# Work Situation: Get HR involved? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 12, 2013, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049 "2013-08-12T17:31:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/21 "2013-08-12T20:40:33Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > I would go to HR, but, I wouldn’t act as if the rudeness/unprofessional behavior is the issue. They don’t give a flying flip about that. I would tell them about the bosses behavior, and then I would ask if there were some sort of studies as to whether it was a signal of upcoming workplace violence, and what I should do to protect myself and/or co-workers if the boss went postal. HR doesn’t mind screwing over a supervisor, either, if it protects their interests and the company’s. I think if the OP were _that_ good at laying on cover-your-ass bullshit with a trowel, he’d already be working in HR. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/22 "2013-08-12T20:55:04Z")
If I believed someone at my workplace was illegally harassing me, and I didn’t care about career repercussions, I would do the following: 1. Wear a digital recorder to document the harassment. (This assumes it is legal to do so in my state of residence.) 2. Talk to a lawyer. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/23 "2013-08-12T22:11:48Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > No, you actually _do_ know where HR’s loyalties lie. HR departments exist to protect companies from their employees. That’s it. HR is _never_ a friend to employees. _Never_ on the side of an employee as opposed to management. > Never, never, never, never. > > The _only_ time an HR department will side with an employee against a manager is when that manager’s conduct will result in a lawsuit against the company. Even then, that will only happen after the HR department and management have tried and failed to intimidate the employee into withdrawing the complaint. > > And, after the HR department has been forced to deal with the offending manager, the employee who brought the complaint to them will be punished. Maybe not immediately (they don’t want to be too obvious), but he or she will be punished. That’s not true at all. I worked with a group of employees who had been very mistreated by a boss who was disrespectful, yelled a lot, and created a terrible work environment. He’d also been with the company 20 years. No one was going to bring a lawsuit, but their work conditions were awful. We got rid of the manager and they’re all a lot happier. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/24 "2013-08-12T22:42:31Z")
Some sage advice in this thread, but I have to say, the FIRST thing your friend should do is grow a pair and confront the boss himself. Tell him, in no uncertain terms, that you don’t appreciate being yelled at and if it continues, it’s going to be a problem. And you will escalate this issue to HR and whomever else needs to be involved. What’s the boss going to do? Screw you! I’ve got a right to yell at you? Fire you? Yeah, talk about a lawsuit waiting to happen. I for one would avoid HR too at (almost) all cost. But threatening the asshole boss with a visit to HR wont sound desirable to him either. Because he also knows HR isn’t his friend. Nobody wants that shit. Not even the Boss. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/25 "2013-08-12T23:40:29Z")
> [@lorene](#): > > That’s not true at all. I worked with a group of employees who had been very mistreated by a boss who was disrespectful, yelled a lot, and created a terrible work environment. He’d also been with the company 20 years. No one was going to bring a lawsuit, but their work conditions were awful. We got rid of the manager and they’re all a lot happier. Wow. How? He didn’t get promoted, did he? People like that usually do. :rolleyes: Several years after leaving that particular job, I was asked why I left Hospital X after 4 months. I kind of hemmed and hawed, because it was a situation that wasn’t easy to explain in a job interview, but the interviewer said, “You can tell me the truth. I’ve been told many times that Hospital X is a very difficult place to work at.” So, word does get around. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/26 "2013-08-13T00:26:09Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > Wow. How? > > He didn’t get promoted, did he? People like that usually do. :rolleyes: > > Several years after leaving that particular job, I was asked why I left Hospital X after 4 months. I kind of hemmed and hawed, because it was a situation that wasn’t easy to explain in a job interview, but the interviewer said, “You can tell me the truth. I’ve been told many times that Hospital X is a very difficult place to work at.” So, word does get around. He got fired. We did our due diligence and—shocking!!!—listened to the employees. There are a lot of bad managers in the world but people who tell their coworkers never to say anything because HR will never never never help you are the ones keeping those bad managers employed and keeping HR far away from the employees’ side. Actually, now that I think of it, this guy was a director, but the situation remains the same. They told us what was going on (finally—it took a lot of guts and a group effort) and he got shit-canned. Same thing has happened with a few nurse managers since. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/27 "2013-08-13T01:07:40Z")
There were two situations where I confronted bosses myself. By “confront” I mean I waited until we were alone and told the bosses that dumping on their subordinates in public didn’t make them look good. In fairness to both of them I have to say that neither of them made a habit of yelling at their employees. A quiet chat isn’t going to do any good with an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Boogly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Boogly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boogly)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/28 "2013-08-13T01:18:12Z")
Have your friend keep a log and a digital recorder. Collect info and talk to an attorney with a copy of an employee handbook. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/29 "2013-08-13T02:25:18Z")
It isn’t illegal to yell at employees. It isn’t illegal to swear at employees. It isn’t illegal to humiliate employees in front of other employees - as long as you aren’t using gender, race, religion or in many states sexual orientation to do so (presumably you are in the U.S.) Whether HR does anything depends on corporate culture - in some corporations (or some organizations within corporations) this is ok behavior, in others it isn’t. Figure out which yours is - my guess is that its one where this is ok, because generally if it isn’t ok in an organization, its stamped out fast from above. If it is a corporate culture where it isn’t ok, keep your log, confront your boss, get your coworkers involved, and take it to his boss. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/30 "2013-08-13T03:11:38Z")
> [@want2befree](#): > > I worked at a small family owned newspaper, and the boss and his dad would single out one or two poor saps and yell at them on a regular basis in front of everyone. It became almost entertaining. The one guy took it for 20 years, and counting. I worked at a job like that, too - company owned by a man and woman (in a relationship but not married); the woman screamed at employees regularly; the man did nothing about it. She yelled at me in front of the rest of the staff, I told my supervisor that that wasn’t acceptable, and I was fired shortly after. > [@handsomeharry](#): > > I would go to HR, but, I wouldn’t act as if the rudeness/unprofessional behavior is the issue. They don’t give a flying flip about that. I would tell them about the bosses behavior, and then I would ask if there were some sort of studies as to whether it was a signal of upcoming workplace violence, and what I should do to protect myself and/or co-workers if the boss went postal. HR doesn’t mind screwing over a supervisor, either, if it protects their interests and the company’s. I like this approach - spin it as though you think there is impending violence (and who knows? If he yells in front of everyone, what else will he do?). > [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > I think if the OP were _that_ good at laying on cover-your-ass bullshit with a trowel, he’d already be working in HR. Hah - good point. 🙂 I think your friend should try to talk to someone about the yelling, but also get his resume tuned up and off to other companies. Companies that allow this kind of behaviour usually aren’t very good to work for. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/31 "2013-08-13T06:27:29Z")
Managers don’t exist by themselves. How do the other managers feel about this guy? How does his boss feel about him? You could be facing someone who is one of the boys, or someone who the boss is just itching to have an excuse to can. There is going to be nothing written about this, you need to have a sense of things. ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/32 "2013-08-13T16:16:55Z")
> [@Shakes](#): > > Some sage advice in this thread, but I have to say, the FIRST thing your friend should do is grow a pair and confront the boss himself. > > Tell him, in no uncertain terms, that you don’t appreciate being yelled at and if it continues, it’s going to be a problem. And you will escalate this issue to HR and whomever else needs to be involved. > > What’s the boss going to do? Screw you! I’ve got a right to yell at you? Fire you? Yeah, talk about a lawsuit waiting to happen. How is firing you for insubordination a ‘lawsuit waiting to happen’? Unless you can prove that the firing is because of your [race/religion/etc.], there’s no grounds for a lawsuit. I’m not saying that talking to the boss is necessarily always a bad idea, but you really shouldn’t have the attitude of ‘fire me, I dare you’ when you do. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049/33 "2013-08-13T19:26:45Z")
> [@MLS](#): > > HR is there to protect the company, not the employee. Repeat: Their purpose is NOT to protect the employee. As said above, unless he is being treated differently because of race, sex, etc., HR will do nothing. Complaining to them otherwise is a good way to be labeled a troublemaker, not a team player, and so on. Right. “ **HR is not your friend** ”. Never get HR involved unless it’s clear that whatever the boss is doing will put the company at risk for a large lawsuit. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/work-situation-get-hr-involved/666049.md?page=1)