assault. ---
**Author:** ![lobotomyboy63](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobotomyboy63/32/2900_2.png) [@lobotomyboy63](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobotomyboy63)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/7 "2021-10-20T15:09:50Z")
The title: " A woman is raped and onlookers record it: the story beyond the outrage" makes it sound like an established fact. Quoting from the article > The story of a [woman raped on a Southeastern Pennsylvania Transport Authority (SEPTA) train](https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/18/us/philadelphia-train-rape/index.html)in Philadelphia while onlookers reportedly recorded video with their cellphones but did not intervene or call 911 is mind-bogglingly horrific. It suggests not only a total disregard for women’s safety and wellbeing, but social disintegration; a disturbing impulse to filter terrible events through the lens of entertainment and shock value, and the disturbing ability to dehumanize suffering by mediating it through a screen. > _ **That is, if the events happened as they are being reported. So far, the factual universe of this case has come from the police, who are not necessarily always reliable sources.** _ Italics, bolding mine. If you hid the name of the source I would probably assume it was some unreliable source looking for clicks. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/8 "2021-10-20T21:17:53Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Is it possible that the bystanders believed that they were witnessing consensual sex? Regardless, that’s nasty and a good enough excuse to boot the dude right in the bouncing balls to get him (or them) to knock it the hell off. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/9 "2021-10-20T21:31:18Z")
I can’t even bring myself to read the article. I keep checking in on this thread hoping to find out it’s fake. How utterly disturbing! ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/10 "2021-10-20T21:32:55Z")
If bystanders were, in fact, recording video, then surely the actual facts of the case will come to light fairly quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/11 "2021-10-20T22:55:06Z")
Exactly. I’m reserving judgment until it’s no longer a knee-jerk reaction. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/12 "2021-10-20T23:26:30Z")
The following is in no particular order. For a long time, I rode the Market Frankford El twice a week. I like to think that if I witnessed a rape, I’d try to stop it. Besides other passengers cell phones, most cars contain surveilance cameras. I don’t think I’ve witnessed an assault, rape or theft on the el. I don’t know what the truth is here- I’m sure a rape happened. But, did the other passengers know it was rape and do nothing? If they thought it was consensual sex, at least 95% would not say anything. The last time I rode the El, it was empty except for a man who chose the seat right next to mine. I was briefly worried by this. I figured he might attempt to assault or rob me. Instead he just shot up. I still cannot figure out why he felt the need to sit right next to the only occupied seat in the car. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/13 "2021-10-21T02:15:46Z")
I happened to hear this yesterday. She makes some good points. > **[Don't just watch: How bystanders can safely intervene in a violent situation](https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2021/10/19/bystanders-how-to-help)** > > An incident of sexual assault on a SEPTA train outside Philadelphia has brought attention to the role of bystanders when circumstances like these arise. ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/14 "2021-10-21T03:25:20Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > I still cannot figure out why he felt the need to sit right next to the only occupied seat in the car. Hoping you carried emergency Narcan on you and you aren’t afraid to use it? ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/15 "2021-10-21T04:45:47Z")
Would it be a total dick move to carry a bunch of that shit around all the time and every time you run across some jackhole shooting up in plain view you just run up and zap 'em with that stuff and it straightens them out and they have to go cop again? Just me? Cool, cool, coolcoolcool… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/16 "2021-10-21T04:56:47Z")
Get a tranquilizer dart gun, like the kind used on large animals, but load the darts with Narcan. As a bonus, give yourself the vigilante name, “The Dragonslayer”. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/17 "2021-10-21T21:14:34Z")
I think you squirt it up their nose, if all my myriad doctor shows aren’t lying to me. Darting the junkies sounds like fun though–but wouldn’t you be the Monkeyslayer? 😉 Nobody’s classy enough to smoke opium any more. Sigh. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/18 "2021-10-21T21:50:03Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > I think you squirt it up their nose, if all my myriad doctor shows aren’t lying to me. It is available as a nasal spray because that’s easier than an injection, but it’s also available as an injection. [https://www.fda.gov/drugs/news-events-human-drugs/fda-approves-naloxone-injection-counteract-opioid-overdoses](https://www.fda.gov/drugs/news-events-human-drugs/fda-approves-naloxone-injection-counteract-opioid-overdoses) > FDA has previously approved injectable naloxone hydrochloride products in 0.4 mg and 2 mg doses under the trade name, NARCAN. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/19 "2021-10-21T23:20:02Z")
As much fun as the darts would be I’m thinking it’s much less likely to lead to assault charges if you squodge 'em up their noses as they nod. ---
**Author:** ![BippityBoppityBoo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bippityboppityboo/32/5745_2.png) [@BippityBoppityBoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BippityBoppityBoo)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794/20 "2021-10-21T23:41:12Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > It is available as a nasal spray because that’s easier than an injection, but it’s also available as an injection. And all these routes[from [fda.gov](http://fda.gov)]: … Naloxone is absorbed not only through **intravenous (IV)** , but also by intramuscular (IM), subcutaneous (SC), endotracheal, sublingual, intralingual, submental, and nasal routes. Via the IV route, onset of action is within 1-2 minutes…. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-raped-on-crowded-philadelphia-train-car-bystanders-film-it-without-intervening/952794.md?page=2)