# Word to the Wise: Just Say No to Blackface! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 12, 2003, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739 "2003-11-12T01:55:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![county](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@county](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/county)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/21 "2003-11-14T03:22:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JuanitaTech \* > \*\*While I cannot and will not condemn this man as racist based on this one action, I have no problems whatsoever condemning him as insensitive and an ass. \*\* For you and the others who commented about my posts; I regret that I haven’t your level of sensitivity and social conscience (not) Judge not… ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/22 "2003-11-14T03:41:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Rhum Runner \* > \*\* > **John Carter of Mars** - Does Auburn’s “zero-tolerance” policy apply only to employees, or is this for students too? I am opposed to campus speech codes. Even if the speech is offensive, it deserves protection. \*\* The policy applies to situations where a person or persons commit acts or make statements that are clearly racist in nature and harmful in intent. It applies to students as well as staff. It does not apply to those who take an unpopular stance or profess an unpopular opinion in public speech or honest debate. Also, I’ve not been on staff there for several years now. My information comes from a mailing to all alumni from the President of the University, and several news media accounts. I have not seen the actual language, but I believe its intent is not to stifle speech, but to prevent overt racist acts. ---
**Author:** ![Rhum\_Runner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rhum\_Runner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhum_Runner)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/23 "2003-11-14T03:50:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by John Carter of Mars \* > \*\*The policy applies to situations where a person or persons commit acts or make statements that are clearly racist in nature and harmful in intent. It applies to students as well as staff. > > It does not apply to those who take an unpopular stance or profess an unpopular opinion in public speech or honest debate. > > \ I have not seen the actual language, but I believe its intent is not to stifle speech, but to prevent overt racist acts. \*\* Well, I don’t want to make a total hijack here, though by linking to the Auburn article I think the OP at least invited discussion of the point, but I find such restrictions on speech at least as offensive as blackface. Maybe more so. If the rule is to punish people for unpopular speech, then I don’t see how anyone can say that the intent is anything other than to stifle speech. Racial history at Auburn not withstanding, it is simply wrong to punish people for their speech…The same right that allowed MLK to speak out in opposition to racism protects frat-boy idiots who want to dress up and act out their racist fantasy. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/24 "2003-11-14T04:34:52Z")
By **JCoM** “It does not apply to those who take an unpopular stance or profess an unpopular opinion in public speech or honest debate.” By\*\* Rhum Runner\*\*: “If the rule is to punish people for unpopular speech, then I don’t see how anyone can say that the intent is anything other than to stifle speech.” [Cool Hand Luke] “What we have here is a failure to communicate.”[/Cool Hand Luke] ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/25 "2003-11-14T04:50:13Z")
The judge is, at the very least, monumentally foolish and doesn’t seem to have shown much understanding of how offensive his “joke” was and has really offered no apology. I have to go along with **Monstro** here: He’s a dumbass racist who ought to be removed from the bench. ---
**Author:** ![Rhum\_Runner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rhum\_Runner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhum_Runner)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/26 "2003-11-14T04:52:00Z")
I think I understoood what you said, I just don’t see the distinction between the two as being meaningful. If I understand you correctly, the student members of the KKK can march on campus because that is “an unpopular stance or profess[ion of] an unpopular opinion in public speech” but if the same students of the KKK get together on their own time for a blackface party, then they are subject to the school kicking them out for “make[ing] statements that are clearly racist in nature and harmful in intent.” Anyway, that is how I understood what you said. Is that correct? Nice CHL reference, BTW. ---
**Author:** ![UrbanChic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/9dc877/32.png) [@UrbanChic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UrbanChic)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/27 "2003-11-14T14:15:14Z")
Did you mean to quote me, county? Not only did I _not_ comment on your post but my reply was not in reference to anything you’ve posted in this thread or any other. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/28 "2003-11-14T14:34:22Z")
I was at a Holloween party a couple of years ago, and someone came in blackface. He also hafd tufts of cotton glued to him all over. He was wearing a hangman’s noose around his neck. It struck me as unbelievably blatant and stupid. I don’t think the guy was racist, but of the “I know that it’s incredibly offensive, but I’m poking fun at the insensitivity, so it’s OK” school of thought. (National Lampoon carried that banner for years). But – guess what – even if you’re aware of the insensitivity and don’t personally buy into it, making that kind of joke is still stupid and insensitive. ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/29 "2003-11-14T14:57:04Z")
**county** , I thought **Juanita Tech’s** comment to be about the judge in question. However, if you feel you fit the bill as well, by all means step up and be discounted. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/30 "2003-11-14T20:03:23Z")
One year, when I was in elementary school, the secretaries in the school dressed up in blackface, and my principal was a slave driver…My parents wree horrified, but I was so young, I didn’t understand what the big deal was…now in hindsight, I can’t believe they thought that was agood idea… ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/31 "2003-11-14T20:11:15Z")
It’s pretty much impossible to pull off blackface without just looking like a racist. Ted Danson looked like a racist for wearing blackface, even though he was dating Whoopi Goldberg, wore it during an event FOR Whoopi, and did it at her request! At that point, you just have to give up on the ol’ Al Jolson impressions and find some other schtick. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/32 "2003-11-14T21:16:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lieu \* > \*\*_county_, I thought _Juanita Tech’s_ comment to be about the judge in question. However, if you feel you fit the bill as well, by all means step up and be discounted. \*\* Either that or **county** needs to let a little air out of the ol’ ego. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/33 "2003-11-14T21:26:12Z")
I didn’t know what the hell **county** was talking about. I’m almost relieved because I thought he was admonishing us for “judging the judge”. Turns out he was just being crazy. Hilarious! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/34 "2003-11-14T22:55:53Z")
**Rhum Runner** : I don’t feel all that comfortable explaining the details of a university’s policy when I haven’t read the fine print. Let’s move it to my yard. If you come here and want to discuss some stuff in a civil manner, we’ll probably talk. If you come here in blackface, with a noose around your neck as a joke, you’re outta’ here. There IS a difference. Freedom of speech is not a guaranteed right. My workplace has a zero tolerance policy concerning sexual harassment. Would you consider that to be an infringement on your right to freedom of speech? After all, I’m not free to say: "Nice rack, Baby!” Why? Because that’s hurtful and intimidating. I think Auburn’s policy is that hurtful and intimidating actions will not be tolerated. The decision of whether an action crossed the line and was worthy of explusion/firing or not rests solely with the authorities. Most people I’ve talked to don’t have a problem with that. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Tiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Mama\_Tiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Tiger)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/35 "2003-11-15T15:37:37Z")
Actually, as **whiterabbit** pointed out, it _is_ possible to get away with blackface, but only in the context of the Zulu parade. Zulu actually has a number of white members, and yes, they also wear blackface. But only _for the parade_. It’s a long-running social satire. And to show you how accepted it is in that context, a couple of years ago while waiting for the Zulu parade on Mardi Gras morning, a truck drove past us with a man wearing blackface in it – and a little girl next to me (black) said, “Look, there’s a man who’s going to be in a parade!” However, I think the judge went so far over the line of decency it’s ridiculous. Of course, he IS from Terrebonne Parish, which is down in the swamps, where enlightenment isn’t exactly standard…but on the bright side, looks like Louisiana is going to elect a non-white governor today (Bobby Jindal, of Indian descent), so clearly things are changing! ---
**Author:** ![whiterabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/cab0a1/32.png) [@whiterabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whiterabbit)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739/36 "2003-11-15T17:11:23Z")
Rereading, I’ll add to what **Mama Tiger** said – I am NOT condoning this man’s incredibly tasteless and insensitive costume. It’s just that this is the only place I’ve ever lived where blackface in ANY context beyond old movies on TV is at all acceptable. I’ve never seen it outside the parade – well, I missed the parade this last year, but I know about it – but this idiot may have thought it was all right because of that. Or something. He still deserves all the shit he gets, though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/word-to-the-wise-just-say-no-to-blackface/212739.md?page=1)