# Woman vs Womyn **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 6, 2001, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287 "2001-12-06T19:59:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![RaCha\_ar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c2a13f/32.png) [@RaCha\_ar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaCha_ar)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2001, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287/41 "2001-12-07T05:54:21Z")
Oh, boy. **Iamthat** , where do I begin? Let’s see, I’ll start with romance languages, where the plural of a word referring to a group including masculine and feminine automatically reverts to the masculine. As an example, if you’ve got a guy, “chico,” and a girl, “chica,” in Spanish, you’d refer to the two of them together as “chicos.” These languages don’t have a neuter gender as Latin and Greek did (but honestly, I don’t know about gender nouns in other, non-Romance languages, so if someone else could contribute I’d appreciate it), so it has to go to either masculine plural or feminine plural. This at least in part explains why “guys” is a gender-neutral term (and it is, at that; I find it used to refer to groups of men and women far more than I find it used to refer to specifically males). Oh no, what discrimination in choosing to go to the masculine plural! Dearieduck, we come from a long history of male domination. That’s history, it’s fact, and trying to change the language that comes down from it is, frankly, patently ridiculous. We don’t need to change “woman” and “female” to prove that times have changed, and to me it seems like a petty thing to concentrate your energies on. It’s just fucking language. Proof? Next time you go to the gym, remember that it derives from the Greek word “gymnasion,” which loosely translated as “the naked place.” Should we react and go ballistic because gyms of this day and age imply retroactively that we all oughtta be naked? What about symposia, today taken as an academic gathering of sorts? Symposia were originally drinking parties. Gasp! Better tell the English department to cancel the professor’s symposium next month – people might mistakenly get the idea that they can start drinking! FTR, etymologically speaking, the words “male” and “female” come to us from completely different roots. “Male” derives from “masculus,” a Latin diminutive of “mas,” male. “Female” derives from Latin “femella,” a diminutive of “femina,” woman. You might think one comes from the other, but you’d be wrong (my \*American Heritage Dictionary[i/] gets me that info, btw). I genuinely hope you’re not one of the people who buys the crock that “woman” derives from “woe of man.” Lovey, we ain’t _that_ oppressed anymore, and believe it or not, changing our fucking language isn’t the way to get us out from under the horrible oppression of the patriarchy. Finally, “femyle?” I was going to be nice about this, but fuck a buncha that: What the burning fuck? What on earth would possess you to change the “a” to a “y” of all bloody things? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2001, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287/42 "2001-12-07T05:58:29Z")
Sometimes I think there’s a [song](http://www.yellowtailrecords.com/lyrics/lyr_myn.html#womyn) for everything. ---
**Author:** ![Yumanite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b487fb/32.png) [@Yumanite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yumanite)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2001, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287/43 "2001-12-07T06:03:43Z")
> [@](#): > > _Yrygynylly pystyd by Yymthyt_ > \*\* I think your mother is on a good mission. I am in favour of the change. > I think spelling the word, womyn, and femyle would be a good positive change. > Finally get rid of the man, male reference. > Saying there are better things to do, is a very weak reason, and is usually used in arguments, in replace of thinking.\*\* I, for one, agree. In fact, I think that as wymyn, we must separate ourselves in all respects from male-dominated vowel usage. I propose, lydyes, that we do declare our vowelar independence today! Thyrfyry, Y thynk thyt wy shyyld symply ryplyce yll vywyls wyth y “y”, ynlyss thyy spycyfycylly ryfyr ty MEN. Yyyrs yn pywyr, Yymynyty. ---
**Author:** ![Kayeby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9de0a6/32.png) [@Kayeby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kayeby)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2001, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287/44 "2001-12-07T06:25:53Z")
Count me as another feminist against “womyn”. I think it’s counterproductive and idiotic - not only does it give anti-feminists something to latch on to (and alienates women who don’t want to be associated with militant feminism), but there are also far more important issues out there. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Iamthat \* > \*\*What does it mean, when a male is offended, if called by a femyle reference, such as gals? Firstly it is an insult to femyles, considering that it happens in reverse, all the time. And secondly, it states that the ‘gal’ or ‘femyle’ is undesirable and inferior, and is understood as being derogatory. \*\* I feminise my boyfriend’s name sometimes (from James to Jamesina) and sometimes call him “princess”. Does that count? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2001, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287/45 "2001-12-07T06:36:18Z")
Folks, Folks Folks…_rubs his eyes and forhead_ Had I known this was going to cause sucha little stir I would have posted it in GD. Actually I have to say thanks for all the good tidings and all the kindness seeping thru the seems of the boards for this thread. I thought it an interesting point made by **saffostarr** and **lamthat** both have debatable corners in this little boggle. But **lamthat** has expressed a very interesting point with her short vignette about someone walking into a bar stating ‘hey guys’ and everyone, both genders, turn their heads. But walk into a bar and say ‘hey gals’ only the women turn their head…interesting… I suppose if you want everyones attention one should just say…Folks…folks…folks…🙂 ok I’m done its late…I’ll be back later… ---
**Author:** ![Spanky\_The\_Dolphin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Spanky\_The\_Dolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spanky_The_Dolphin)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2001, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287/46 "2001-12-07T07:26:48Z")
They could always go with 133t and spell it “//0//\4||”. ---
**Author:** ![Ayesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c0e974/32.png) [@Ayesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ayesha)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2001, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287/47 "2001-12-07T07:39:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoggie \* > \*\*hijack…but i’ve been meaning to say this for awhile. **Ayesha** , wouldn’t it be more correct gramatically to say, “Je suis Ayesha! Craignez-moi!” as opposed to what’s already in your sig? Sorry, I’m just really anal… \*\* It might be, but \*\* featherlou \*\* did this just for me so I’m a keepin it just the way it is. Until I make a sig change that is. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/woman-vs-womyn/97287.md?page=2)