# Women (and men) who have affairs. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 30, 2013, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779 "2013-01-30T04:37:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/21 "2013-01-30T13:09:37Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > I think the point here is that while having an affair is really, really shitty, it’s not uniquely shitty. It’s not in a category all by itself, somehow above and beyond all the other terrible things one person could do to another. I’d rather my husband cheat on me than develop a gambling habit, lie to me about it, and run us into catastrophic debt. I’d rather him cheat on me than hit me, or destroy my stuff in a rage. I’d rather him cheat on me than commit a white-collar crime and end up in jail. I think I’d rather him cheat on me than simply develop a low-level distaste for me that manifests itself in petty meanness, sexual withdrawal, and emotional distance. This right here. There are a lot of ways to fuck over a partner in some fashion. Cheating is just one of the simplest ways to do it. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/22 "2013-01-30T13:23:46Z")
For a pit thread there is not nerarly enough acid spreaying about in here. Frankly I’m disgusted at you all for keeping the tone in here so MPSIMS-y. So here’s a little bile to hopefully get this thing back on course. > [@MandaJo](#): > > I think the point here is that while having an affair is really, really shitty, it’s not uniquely shitty… 😕 > [@MandaJo](#): > > I’ve never cheated, been with a cheater, nor been cheated on. I am not trying to justify anything or excuse anything. Ah…dear, you know not whereof you speak. I assure you, for those who can truly feel love, it IS uniquely shitty. I would GLADLY endure any of your alternative scenarios over marital betrayal. Nothing says, “You’re an expendable piece of grit under my shoe” quite like the abandonment of infidelity. It’s no secret my first wife was a serial cheater. But since we have kids we try to keep things civil in our post-divorce relationship. Every now and then though I can see her chronic depression colliding with her guilt for destroying her family and refusing my patience. I know at those times all I have to do is remind her how fucked up she is, how her passive aggression is damaging the kids, and how much her life insurance would really help them out with college seeing as how she’s not interested in bettering her financial situation. She’d do it if I told her to. But I don’t. Instead I just tell her to save it for her boyfriend du jour–it’s not my job to give a fuck about her anymore. Sometimes she cries, and then I smile at the justice in the universe. I wish nothing but misery for her, and so far she’s done a dutiful job at granting my wish at every opportunity. ---
**Author:** ![Lunchy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Lunchy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lunchy)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/23 "2013-01-30T13:48:50Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > IMO, no of course – lack of _mens rea_ to configure the crime. But then people will tell you s/he is morally compelled to then repudiate the other person if or when s/he finds out that was the case, no matter how much later. > But the way a lot of people use it is rather a later-day pop redefinition, as a way for people who do not believe in Hell to say some Higher Power will punish miscreants. I see it as a self-fulfilling prophecy. Obviously something will happen in the future that would be considered bad/unfortunate. Yup, Karma struck again. ---
**Author:** ![Doughbag](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@Doughbag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doughbag)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/24 "2013-01-30T13:51:21Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Men are often clueless about this. I dunno. We have friends who, according to the man, the wife “just walked away, no clue why.” Yet I and almost all her friends know exactly why. Because her husband was always putting her down–or at any rate doing things she interpreted as putting her down. When she asked him to stop, he denied he was doing it. > > Example: She’s out of work for three days because of the flu. He says, “Well, it was just a bad cold. I don’t think she really had the flu. I think if she really had the flu she’d have been a lot sicker.” This was kind of a weird thing–he’s not a doctor. He doesn’t get to decide whether she had a bad cold or the flu. He just wanted to diminish her experience, whatever it was. > > Example: She was having a really rough go at her job. She pretty much hated everything about it. She wanted to change jobs, and found another one but needed a car to get to it, but they had a car, and he usually took the bus to his job. He suddenly decided he needed to take the car rather than the bus, and told her the new job didn’t pay enough for her to get another car and she should just quit. > > Example: She ordered some slippers online. She ordered them in a small so her feet wouldn’t slop around in them. He went online and changed her order to get a medium. Because he thought slippers should fit loose. > > These were things aired in public or at least among their friends. I have to assume his behavior in private was worse. Anyway it was not much of a surprise to me that she left but he seemed really flummoxed and goes around saying he’s such a nice guy, why did she treat him like that? Hint: He’s not a nice guy. > > He is blaming “the other guy” but as far as I can tell, the other guy was drafted as an excuse for her to leave. Maybe a bit of a confidence-builder, too. > > I guess he could also say his wife was so shallow that she left him because he changed her slipper order, but that would mean it was his fault. Better to blame the other guy, right? It’s not just men who are clueless - women are aswell. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/25 "2013-01-30T14:06:11Z")
> [@Lunchy](#): > > What about the “home wrecker” that has no knowledge their partner is married? Do they deserve bad…uh…what was that made up word…oh, karma? If the affair partner has no idea their partner is married, I’d say no. Once they find out, though, they have a responsibility to end it even though they aren’t married to the person who is being betrayed - they have a responsibility as a human being to not knowingly do that much harm to another human being, even though they don’t know the betrayed spouse and the betraying spouse is probably lying to them about how bad their spouse and marriage is. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/26 "2013-01-30T14:08:43Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > I know at those times all I have to do is remind her how fucked up she is, how her passive aggression is damaging the kids, and how much her life insurance would really help them out with college seeing as how she’s not interested in bettering her financial situation. She’d do it if I told her to. But I don’t. Instead I just tell her to save it for her boyfriend du jour–it’s not my job to give a fuck about her anymore. Sometimes she cries, and then I smile at the justice in the universe. I wish nothing but misery for her, and so far she’s done a dutiful job at granting my wish at every opportunity. Good thing your ex-wife is the fucked up one in this story. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/27 "2013-01-30T14:09:26Z")
> [@Lunchy](#): > > What about the “home wrecker” that has no knowledge their partner is married? Do they deserve bad…uh…what was that made up word…oh, karma? For some the taboo is strong enough to warrant at least some due dilligence about verifying the ‘availability’ of a new partner. Readily available phrases include, “So…you married?” or “Are you currently a party to an implied contract of physical fidelity?” (chicks dig that one). Or my personal favorite, “Seriously? You’re single?” So yeah, “I didn’t know” is pretty weak. At best it bespeaks of one’s own breathtaking irresponsibility in picking a partner. If you don’t know them well enough to make a reasonable guess as to their relationship status, you’re just as likely to find out you also misjudged the sort of genitalia they sport. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/28 "2013-01-30T14:13:30Z")
> [@ladyfoxfyre](#): > > Good thing your ex-wife is the fucked up one in this story. Yeah, **Inigo** , this: > [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > it’s not my job to give a fuck about her anymore. really does not go with this: > [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > But since we have kids we try to keep things civil in our post-divorce relationship. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/29 "2013-01-30T14:15:00Z")
> [@ladyfoxfyre](#): > > Good thing your ex-wife is the fucked up one in this story. Judge away, I expect nothing less of you. But yeah, The swifter death comes to her the better off everyone else in her life will be. Simple fact. And **bienville** , one can be civil even to those one despises. It’s taxing, but it can be done. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/30 "2013-01-30T14:41:37Z")
I am frankly of the position that marriage is too damn long. To be expected to remain together until “death do us part” is frankly, kind of insane. I’m not saying no one can do it, or that most people wouldn’t do it, but I don’t judge if I find out some people can’t. It’s said in this thread that women shouldn’t have affairs but they shouldn’t walk out on their marriages either. But then what are they supposed to do? What is anyone supposed to do? Why do we have to live in unhappiness for the rest of our lives? Affairs are not the right step, of course, but leaving a marriage? Definitely the better option. The story of the woman who wanted to party? First of all, you don’t really know what’s going on inside their marriage. Secondly, so what? Maybe she really, really tried to get her husband to liven up their marriage, and he just wouldn’t see that there was anything wrong. And maybe she’s just a big fat jerk. That’s a possibility, too, and I would agree that a 16 YO girl still needs her mother. But if she’s a big fat jerk is it really that much better for her to stay in the marriage and poison it that way? I don’t know. I try not to judge. Life is hard enough as it is without the strictures and rules of a possible seventy-year marriage. Yes, work on your marriage, but if it fails, don’t have an affair, leave the marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Fake\_Tales\_of\_San\_Francisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8491ac/32.png) [@Fake\_Tales\_of\_San\_Francisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fake_Tales_of_San_Francisco)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/31 "2013-01-30T15:24:32Z")
Women are often clueless about this. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/32 "2013-01-30T16:21:07Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > Judge away, I expect nothing less of you. But yeah, The swifter death comes to her the better off everyone else in her life will be. Simple fact. Wow. Did she kill your father too, or do you wish death on everyone who hurts your feelings? ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/33 "2013-01-30T16:24:25Z")
Reread–I only hate my ex. **ladyfoxfire** and I rub each other the wrong way sometimes (most of the time?), but I don’t really have any hard feelings for her. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/34 "2013-01-30T16:57:45Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > For some the taboo is strong enough to warrant at least some due dilligence about verifying the ‘availability’ of a new partner. Readily available phrases include, “So…you married?” or “Are you currently a party to an implied contract of physical fidelity?” (chicks dig that one). Or my personal favorite, “Seriously? You’re single?” Or: “My name is Inigo Montoya. Are you single? Prepare to die.” ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/35 "2013-01-30T17:01:36Z")
When people answer the question, “Why are you ending your marriage?”, with, “I don’t know…”, it’s code for either; You wouldn’t understand, or, I can’t really put it into words just yet, but at my core I know I must. Much more importantly when did it become okay to judge other people over something as personal and truly unknowable as the inner workings of their marriage? Seems like complete hubris to me to imagine you know what’s going on better than they do. I’m not seeing how anyone ever has the right to talk about any relationship not their own. Okay, with the possible exceptions of teenagers and the mentally incompetent. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/36 "2013-01-30T17:39:01Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Wow. Did she kill your father too, or do you wish death on everyone who hurts your feelings? “hurting your feelings” is something quite different from betraying a vow of sexual exclusivity, which is something a lot of people consider important, even sacred. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/37 "2013-01-30T17:40:29Z")
> [@Doughbag](#): > > It’s not just men who are clueless - women are aswell. This and what **elbows** explained about the real meaning behind “I don’t know…” In my experience, everyone who I’ve ever heard explain their divorce away like that are eschewing responsibility themselves. Case in point is my husband’s ex. She’s currently going through her fourth divorce. And just like the previous three, she can’t understand what happened when she did everything / sacrificed for him. Of course, this doesn’t speak to the fact that she refused to ever work, spent money like it grew on trees, used her children as pawns, wasted her leisure time on Oprah, junk food and Walmart and dodging house work. She is just an all around lying, frigid, lazy, in denial, manipulative, hateful, bitter, racist, homophobic, busybody bitch. Oh, and a huge perpetuator of lawsuits. So, yeah. None of that could’ve possibly had anything to do with why those guys left and none have been interested since. I know when she tells the stories of her divorces, they are all the villains and she is the innocent same. Counterpoint. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/38 "2013-01-30T17:55:47Z")
I get that marriages end, and it is really not my business to judge why, but affairs are cowardly in my humble opinion. If you want out, get out, then go find someone else to be with. People who have affairs as a way to get out of a relationship lack moral fiber. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/39 "2013-01-30T18:00:26Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > Reread–I only hate my ex. **ladyfoxfire** and I rub each other the wrong way sometimes (most of the time?), but I don’t really have any hard feelings for her. I knew you were referring to your ex. The question stands. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2013, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779/40 "2013-01-30T18:00:38Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Wow. Did she kill your father too, or do you wish death on everyone who hurts your feelings? Wow, sorry, misread you there and thought you were thinking I was actively hating on ladyfoxfire. As for my ex, infidelity was just the icing on the cake. I didn’t divorce her for it the first time it happened (my toddler children ratted her out to me), and although a subsequent affair played a part in my decision to leave her, it wasn’t even the main reason. She is an extraordinarily unpleasant person to be around. If you knew her you would understand. So, no. If someone hurts my feelings I simply wish they wouldn’t. She has done much more than hurt my feelings, Machine Elf’s astute observation notwithstanding. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-and-men-who-have-affairs/648779.md?page=3)