Working with women.... Yay?

[overlyverbose]

I’m a woman, and, like several here, I’ve worked in fields that have been both predominantly male and predominantly female. I have to agree with the earlier comment that there are pros and cons to both situations.

In a male working environment, you have a very strict hierarchy. If you’re a woman and you start out in administrative work, it doesn’t matter how smart they think you are, or how much work you do, you have to be pretty extraordinary to work your way up on the totem pole. On the other hand, if you’re hired in at a higher-level position, as long as you remain straight-forward and somewhat aggressive, you’ll be OK. I’ve also noticed that, especially with older men, particularly if you’re working in a brokerage or other professional (not technical) field, they’re idiots when it comes to computers, and will absolutely refuse to take responsibility for any mistake. However, men are generally straight-forward, and far more matter-of-fact. You make a mistake, as long as you fix it and it’s not an enormous, asinine mistake, you’ll be fine.

With women, work relationships tend to be more complicated. The structure of the office, as noted earlier, tends to be more relaxed - your input is usually welcome, especially if you can provide a good, innovative idea that will solve a problem. However, getting involved in gossip will probably get you burnt, and you’ll probably have to deal with more emotions. For example, there was this woman where I used to work whose daughter had gone to college. She was a freshman. There was an administrative assistant working in our department who was just a little older than her daughter (a recent college grad) who became this other woman’s surrogate daughter. Said woman was also best friends with the marketing manager (also a woman). They all used to go out drinking together, and, even thought this assistant was awful, no matter what she did, she was golden. Because I didn’t have a closer relationship with all the women, I was left out in the cold and also left out of the information loop. I felt I couldn’t do my job well because of their relationship and eventually, for a myriad of reasons, left.

Regardless, good luck. Be prepared for mothering, and try to find a good balance of sharing a little of yourself, but try not to invest too much emotion into your job.

[catsix]

TellMeI’mNotCrazy said:
I currently work in a very, very male world, and I wouldn’t trade it for the world. The last two jobs I had were predominantly female, and I swear I have never seen such down-and-out cattiness and cutthroat-without-a-reason nastiness. Horrid stuff.

Yeah, I keep hoping that my next job will return me to the male-dominated techy world because I am much more comfortable around conversations about the last football game, Smith’s last bowel movement, the fact that Jones farted, etc. than I am around conversations about pregnancy, pms, kids and shopping.

Harriet the Spry said:
For a woman working in a female environment, I’d recommend not investing 100% of yourself in the office popularity contest.

I would say don’t invest any of yourself in the office popularity contest unless it’s more important to you for everyone to think you’re a sweet, nice, beautiful person than really good at whatever it is you do.

Bumbazine said:
Every female-dominated office I’ve ever been in has had the thermostat cranked up hot enough to melt Tupperware.

Yes! I am so thankful for the little server room of refuge, where the termostat is set at a much more reasonable temperature and the ambient air is usually 68 to 70F.

overlyverbose said:
In a male working environment, you have a very strict hierarchy. If you’re a woman and you start out in administrative work, it doesn’t matter how smart they think you are, or how much work you do, you have to be pretty extraordinary to work your way up on the totem pole.

They all used to go out drinking together, and, even thought this assistant was awful, no matter what she did, she was golden. Because I didn’t have a closer relationship with all the women, I was left out in the cold and also left out of the information loop. I felt I couldn’t do my job well because of their relationship and eventually, for a myriad of reasons, left.

This seems a little contradictory. You’re saying that a male enviornment is different from a female enviornment because in a male enviornment, it’s hard to move up no matter how good a worker you are, but in a female enviornment it’s easy to be golden by just being ‘surrogate daughter’ or ‘drinking buddy’ to the boss?

I’ve found that in male dominated work environments, as long as I put in the time and effort, and got results, I got respect.

[TellMeI_mNotCrazy]

@catsix

I’ve found that in male dominated work environments, as long as I put in the time and effort, and got results, I got respect.

I’m finding this too. It’s not easy to break into the world in the beginning, but by constantly showing them that I know my stuff, and will get the job done, I have earned a lot of respect and have really gained some valuable ground in an all-male world.

The same exact behavior at my previous (female) jobs got me branded as an ambitious bitch.

[overlyverbose]

@catsix

This seems a little contradictory. You’re saying that a male enviornment is different from a female enviornment because in a male enviornment, it’s hard to move up no matter how good a worker you are, but in a female enviornment it’s easy to be golden by just being ‘surrogate daughter’ or ‘drinking buddy’ to the boss?

I’ve found that in male dominated work environments, as long as I put in the time and effort, and got results, I got respect.

It is a bit contradictory - but I’ve found it to be true. Women tend to form closer bonds (at least that I’ve noticed) with those they work with. If you don’t play by those rules and form a close bond, you don’t move ahead. If you do form a close bond with everyone in your department, you’re a “team player.” You’re also rarely left out of the information loop because people talk about work when they’re not off the clock. They’re more relaxed and tend to discuss problems more openly. Remember that episode of Friends (if you watch it) where Rachel had to smoke with her boss to get ahead? Her boss was open to her friendship - there seemed to be less of a hierarchy where her boss was the boss and everyone was subordinate - however, if she didn’t accept that relationship on her boss’ terms (i.e., smoking with her boss and her colleague), she was never heard.

However, with men, although you don’t have a form a particularly close bond or even spend a lot of extra time with the boss, if you’re female, it seems that you’ve already got a strike against you regardless of how hard you work. However, if you’re a guy and you’re a hard worker and suitably agressive, you’ll probably get ahead as long as you make sure to toot your own horn once in a while so the boss is aware of your accomplishments.

[Futile_Gesture]

The universal truth is that any group that is overwhelmingly of one gender and spends most of their time together usually has tendances under the surface when things can get nasty. But if you’re the odd gender out you’re usually immune to the worse of it and can often even benefit.

Neither women or men are worse than the other when it happens, just bad in different ways. With men it can be a climate of macho, sort the men from the boys, one-up-man-ship. And with women it can be plain bitchiness.

Obviously in my time I’ve seen more of the former because neither happen to the same degree when the opposite sex are around. Ridiculous I know, but that’s human behaviour. As a species we’re used to, and function best, in a bit of a mixture.

[overlyverbose]

@overlyverbose

You’re also rarely left out of the information loop because people talk about work when they’re not off the clock.

D’oh! I meant when they’re not ON the clock.