# Women at Augusta National **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 22, 2002, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244 "2002-11-22T21:43:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Rhum\_Runner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rhum\_Runner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhum_Runner)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/21 "2002-11-24T16:19:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lurkernomore \* > \*\*Wonder what Burk would say if some guy sued the LPGA for being discriminatory and they said they had to let men play? Would she support this victim of sex discrimination? You’d end up with the PGA, Nike tour, and a few satellites, and the LPGA would cease to exist. \*\* [Here](http://www.lpga.com/tour/index.cfm?cont_id=145986) is the LPGA’s position on men joining their tour. > [@](#): > > What is the LPGA doing about its own membership policies, you may ask? This is a question we have been asking of ourselves long before the national debate began on Augusta. On the Tour side, our membership will remain open to women only, due to the immutable physiological differences between women and men. Looks like they want to be treated just like men, except when they don’t. ---
**Author:** ![Realhoops](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8dc957/32.png) [@Realhoops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Realhoops)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/22 "2002-11-24T17:29:12Z")
Wow. I haven’t spent much time around here in at least a year, and I’ve just been mostly lurking lately. Didn’t expect quite as much response to the first thread started by me! I think somebody else pointed this out, but yes women _are_ allowed to play the course, just not to be members. And since the membership fee itself excludes a very significant percentage of the population, men or women, it seems like all this hoopla is really over a very very small hypothetical number of women who don’t seem all that interested in joining in the first place. Anyway… thanks for the thoughts, everyone! ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/23 "2002-11-24T18:14:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Rhum Runner \* > [BLooks like they want to be treated just like men, except when they don’t. \*\* You’re making the assumption that the LPGA wants women members of Augusta and that NOW doesn’t want men on the LPGA tour. These are two different groups of women. Haj ---
**Author:** ![lurkernomore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@lurkernomore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lurkernomore)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/24 "2002-11-24T19:01:54Z")
No, Haj - Rhum’s link is to the LPGA which says: > [@](#): > > Augusta National should admit women as members. It is Augusta’s right as a private organization not to admit women. But it is not the right thing to do. > > . > . > . > Because of the place Augusta holds in the international consciousness, it must do the right thing and admit women. > > Augusta’s exclusionary practices with respect to women speak volumes. > . > . > . > . > On the Tour side, our membership will remain open to women only, due to the immutable physiological differences between women and men. That is the commissioner of the LPGA speaking. In all fairness, he also supports the right of a private organization to choose it’s members. But the LPGA Teaching and Club Pro membership is still apparently closed to men, though he has recommended changing this. ---
**Author:** ![Helen\_s\_Eidolon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Helen\_s\_Eidolon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Helen_s_Eidolon)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/25 "2002-11-24T19:14:39Z")
Do I think they’re breaking some kind of constitutional law by not letting women in? No. Do I think they’re WRONG to not let women in? Yes. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7feea3/32.png) [@PatrickM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickM)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/26 "2002-11-24T21:07:13Z")
It’ll never happen, but the first woman the snobs at Augusta should admit should be a young, gorgeous, dim-bulb blonde, just because doing that would really frost a lot of those agitating for women to be admitted to the club. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/27 "2002-11-24T21:48:35Z")
**PatrickM** , what’s with the rhetoric here? Rich, pretentious, snobs? Rich, yes. Snobs, probably not. Pretentious. Nope. What they are are people who have no particular desire to admit women into their club. And since they aren’t obligated to do so, being a private club, they aren’t. And that just irritates the living hell out of women, like it did at the Citadel. I’ll tell you what. When I’m allowed in women’s locker rooms after sporting events to get the good interviews like other women (kinda like women are already allowed to do for men’s teams, in total violation of male privacy and decency standards, IMO), then I’ll support women at Augusta. My first interview will be the US Women’s Soccer team, by the way. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/28 "2002-11-24T22:06:01Z")
I think this one belongs in Great Debates. ---
**Author:** ![AmbulanceChaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4af34b/32.png) [@AmbulanceChaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AmbulanceChaser)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/29 "2002-11-24T22:29:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by hajario \* > \*\*You’re making the assumption that the LPGA wants women members of Augusta and that NOW doesn’t want men on the LPGA tour. These are two different groups of women. > > Haj \*\* Correctamundo. Nancy Lopez, for one, has gone on record as saying she is _not_ in favor on women joining. FWIW, I’m not at all in favor of Augusta National’s policy, but what the hell. I do not approve of how the NY Times has used Tiger Woods on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![Azael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a8b319/32.png) [@Azael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Azael)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/30 "2002-11-24T22:57:09Z")
I’m impressed, at least when it comes to things like this people aren’t all over the place on the issue. Should the club let women in? I don’t see why not, but they sure as hell don’t have to. This whole feminist on a crusade thing got ridiculous the moment this person figured it was her right to force her views on a private club. ---
**Author:** ![Rhum\_Runner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rhum\_Runner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhum_Runner)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2002, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/31 "2002-11-24T23:36:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by AmbulanceChaser \* > \*\*Correctamundo. Nancy Lopez, for one, has gone on record as saying she is _not_ in favor on women joining. > \*\* Wrong. Nancy Lopez does not speak for the LPGA. See the language quoted by **lurkernomore.** It is the official position of the LPGA that women _should_ be admitted to Augusta, (while recognizing that they do not have to be) and it is also their position that men will not be allowed to play in LPGA events. ---
**Author:** ![AmbulanceChaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4af34b/32.png) [@AmbulanceChaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AmbulanceChaser)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/32 "2002-11-25T00:05:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Rhum Runner \* > \*\*Wrong. Nancy Lopez does not speak for the LPGA. See the language quoted by **lurkernomore.** It is the official position of the LPGA that women _should_ be admitted to Augusta, (while recognizing that they do not have to be) and it is also their position that men will not be allowed to play in LPGA events. \*\* You’re right. My mistake. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/33 "2002-11-25T00:42:35Z")
hajario’s excellent post seems to have gotten lost here. Allow me to restate his points: #1 - Women are allowed to play at Augusta National. Not only are they allowed to play, they do play, and quite often. #2 - There is no club bylaw that prohibits women members. There do not happen to be any women members, but there is absolutely no rule prohibiting it. If Ms. Burk wants to claim that AN discriminates against women, she needs to provide some _evidence_ and none has been forthcoming. The mere fact that a very exclusive, and expensive club in a highly male dominated activity happens to be all male does not suffice. ---
**Author:** ![I\_am\_Sparticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c68b51/32.png) [@I\_am\_Sparticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_am_Sparticus)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/34 "2002-11-25T01:14:33Z")
It’s a private club and they can admit and keep out who they want for whatever reason they want. I, however, am not obliged to watch their tournament, and can choose to boycott the business of every member of the club. ---
**Author:** ![Rhum\_Runner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rhum\_Runner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhum_Runner)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/35 "2002-11-25T01:19:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by I am Sparticus \* > \*\*I, however, am not obliged to watch their tournament, and can choose to boycott the business of every member of the club. \*\* But why? Do you boycott the business of every person who is a member of the Junior League? ---
**Author:** ![PatrickM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7feea3/32.png) [@PatrickM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickM)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/36 "2002-11-25T02:29:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Airman Doors, USAF \* > \*\ ***PatrickM** , what’s with the rhetoric here? Rich, pretentious, snobs? Rich, yes. Snobs, probably not. Pretentious. Nope. > \ > \*\* You’re right, Airman, my rhetoric is more than a bit heavy-handed. Having said that, an organization that uses the slogan “A Tradition Like No Other” for a pro golf tournament is self-evidently pretentious, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![ElwoodCuse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/edb3f5/32.png) [@ElwoodCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElwoodCuse)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/37 "2002-11-25T05:06:26Z")
God, the Masters is pretentious beyond belief. Just ask Gary McCord. ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/38 "2002-11-25T07:54:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ElwoodCuse \* > \*\*God, the Masters is pretentious beyond belief. Just ask Gary McCord. \*\* I agree. I watch the tournament because I like to watch people who really know how to play golf. However, any tournament that has Billy Casper as a regular competitor and not just a ceremonial one hole player, just ain’t all that great. By the way, nothing against Billy Casper. He once was a fine player but he has as much of a place in a PGA tournament as Bob Feller would have pitching in a major league ball game, or Jerry West active with the Lakers. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/39 "2002-11-25T14:17:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by David Simmons \* > \*\*I agree. I watch the tournament because I like to watch people who really know how to play golf. However, any tournament that has Billy Casper as a regular competitor and not just a ceremonial one hole player, just ain’t all that great. > > By the way, nothing against Billy Casper. He once was a fine player but he has as much of a place in a PGA tournament as Bob Feller would have pitching in a major league ball game, or Jerry West active with the Lakers. \*\* Billy Casper, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus, Gary Player, and the greats from yesteryear are all there because they have lifetime exemptions as former winners. They’ll never win, or even compete, and they certainly don’t waste your time, so what’s the big deal about having some older, respected golfers waxing nostalgic about the past? I think it’s kinda cool. Even at that age they play better than I do. Gary McCord…he disrespected the hosts in their own home. If he did it to you in your living room you’d throw the bastard out too, so don’t give me that holier-than-thou stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Siemsi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b19c9b/32.png) [@Siemsi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siemsi)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2002, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244/40 "2002-11-25T14:28:07Z")
I agree with NinetyWt. Private clubs are private clubs. I’m all for respecting the person…whether it’s a man, woman or other (hee hee)…but for crying out loud…these feminists need to have a nice cup of shut the f\*ck up. Just my opinion. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-at-augusta-national/138244.md?page=3)