# Women (over)react to catcalling **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 20, 2009, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120 "2009-08-20T20:36:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/261 "2009-08-23T18:00:32Z")
> [@Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](#): > > Incidentally, has anyone tried a response along the lines of “what would your mother say?” Just curious. I really don’t think it would be a good idea to make any kind of remark about the mother of a strange, aggressive man. ---
**Author:** ![StaudtCJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/90ced4/32.png) [@StaudtCJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StaudtCJ)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/262 "2009-08-23T18:20:48Z")
I know that saying “Would you want someone yelling that at your sister?” gets the “Nobody would _dare_ do that to _MY_ sister.” I know that catcallers get far more unhappy when they find out someone catcalled their family member. Apparently some of them KNOW what they’re doing is mean, cruel, and degrading, because they get very unhappy when someone does it to their wife/girlfriend/sister/mom. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/263 "2009-08-23T19:44:49Z")
> [@starwarsfreek42](#): > > It’s really not safe to walk down a busy street with your music so loud that you can’t hear people talking, or cars honking, or dogs barking. That’s an accident waiting to happen. I listen to my mp3 player loud enough so I can’t hear most people, but I’m pretty careful. Then again, I’m probably the only woman in this thread who has sometimes responded positively to catcallers, so I get the sense that I’m at a greater risk of getting raped and chopped up into bits than of getting hit by a car… ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2009, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/264 "2009-08-23T20:59:04Z")
> [@Lord\_Ashtar](#): > > “Hey baby, how about some fries with that shake?” ≠ Forcing one’s penis into an unwilling recipient. Dont mis order at a Sonic Hamburger…word to the wise for sure… ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/265 "2009-08-24T03:06:09Z")
Fighting ignorance indeed. Hey guys: women are harassed, molested, beaten, and raped daily. Also, cops don’t always have your best interests at heart, especially if you’re a minority. Also, the entire political mechanism is a corrupt sham and they’re in bed with big business (or they’re the same people). Wars and foreign intervention are for hegemony or money making purposes, not spreading Freedom and Liberty. Just like every other country. This is 101 shit. As for the general problem of women being harassed I think an excellent solution is violence. That’s all men understand. Or at the least the type of men who like to follow women and talk about how they can “smell their cunts.” Mace isn’t enough, but a knife to the throat might be. If this becomes a common thing it may actually stop, unless men are even more fucked up than I think. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/266 "2009-08-24T03:19:18Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > As for the general problem of women being harassed I think an excellent solution is violence. That’s all men understand. Or at the least the type of men who like to follow women and talk about how they can “smell their cunts.” Mace isn’t enough, but a knife to the throat might be. If this becomes a common thing it may actually stop, unless men are even more fucked up than I think. They are. Any man who would follow you talking about how he can smell your cunt would very likely be the kind of man who will take that knife away from you and do things to you that you would rather he didn’t…and which he likely wouldn’t have if you hadn’t pulled that knife on him. Remember O.J.'s _If I Did It_? He says (hypothetically) \*“If only she hadn’t come outside with that knife!” \*It not only infuriated him that she would pull a knife on him in the first place, but it provided the weapon needed for the violence that followed. I made a post earlier that most people seem to have ignored, but I’ve known a lot of these types of guys over they years, and you don’t want to fuck with them. If they respected and/or had any regard for women (in other words, were chivalrous enough not to hit or beat them) they wouldn’t be acting that way to begin with. They are not scared of you, and they are not scared of your knife. At the very most they’d act scared till you let your guard down and then they’d take your knife from you, but more likely they’ll just get pissed off and take it from you to begin with. I know this is gonna piss a fair number of people off, but as Dirty Harry says, “_You’ve got to know your limitations_.” Women aren’t big, they aren’t strong, and shitheel men are not scared of them! As much as it grates, the smart and safe thing to do is ignore it and get to safety as best you can. Confronting these guys and trying to play their game is very likely to get you hurt. (And again, if you assault them first, they’re very likely gonna get away legally with whatever they do to you as a result.) ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/267 "2009-08-24T03:20:39Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > I think we’ve long strayed from the drunken broads in the OP who beat up an innocent guy, and have gotten into a general discussion of catcalling in general, and women’s anger about this. All righty then. Sorry 'bout that. I’ll try to stay current. > [@marshmallow](#): > > Also, cops don’t always have your best interests at heart, especially if you’re a minority. That’s correct, even if you’re a majority. In Warren v. District of Columbia, 444 A.2d 1 (D.C. Ct. of Ap., 1981), the court ruled that it’s a “fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen”. They need only protect or serve the public at large — never any particular individual in need of service or protection, even if they’re witnessing a crime underway. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Understander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3da27b/32.png) [@The\_Understander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Understander)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/268 "2009-08-24T03:29:00Z")
This thread makes me sad. I’ve been having this insidious feeling (no, you comedians out there, it’s not about my personal experience) that relationships among anyone with any differences: race, gender, creed, class, and religion, to name a few, are breaking down. It honestly seems to me like a great big sore is being burst open and what we’re seeing right now is the pus and blood of resentment and pent-up frustration being borne out on anyone who counts as “the other”. I’m seeing it in the catcalling asshole who started the situation that resulted in his friend catching a beating, seeing it in the beating of that innocent man by women who really ought to know to use their words or get the hell away instead of committing assault, seeing it in Hispanic gangs killing black people on the Southwest side to initiate themselves into gangs, and I’m for damn sure seeing it with the motherfucking teabaggers ('nuff said)… it’s like this spirit of narcissism has completely seized the country. Ego uber alles. Don’t be the bitch. Make that other fucker the bitch. Get yours. It’s a losing game! That’s all the fuck they ever do in prison! You know what? Fuck fools that just yell out any random garbage that pops into their microintellects to make a woman feel objectified. Fuck fools that assume every person with an X and a Y chromosome is out to rape and kill and take and never give. Right now I only see two teams, the crazies and the sane. I know what roster I want to be listed on. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/269 "2009-08-24T03:55:29Z")
Good post, Enfant. Lots to think about there. ---
**Author:** ![Jerseyman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bbce88/32.png) [@Jerseyman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jerseyman)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/270 "2009-08-24T04:40:01Z")
There are people on all sides who’ll exaggerate to suite themselves and feminism has for the most part been a strong influence in restoring women to belief in masculine domination and superiority that at best they can only join and never think to change with alternative values. That is because ‘masculine’ means ‘what suits corporate business’. The truth is that the whole of our social setup, including feminism, supports that that is how men, especially young men **are**. If they are not, women of their age despise them as ‘wimps’ and ‘fags’. It is comforting to imagine that these are pathetic immature boys that no woman would touch but the truth is that they are likely to have had sex, if not any kind of a relationship, with far more females than men who go on about ‘equality’ and ‘friendship’, and the girls no more wanted anything to do with them afterwards than they did with the girls. If you don’t care and just go on demanding sex, eventually you’ll get it even if she regrets it afterwards. Feminism tells us that that is how men always behave and expect women to be sexual providers with no sexual demand of their own, so no point showing any greater respect since you’ll only be put down as a hypocrite. Luckily, very few women or even girls think of themselves as feeble feminists ‘oppressed’ by the superior rapist male of their own fantasy that they so wish they could be. That was a sort of _blast from the past_ to undermine the feminine challenge to coservative values some 40+ years ago and it succeeded all too well - like Stalin and Mao being bigger Emperors than the traditional Emperors before them. The only way you stop men behaving like tossers is to also stop girls thinking it ‘liberated’ and ‘equal’ to behave as bad - since girls are not likely to want to rape boys and get the same thrill out of it - and to value boys as the boys value them, to stop treating sex as a commodity they have for sale and to treat it as a shared act between friends or at least people with respect for each other. The cat-calling wankers stay with their mates as teenagers because no girl will have them, and pretty soon it gets through to boys that girls wield control, girls decide whether to admire the wimps who show them affection or the tossers doing the cat-calling, and in turn girls show boys how women want men to be. It is not women’s fault of course, but it is very much the fault of ‘feminists’ and other women’s groups that they have wrung their hands and wittered how feeble and helpless poor little girlies are and how their only relation to men is submission and everything traditionally associated with women inferior that they must reject to achieve equality with men instead of asserting equal and demanding men show equal with women. You can see the ‘feminist’ masculine bias even in something like abortion debate. The question is always about women getting rid of pregnancy so they can be the same as men, never about why they feel the need to and whether men should be expected to pay just as much attention to children and family life as women have been expected to. That is not equality, it is submission, the sexist equivalent of the old anti-racism that said every non-white could fit into superior white culture as well as those born to it and lose their ‘primitive’ heritage. They were right and a big improvement on belief in racial inferiority. But they were wrong too, to dismiss all non-European culture as valueless, to insist jazz and rock were _degenerate jungle rhythm_ even though a ‘cultivated Negro’ could of course appreciate Beethoven and Mozart. African - or Indian or Chinese - culture just had nothing worth bothering about. That is very much the _women in the boardroom_ kind of 'feminism. The more extreme represented [[My sexual revolution | Women | The Guardian](http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/30/women-gayrights)]here]([My sexual revolution | Women | The Guardian](http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/30/women-gayrights)) is more like the resentful Black playing up to racist _shambling ape_ images. Both of them assure the status quo because they either fit women into it or exclude them without influence. Neither allows the possibility of changing men and the _status quo_. But in reality, ‘Black’ influence has permeated ‘White’ culture by default far more than any activists ever planned - and often against their plans. ‘Feminine’ is changing society far more than ‘feminists’ like. ---
**Author:** ![Jerseyman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bbce88/32.png) [@Jerseyman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jerseyman)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/271 "2009-08-24T04:48:25Z")
Remember ET -\* divide et impera\* ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/272 "2009-08-24T10:09:19Z")
> [@](#): > > As much as it grates, the smart and safe thing to do is ignore it and get to safety as best you can. You don’t appear to be listening. Ignoring it will frequently ramp up the guy’s aggression, too. He regards that as an insult, as in the woman is not taking him seriously enough to answer. These guys get REALLY pissy and aggressive when they’re ignored. They want a reaction, any kind of reaction, from the woman they’re harassing. That’s what we’ve been trying to tell you. And probably mace, or a gun, will get him to back off. Yeah, he might take a knife away from a woman, but mace and guns are longdistance weapons. ---
**Author:** ![WILLASS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/54ee81/32.png) [@WILLASS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WILLASS)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/273 "2009-08-24T12:33:40Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Oh please! This is a 10-foot-high crock of shit. Where is this widespread phenomenon of women harassing men daily on the street, screaming at them, whistling at them, following them in their cars, demanding their phone numbers, name-calling when ignored or rebuffed, making threats, both veiled and unveiled? Where is this town you seem to live in where it is common and somehow accepted that women routinely publicly demean men this way? If this were typical behavior, then yes, I’d be happy if one day a man snapped and just slapped one of the crazy bitches who did this to them. > > The guy who didn’t? No. The guy who did? Until he’s dead. The fucker. So the time I had my genitals grabbed twice by a group of drunk middle aged woman in a club would have given me a pass to beat them until they were dead. The fuckers? You are seriously mental you freakbag. I can honestly understand being annoyed about it but surely the level this happens can’t be that constant that it’s driven you to insanity? I’d be curious to see what you look like as you must be one hot tamale to be hit on that often that it’s ground you down to the point that you actually advocate beating people to death. You poor thing. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/274 "2009-08-24T12:42:48Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > You don’t appear to be listening. Ignoring it will frequently ramp up the guy’s aggression, too. He regards that as an insult, as in the woman is not taking him seriously enough to answer. These guys get REALLY pissy and aggressive when they’re ignored. They want a reaction, any kind of reaction, from the woman they’re harassing. That’s what we’ve been trying to tell you. > > And probably mace, or a gun, will get him to back off. Yeah, he might take a knife away from a woman, but mace and guns are longdistance weapons. I like the gun idea. (I’m buying my wife a shotgun for our next anniversary.) Just be sure you shoot the right one. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/275 "2009-08-24T13:07:15Z")
> [@WILLASS](#): > > So the time I had my genitals grabbed twice by a group of drunk middle aged woman in a club would have given me a pass to beat them until they were dead. The fuckers? You are seriously mental you freakbag. I can honestly understand being annoyed about it but surely the level this happens can’t be that constant that it’s driven you to insanity? I’d be curious to see what you look like as you must be one hot tamale to be hit on that often that it’s ground you down to the point that you actually advocate beating people to death. You poor thing. Bitch, please. Two women grabbing your fellas on one isolated occasion is in no way similar to what we’re talking about here. And as for the rest of your post… good gods. I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume your reading comprehension skills aren’t that poor. Come back once you’ve actually read the thread. ---
**Author:** ![WILLASS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/54ee81/32.png) [@WILLASS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WILLASS)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/276 "2009-08-24T13:29:46Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Bitch, please. Two women grabbing your fellas on one isolated occasion is in no way similar to what we’re talking about here. And as for the rest of your post… good gods. I’m going to give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume your reading comprehension skills aren’t that poor. Come back once you’ve actually read the thread. What have I missed? The numerous times you have advocated violence for catcalling or the numerous examples you have given of when this has happened to you? I’m merely saying that if you experience this on a daily level then I can understand why you are so rabidly angry about it. The one time I got physically, sexually assaulted (not to mention the few times I’ve been catcalled by drunk women) has really made me quite angry. You go girl! ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/277 "2009-08-24T13:45:50Z")
> [@WILLASS](#): > > What have I missed? The numerous times you have advocated violence for catcalling or the numerous examples you have given of when this has happened to you? > > I’m merely saying that if you experience this on a daily level then I can understand why you are so rabidly angry about it. The one time I got physically, sexually assaulted (not to mention the few times I’ve been catcalled by drunk women) has really made me quite angry. You go girl! Are you going to make me multi-quote the entire thread? First: > [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Everybody keep your pants on. I may be exaggerating ever so slightly when I advocate MURDER, but I am 100% serious when I say if a woman beats the crap out of a guy for heckling her on the street, I’d like to buy that woman a drink, and wouldn’t feel bad for the guy at all. Also, there was talk about varying levels of street harassment, starting from a mere whistle, up to all-out following and name-calling, but I’ve already selected what I want to quote, and I don’t feel like going back and requoting because you don’t like to read. Next, there were a gazillion people in this very thread who’ve also pointed out how often this happens, and how little this has to do with physical attractiveness, or anything else the woman is doing right/wrong. I’m no outlier here, I’ve just been the one making a lot of noise about it. I’m not going to quote everyone here, but here are a few: > [@Ichini\_Sanshigo](#): > > Cute. Douchnozzle, it happens. A lot. Walking down the street in broad fucking daylight. And it’s fucking tiresome. Yes, yes, assault is wrong, and especially so since they got the wrong guy, but I can see where they’re coming from. This was probably just the last fucking straw. > [@stretch](#): > > Lucky you. I get this shit regularly. I don’t find it mildly complimentary to be screamed at by some guy: “Hey, Baby!; Suck My Dick!; Does the carpet match the curtains?” None of these are compliments. But I can mostly ignore that shit. It’s the escalation. I don’t consider having someone following me down the street in his car asking me if I want a ride to be innocuous. > > I’m not MOL, but there’s a tone and escalation that creeps use. I know people are going to hit on me and I’m okay with that. But screaming at me from a car, following me down the street, getting upset and extra creepy when I ignore you or tell you to leave me alone? Those things are not okay. > > Self-defense when faced with threatening behavior is okay by me. What the woment in the link did was wrong. What some other woman does to a heckling guy may be okay with me, depending on the context. > > And the fact that some of us get this shit more than others should not be surprising. In my case, in addition to being stupid enough to have been born female, I have the nerve to have long red hair. I must be asking for all this attention–if I didn’t want attention I would obviously cut if all off and dye it mousy brown. And wear a fucking bhurka too, because some men can’t help themselves when they see a woman and apparently I have to accomodate that. :rolleyes: > > As to the being nice to the guy long enough to get a free drink…addressing that would take a whole thread that I’m not up to starting right now. > [@Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](#): > > Yes, I know that. I’m sorry for taking my analogy too far. However, I know various women who aren’t traditionally attractive who get catcalled regularly. As **Cat Fight** said, it doesn’t only happen to supermodels. > [@MeanOldLady](#): > > No. > > Certain people seem to think my posts in this thread are saying that every time I put one foot out of my front door, whole armies of men clamor to the point that I can’t even move one inch without having to shove someone out of my face. What I am actually saying is that women -myself included, friends and siblings included, complete strangers who I’ve witness on the street included- are harassed, followed and demeaned by men in public, and it happens often enough that we’re beyond being merely tired of it all, and at times find ourselves mad as hell about it. > > Also, hotness has nothing to do with it. Men who harass women on the street are dingleberries, and I’m pretty sure they harass all kinds of women with varying levels of physical attractiveness. > [@Cat\_Fight](#): > > How often does it need to happen before it becomes a problem? > > Appropriately enough, I just got back from a stroll with my dog. I got two ‘whisperers’ (one 20-something black guy just saying hiiwanttomeetyou in a breathy voice – annoying but whenever – and one very preppy older white man complimenting my tits as if I’d asked him). I also watched as a 40-something white woman with a baby fought with a black teenage boy who’d clearly just said something sexual to her. He kept saying ‘I was talking about your baby! You’re ugly! No one would ever want to fuck you’ while his friends smirked. She challenged him to come to the other side of the fence and talk to her. > ‘So you can hit me?’ > ‘Yes!’ > She ended up walking off. I looked around for some cops but found none. Not sure what they even would have (could have) done. Anyway, while I do think street harassers are more blatant and brazen when it comes to ethnic minorities, this was a teen (or a group of teens) and an older mother, black and white. And yet the power still seemed to rest with him. You might ask how much power rests in the ability to yell slurs, but clearly he’d bothered her. > Anyway, I’ve seen worse and been on the receiving end of worse, but it was a lovely coincidence. Oh, and she was no supermodel. So maybe I made her up. > [@MissIntent](#): > > How often does it have to result in confrontation/stalking to make it justified that I don’t like it? > > I don’t get it much anymore. I don’t wander around in public often anymore, but it happened enough when I did to make me uncomfortable. > > One time in particular, a guy in a car yelled at me as I walked through the parking lot of my apartment. I ignored him and kept walking, he sped after me in his car and jumped out. By that point I was running for my apartment. I didn’t look back, I have no idea how far he chased me. It was enough. > > I’m getting a gun and a license to carry soon. I’m tired of being scared, it’s bull shit. > > And I agree with everything MeanOldLady has said in this thread. > [@Ichini\_Sanshigo](#): > > Maybe **MeanOldLady** isn’t an outlier here. I’ve been harassed like that, and so have several other women I know. And what you’re saying still comes down to blaming the victim. I cannot control someone else’s actions, and neither can **MeanOldLady** , or any of the other women this happens to. > > Explain to me why the hell I should change anything about myself to appease some rude asshole. Explain to me why these people are incapable of exerting enough self control to not spew from their mouths whatever rudeness pops into their tiny little brains. _Please_. > [@StaudtCJ](#): > > Expecting anyone to smile for your comfort is obnoxious. I’ve also cultivated that slight smile in order to be left alone. I wear minimizer bras. I have a firearm. Even with these “precautions”, I get catcalled and heckled. I live in an urban area, and just walking the 1/8 mile to the nearest mall (which is done on a daily basis, since I have a 2-hour a day commission-only stint there), I get a comment of some sort at least half the time. I’ve been yelled at, called names, propositioned, whistled at, told to smile (apparently my cultivated smile doesn’t count, because it’s not a “real” smile), told to smile BIGGER, nearly hit by a car for apparently “failing to appreciate” some dude’s comments, asked if my boobs were real, told that SomeDude wanted to “fuck my titties”, and followed all the way to the mall. > > The idiots hanging outside the mall are horrid, too, because they’ll grin and smile and say “Hey baby, what’s your hurry” and block my path into the mall. Then they’ll get upset if I get offended. “Hey, can’t you take a joke?” “It’s a compliment, baby, you should be flattered.” Of course, there’s always the “well, you’re a stuck up bitch anyway. No one wants to fuck you.” If you complain to the police or mall security, these guy policemen and security guards either think you’re over-reacting, crazy, or stupid and snotty. Because the guys never TOUCHED me, just “hovered” a few inches away and blocked my path, then the security people couldn’t do anything, and figured _I_ was the asshole for even bothering to report such a minor thing. The ONLY time I’ve ever had any success in reporting harassing and threatening behavior was the one time I got a female police officer. She actually took me seriously. > > If this happened at a high school, and the players involved were an aggressive football team, and the heckle-ee was a little nerdy guy with glasses, everyone would be up in arms. STOP THE BULLYING! and so on. But because it’s just happening to women, and women should just shut up and deal with it, or stay inside, or heck, just cultivate that smiling expression, or wear more covering clothes, or wear a minimizer bra, or get some mace, it’s just fine. Right. It happens frequently, to a lot of women, and at times we get flat-out angry about it. So someone answer the question. How often does it need to happen before we’re justified in being mad? Daily? Once every other day? Once a week? Once a month? Once a month for hour many years before a woman is justifiably pissed? And most importantly, since you seem to be clueless, read this and let it marinate. Sit down, grab a tumbler of good, aged rum (none of that Bacardi business), and then read this again: > [@Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](#): > > There’s obviously a huge difference of perception in this thread. Let me tell you a story. I went 28 years as a man without knowing that catcalling was a real phenomenon. I thought it was some kind of movie trope. Then I stumbled upon the blog [HollaBackNYC](http://hollabacknyc.blogspot.com/). After staying up all night reading these horror stories, I asked my wife if that shit ever happened to her. Her answer? “Of course, all the time, didn’t you know?” I didn’t. > > To all the other oblivious men in this thread: Have you actually asked the women (or gay men) in your life (who live in cities) if this happens to them? Even if it does, they probaby don’t bring it up in casual conversation. It is humiliating, after all. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/278 "2009-08-24T14:04:14Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > Am I speaking Chinese here? Am I really being this misunderstood? Ouch. What I’m saying is try different stuff out and see if something works better. > > But you’re probably right. Keep doing the same things over and over, and you’ll probably eventually get a different result. You can likely change the world by doing absolutely nothing. > > Good luck with that. I’m outa this thread. But the point is WHY SHOULD SOMEONE HAVE TO CHANGE??? That’s granting power to fuckers who should be the ones to change. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/279 "2009-08-24T14:05:24Z")
> [@Tymp](#): > > If I, a male, were to inappropriately proposition, harass, stalk and then, when rebuffed, insult a random man on the street the way **MeanOldLady** and others have described their experiences, I’d likely face better than a 50/50 chance of physical retaliation. I’d bet that large percentage of men would feel justified in assaulting a man who attempted to belittle and cow them as has been described. > > “Man Talks Shit to Other Man, Gets Well-Deserved Ass-Kicking” is not a headline that we’ll likely see, no matter how frequent the actual occurrence. > > “Man Talks Shit to Woman, Gets Well-Deserved\* Ass-Kicking” merits a 5-page discussion. > > [sub]\* Yes, the recipient of this particular ass-kicking was apparently misidentified and undeserving, but that’s minor detail in the context of the broader discussion.[/sub] I also need to quote this, because no one commented on it, and I think it’s good. You think a man would scream at another man repeatedly and/or follow him, then call him a “bitch” when ignored or rejected? If he did, he’s either not afraid of getting his ass kicked or knows some A+ jui jitsu. ---
**Author:** ![Tabby\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tabby\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tabby_Cat)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2009, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120/280 "2009-08-24T14:20:24Z")
Chemical castration juju in the water system. Hell, in the world’s water supply. It’s the only way to be sure. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/women-over-react-to-catcalling/507120.md?page=15)