# Women are 28% less likely to recieve CPR because strangers are afraid to touch them **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 8, 2024, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617 "2024-03-08T18:39:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/121 "2024-03-11T01:25:59Z")
That song would bring Me back! ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/122 "2024-03-11T04:38:07Z")
Yeah I think Another One Bites the Dust isn’t the most appropriate song to be singing while doing the chest compressions. But the tempo works. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/123 "2024-03-11T04:42:18Z")
Compare: \*And we’re stayin’ alive, stayin’ alive Ah, ha, ha, ha, stayin’ alive, stayin’ alive Ah, ha, ha, ha, stayin’ alive \* with _And another one’s gone. And another one’s gone. Another one bites the dust._ ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/124 "2024-03-11T05:00:32Z")
I posted a thread here that I was in disbelief that if a person was choking you needed their permission before performing the Heimlich. Many off the responses amounted to, “Of course you need permission, idiot.” so I am not at all surprised by the results of the poll. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/125 "2024-03-11T05:33:04Z")
Staying Alive. Much better! ---
**Author:** ![Nyvaak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Nyvaak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nyvaak)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/126 "2024-03-11T05:50:45Z")
Except that “_Stayin’ Alive_” is 104 beats/minute, and _"Another One Bites the Dust_" is at 112. But yeah, if there’s any chance that you’ll sing out loud and be overheard, then the latter would be in poor taste. (It always gets a laugh in CPR class, though. I did tell you about EMS folks.) ---
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/127 "2024-03-11T15:20:02Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Staying Alive. Much better! Somebody has to link to this ([Vinny Jones CPR PSA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njvfgBr9Rnk)). ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/128 "2024-03-11T17:40:03Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > why the public perceives that women receive less bystander CPR Interesting subject of the study. **Why the public _perceives_** that women receive less bystander CPR. > [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > women may have more equivocal complaints such as fatigue, syncope, vomiting, and neck/jaw pain, while men are more likely to report typical complaints such as chest pain. Hmm. And why are the men’s symptoms considered “typical” I wonder…? > [@solost](#): > > I’m not sure why they dropped the rescue breathing recommendation in recent years, though. This has mostly already been answered, but just wanted to mention that it’s only been dropped for a solo rescuer, and I think people who are strong and proficient are still OK doing it. It’s just a matter of where someone’s limited efforts will do the most good. > [@JaneDoe42](#): > > > [@doreen](#): > > > > When I was still working at a state agency , we all had to get trained to use naloxone nasal spray \* > > When I was working for the state, I asked why we had ZERO emergency training and was told that we were to never do any sort of first aid to anyone, ever. If we followed procedure and called 911, the state couldn’t be sued. If we touched anyone, even just to break a fall, the state could possibly be sued and we would lose our jobs the next day. Wow. Those are some drastically different state policies. If you don’t feel comfortable saying the name of the state, could you name the region? I don’t want to assume. I have training from my city to be a neighborhood emergency team resource. We are covered by the liability laws and indemnification of the city only when we have been officially activated by the city. We are not covered (indemnified by the city) for any other assistance we render, but we would then be covered by good Samaritan laws. Interestingly, when we are deployed, we can’t use someone’s EpiPen or other injection for them unless we have the proper credentials. But we can help the person deliver it themselves. Including preparing it completely and helping them to hold it in the right place. So all they have to do is push the button. Anyone nervous about it might think about that approach, if the person who needs it is conscious. Read the directions or have them tell you, then have them push the button. And it went without saying that some people might choose to push the button and take our chances. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/129 "2024-03-11T17:45:11Z")
> [@eschrodinger](#): > > Wow. Those are some drastically different state policies. If you don’t feel comfortable saying the name of the state, could you name the region? I don’t want to assume. I was in NY - but I want to point out (as I mentioned in another post) that this training was somewhat specific to my job. The clerks in my agency didn’t get this training and my guess is that most state employees did not get any emergency training. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/130 "2024-03-11T18:27:16Z")
There is plenty of sexism in medicine, and calling chest pain a “typical symptom” may be an example of that. But it is also what most people reasonably expect during a heart attack (movies and TV falsely inform many stereotypes). People are still sometimes surprised when this diagnosis is made following nausea, indigestion pain or sweating. Few laypeople would expect the _only_ presenting symptom to be anxiety, “feeling weak and dizzy” or hiccups, but of course it happens. (For the sake of completeness, other common symptoms can include shortness of breath, vomiting, profuse sweating, pain or pressure in the chest or radiating to the jaw or neck or back or left shoulder or stomach, palpitations, fatigue, _very_ rarely hiccups or excessive burping). Gender differences on presentation and other cardiological data have been well known for at least three decades. They are certainly well known by EMTs and emergency doctors and nurses. Even still, the second article shows worse outcomes for women, and these reasons deserve study and systemic correction when possible. ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/131 "2024-03-11T19:35:42Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > I posted a thread here that I was in disbelief that if a person was choking you needed their permission before performing the Heimlich. Many off the responses amounted to, “Of course you need permission, idiot.” so I am not at all surprised by the results of the poll. I think I missed the poll. What poll? I think there are protocols about what to say for several reasons. It is one step in assessing whether the person is conscious and oriented. If they do give permission, then no issues about that. If they are unable to answer, you would normally have implied permission if they are injured and you are trying to help. If they say no, then in a multiple casualty situation, you move on. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/132 "2024-03-11T21:51:24Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > The Lil’Debbie experience is probably not a good thing to do very often. Band name: _“The Lil’ Debbie Experience”_ ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/133 "2024-03-11T22:10:12Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > There is plenty of sexism in medicine, and calling chest pain a “typical symptom” may be an example of that. But it is also what most people reasonably expect during a heart attack (movies and TV falsely inform many stereotypes). One could also argue that symptoms like chest pain are more “typical” of heart attacks, in that the other symptoms can be associated with a wide variety of other ailments, many of them much more common than heart attacks. When a man feels a tightness in his chest, it’s a lot easier to conclude “possible heart attack” than when a woman feels anxiety and dizziness, even if you know the gender differences in how heart attacks manifest. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/134 "2024-03-11T22:19:01Z")
I was told CPR can break multiple ribs. It was part of my decision on Do Not Resuscitate for my mother. It depends on the situation. Someone that’s younger and has a better chance of recovery can deal with CPR injuries. A hospice patient doesn’t need to needlessly suffer that injury and pain . ---
**Author:** ![brasstacks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d26b3c/32.png) [@brasstacks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brasstacks)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/135 "2024-03-11T22:45:26Z")
Holy cow. That reminds me of the time I did the choking symbol to a family member and they kept telling me they didn’t know what it meant. I don’t know if they actually knew or not. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2024, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/136 "2024-03-11T23:56:16Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I was told CPR can break multiple ribs. It was part of my decision on Do Not Resuscitate for my mother. > > It depends on the situation. Someone that’s younger and has a better chance of recovery can deal with CPR injuries. > > A hospice patient doesn’t need to needlessly suffer that injury and pain . It’s been five months since my wife’s episodes, 20 minutes of compressions with the Lucas machine, and she still today mentions her sternum hurts. She’s not sure but she thinks her ribs may have had some slight fractures. My wife is sort of young, late 50s. But for someone in hospice and in their late 80s, that pressure on their ribs might be too much. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2024, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/137 "2024-03-12T00:01:37Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > for someone in hospice and in their late 80s, that pressure on their ribs might be too much. People in hospice nearly always sign paperwork refusing CPR. Truly, CPR flies in the face of the basic principles of hospice, which emphasize life quality and comfort care over prolonging life by means that would reduce quality of life. I have had a few hospice patients request defibrillation but no CPR. That’s a grey area but may be appropriate in some cases. Indeed, for most hospice patients CPR would be futile care also. And I as a physician am not compelled to provide futile care. Unfortunately such procedures all too often get inflicted anyways, especially when some family member arrives from out of town at the last moment and demands all must be done to save a life. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2024, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/138 "2024-03-12T00:18:02Z")
Here is a brief discussion on how to use CPR and AEDs, even if you have never done so. Ribs are held in place by three layers of muscle, so are unlikely to cause more internal damage. Broken ribs can cause pain, typically for four to eight weeks. Still, I don’t want to minimize there can be discomfort, even if usually treatable. While DNR makes sense for many people, I have seen people coerced into this decision based on melodramatic descriptions. You should follow your wishes and consider quality of life. > **[If you witness a cardiac arrest, your actions could save a life. Here's what...](https://www.cbc.ca/radio/whitecoat/the-dose-cardiac-arrest-1.7136483)** > > A cardiac arrest can happen at any time to almost anyone, and experts say the actions of a bystander can mean the difference between life and death.  ---
**Author:** ![Rangerdanger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/67e7ee/32.png) [@Rangerdanger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rangerdanger)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2024, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/139 "2024-03-12T01:32:49Z")
My spouse and i have a retirement business teaching First Aid and CPR to primarily government clients. The focus we were given is on saving lives, limbs, and etcs of co-workers, but the direction we are to give in class is use it anytime it is needed. We have upgraded our mannequins to about half male and half female - and added bras under shirts. The AHA’s video we use in training says that all CPR will be demonstrated on male patients out of respect for cultural sensitivities. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2024, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617/140 "2024-03-12T02:24:51Z")
Cultural sensitivities are important. To a degree. You don’t want people not doing CPR when needed due to a surplus of fine feelings. That could be part of the problem. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-are-28-less-likely-to-recieve-cpr-because-strangers-are-afraid-to-touch-them/998617.md?page=6)