# World of Warcraft General Discussion **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 4, 2009, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294 "2009-03-04T17:44:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 287
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5721 "2009-10-06T16:39:54Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Just in case you missed it, in the patch where all the mount levels were reduced they also added a Tome of Cold Weather Flying. As long as you have a toon that is 80 and can fly in NR they can buy this book from the vendor at Krasus’ Landing (for the usual 1000g) and mail it to your 70-something toon. Reading the book teaches cold-weather flying early! 🙂 I know, but Grachlah is my first toon on this server high enough to get to Northrend. So she’s 70, but has no higher-level toon who already knows CWF to buy the book. ---
**Author:** ![Telperien](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/65b543/32.png) [@Telperien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telperien)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5722 "2009-10-06T17:19:50Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Black Knight wipes are usually either folks standing next to exploding ghouls (they get a hunter’s mark on them when they are going to blow - run away!) or dieing in phase 3 due to insufficient group healing. You do know you can run back in during the encounter, right? > > During the champs it was probably either folks standing in the poison, or the tank standing in the poison, or melee getting bladestormed by the warrior. It is very important that the tank hold threat on all three of them, and that all DPS follow the kill order (generally we tell PuGs not to AoE just in case). We did have a little ghoul problem, but no more so than usual, I had thought. I’m pretty used to the mechanics of hTOC by now, and our guild DPS are very good about following the kill order. If you don’t, you risk getting yelled at a lot. If there are two hunters, we sometimes lay Freezing Traps to keep the ghouls from running back toward the healer so we have a little more time to shoot them down. It isn’t necessary, though. As for the champions, the tank was having a time with the poison, and it took him some time to remember to move. Me, I’ve died to the poison a few times, and I try to get out of it as soon as possible now. I hate dying to that poison. We generally try to take the shaman down first when we get him because of his heals, but Deathstalker Visceri kept kicking our butts. We decided to try to kill him first–and went down even faster. I was consistently the last one left since I was farthest away, near the healer. Our healer would die, then the tank, then whoever was next nearest. Then the champions would run toward me, I’d back up to try to hold them off (completely in vain), and then die. It was a shambles. Like I said, I have done hTOC lots of times with various groups, and never had something as bad as this happen. I’m DPS so I’m not exactly the lynchpin of any fight, but I don’t like feeling as if the rest of the group has to carry me, which I tend to feel, sometimes without reason. I’ve been keeping an eye on my numbers and my DPS is definitely getting better, but I’d like it to be higher. When I get my new devilsaur trained up, that should help. He’s 75 now so I’m going to run him through dailies and such to get him to 80. I’m also running heroics like mad for new gear. My new gun is still elusive, so I think I may start saving stuff for the Nesingwary 4000 after all. A few more Champion’s Seals will get me the Argent Tournament gun, which is better than mine, though not the best. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5723 "2009-10-06T17:37:40Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I know, but Grachlah is my first toon on this server high enough to get to Northrend. So she’s 70, but has no higher-level toon who already knows CWF to buy the book. Ah, for some reason I thought you had an 80 - must have been thinking about a different server. Carry on then! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5724 "2009-10-06T17:45:09Z")
I had problems with H ToC over the weekend and then again last night. I thought my healing was pretty good, but on Saturday we wiped at least six times on the Champions. The tank said he was Def capped, but his HP just dropped like a rock every fight. Even spamming Greater Heals couldn’t keep him up (and of course caused me to ignore the rest of the party). We still couldn’t get past the champions, though… ok, so yesterday, I get invited to H ToC and there he is again! Same problem at first, then this DK in the group points out that this tank is _standing in the poison_. No wonder I couldn’t keep him healed! They switch, and we take down the champions on the second try. Then Earlic or whatever his name is goes down quickly (without dropping my damned mace). Then we wipe on the BK three more times, and I notice that this former-tank-now-dps-warrior is doing \<1K damage!! Last time I group with him! I also took Rillian (my 54 tankadin) out to Azshara to take down some cliff giants for a BRD quest. I was quite pleased to find out I could solo elite giants 1-2 levels above me with very little trouble - once with an additional wandering add. > [@Tom Scud](#): > > We’re way short on tanks right now, though. I think just Reins and Rottingbird, and Reins isn’t on much. Bird’s tank is Lightbird; at least I _think_ he’s a tank and not Retribution. Reins’ other toon, Kahmu, is also specced to tank or heal. But yeah, after that we don’t have a lot of tanks which is one reason I rolled Rillian – but of course he’s levelling slooooowly, since I normally only play him once per week. But if you ever see me online, Tom, I’m always willing to heal a heroic if I have time. I’m trying to stack up the emblems, too. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5725 "2009-10-06T18:08:14Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > I had problems with H ToC over the weekend and then again last night. I thought my healing was pretty good, but on Saturday we wiped at least six times on the Champions. The tank said he was Def capped, but his HP just dropped like a rock every fight. Even spamming Greater Heals couldn’t keep him up (and of course caused me to ignore the rest of the party). We still couldn’t get past the champions, though… ok, so yesterday, I get invited to H ToC and there he is again! Same problem at first, then this DK in the group points out that this tank is _standing in the poison_. No wonder I couldn’t keep him healed! They switch, and we take down the champions on the second try. Then Earlic or whatever his name is goes down quickly (without dropping my damned mace). Then we wipe on the BK three more times, and I notice that this former-tank-now-dps-warrior is doing \<1K damage!! Last time I group with him! IME, if the tank dies to the champs, it’s almost always the poison. That stuff really hurts… And the third phase of the BK is all about DPS - you go too slow and no healer can keep up the raid. Do you remember the toon’s name so I can avoid him too? I’ve been developing a decent “Ignore” list 🙂 Running heroics more often these days (for the daily mainly) really points out the range in player quality (especially on a casual server like Cairne). Sometimes it’s awesome, 40k HP tanks, 3k+ DPS, ridiculous heals… and sometimes you get two 1k DPSers and a DK tanking in Blood Presence. At least it keeps it exciting, right? Right? ☹ ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5726 "2009-10-06T19:06:45Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Yeah, DK DPS is certainly the hardest class to get a group for (or a guild invite for that matter). They have the reputation that I’ve heard hunters used to have… and I will admit that of all the poor playing, rude, annoying toons I’ve PuGged with, for some reason DKs far outnumber the others. The theory I’ve heard is that Death Knights are “kewl” compared to Hunters and Rogues, so the jerks left for those two classes. Plus, it’s new and relatively easy to level, since you jump straight into the late-game content armed with full-blues. Edit: Forgot to ask, but I’ve made 78 and now have Icecrown and Storm Peaks left, plus a handful of quests in Zul-Drak. I also have quests left over in Grizzly Hills and Howling Fjord, but they seemed uninteresting and sans good lewt. Plus a few quests I need a couple more levels or a party for. Any hints as to where I should go? I needed a couple days’ break from WoW to recharge my batteries, so I’ll have a nice experience boost anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5727 "2009-10-06T19:09:36Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Plus, it’s new and relatively easy to level, since you jump straight into the late-game content armed with full-blues. Hell, that’s why I’m on a DK - I didn’t feel like paying for a server transfer and didn’t want to relevel all the way from 1. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5728 "2009-10-06T19:51:18Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Ah, for some reason I thought you had an 80 - must have been thinking about a different server. Carry on then! 🙂 I have an 80 human DK on another server. I wanted to try out high-end game on Horde side this time. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5729 "2009-10-06T19:53:35Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > The theory I’ve heard is that Death Knights are “kewl” compared to Hunters and Rogues, so the jerks left for those two classes. Plus, it’s new and relatively easy to level, since you jump straight into the late-game content armed with full-blues. > > Edit: Forgot to ask, but I’ve made 78 and now have Icecrown and Storm Peaks left, plus a handful of quests in Zul-Drak. I also have quests left over in Grizzly Hills and Howling Fjord, but they seemed uninteresting and sans good lewt. Plus a few quests I need a couple more levels or a party for. Any hints as to where I should go? I needed a couple days’ break from WoW to recharge my batteries, so I’ll have a nice experience boost anyway. Storm Peaks has a great storyline (Alliance-side, anyway…haven’t hit it on my Hordie yet) and interesting quests. Icecrown is more difficult and more dreary, really. Zul’Drak I’m dreading on my Horde…it’s huge, it’s dreary and it’s depressing. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5730 "2009-10-06T19:56:49Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Storm Peaks has a great storyline (Alliance-side, anyway…haven’t hit it on my Hordie yet) and interesting quests. Icecrown is more difficult and more dreary, really. Zul’Drak I’m dreading on my Horde…it’s huge, it’s dreary and it’s depressing. I love Zul’Drak, probably because it’s got the best atmosphere in the game. Which I guess is another way of saying it’s dreary and depressing. Also, it’s the one time I can remember in the game where you get to pull an obnoxious switcheroo on an NPC, instead of vice versa. ---
**Author:** ![lizardling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f4b2a3/32.png) [@lizardling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lizardling)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5731 "2009-10-06T20:18:52Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > I love Zul’Drak, probably because it’s got the best atmosphere in the game. Which I guess is another way of saying it’s dreary and depressing. Also, it’s the one time I can remember in the game where you get to pull an obnoxious switcheroo on an NPC, instead of vice versa. Ditto. A whole zone full of trolls? YA PLZ. 😃 H TOC can definitely be a pain in the ass without a solid tank/heal combo. We kill the shaman first, then the pally/rogue/etc, then the hunter last. It also helps that we have a pally tank, he’s an absolute threat monster. I should suggest that we try for the avoiding-ghoul-explosions achievement although that’ll be interesting for the melee. Maybe we can get it if the DK uses AoD and I use traps and everyone else runs like hell? 😕 P3 BK is definitely a DPS race. I usually save my big-gun CDs for that phase and then blow everything. Last night I ran a guildie through reg Old Hillsbrad by myself, which was interesting since she was at-level and thus had a ginormous aggro range. :eek: Ended up with her standing way back while me and the monkey beat them down, then she came in for the end. Once we got Thrall (yay!) things got much easier. I don’t think I’ve done that much kiting and trapping for a while – good practice! I’ve also been farming Sporeggar rep and am about 2 Underbog runs away from Exalted – I can’t wait to get me the pet although I will give the tabard a pass. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5732 "2009-10-06T20:51:25Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Do you remember the toon’s name so I can avoid him too? I’ve been developing a decent “Ignore” list Crims, on Cairne. His gear’s not terrible, but now I see he’s still got several \>200 blues equipped. He should probably be running regular heroics. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5733 "2009-10-06T21:11:17Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > I love Zul’Drak, probably because it’s got the best atmosphere in the game. Which I guess is another way of saying it’s dreary and depressing. Also, it’s the one time I can remember in the game where you get to pull an obnoxious switcheroo on an NPC, instead of vice versa. Bah, Zul’Drak has too many group/world-elite/bizarre “vehicle” quests, and I’ve had extremely bad luck at trying to find people to help me with them. Some of them (like that Betrayal quest) I’ve tried repeatedly going back to after leveling up or upgrading my gear and trying again, but still no dice. I got real frustrated real quick with long, interesting quest chains that I never got to see the ending of because I can’t do the final quest. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5734 "2009-10-06T21:33:49Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > Bah, Zul’Drak has too many group/world-elite/bizarre “vehicle” quests, and I’ve had extremely bad luck at trying to find people to help me with them. Some of them (like that Betrayal quest) I’ve tried repeatedly going back to after leveling up or upgrading my gear and trying again, but still no dice. I got real frustrated real quick with long, interesting quest chains that I never got to see the ending of because I can’t do the final quest. When you get to that point on Cairne let me (Muz) know – I think I can sneak up to the top of the city and help out once you’ve started the fight going. (As far as I was concerned, the Betrayal quest was just at the hard end of the sweet spot for challenge; hard enough that I wiped a few times on it and that it would be a challenge without being so hard that I got frustrated.) ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5735 "2009-10-06T22:00:31Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > (As far as I was concerned, the Betrayal quest was just at the hard end of the sweet spot for challenge; hard enough that I wiped a few times on it and that it would be a challenge without being so hard that I got frustrated.) I got it and was horribly frustrated, because for some reason the Blightblood Troll self-healing wasn’t showing up in my hotbar. This really pisses me off. Plus, I can’t find anybody who goes into Drak’Tharon keep, so I’ve pretty much tossed even the possibility of having the storyline work and basically am saying 'Eh, it’s the Bronze Dragonflight’s fault." ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5736 "2009-10-06T22:25:30Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > (As far as I was concerned, the Betrayal quest was just at the hard end of the sweet spot for challenge; hard enough that I wiped a few times on it and that it would be a challenge without being so hard that I got frustrated.) > [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > I got it and was horribly frustrated, because for some reason the Blightblood Troll self-healing wasn’t showing up in my hotbar. This really pisses me off. Plus, I can’t find anybody who goes into Drak’Tharon keep, so I’ve pretty much tossed even the possibility of having the storyline work and basically am saying 'Eh, it’s the Bronze Dragonflight’s fault." My problem was that you have to click buttons/mash hotkeys to control the undead troll thingy, but at the same time you have to keep moving, running in a circle around the platform (according to every strategy I read on WowHead) because if you stop moving the big bad nails you with his ranged spell thing, which would kill me in 2 hits. I found it utterly impossible to both control the troll _and_ run around in a circle without running right off the edge of the platform. Then when the first troll finally dies you pretty much have to stop and use the rod to take control of another troll, but the big bad can kill you in less than the “cast time” needed by the rod. And of course there’s absolutely no way to heal yourself without stopping moving. What, swallow a potion that restores 1700 or so of the 10,000 HP you just lost to the first spell he hits you with? ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2009, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5737 "2009-10-06T22:33:47Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > My problem was that you have to click buttons/mash hotkeys to control the undead troll thingy, but at the same time you have to keep moving, running in a circle around the platform (according to every strategy I read on WowHead) because if you stop moving the big bad nails you with his ranged spell thing, which would kill me in 2 hits. I found it utterly impossible to both control the troll _and_ run around in a circle without running right off the edge of the platform. Then when the first troll finally dies you pretty much have to stop and use the rod to take control of another troll, but the big bad can kill you in less than the “cast time” needed by the rod. And of course there’s absolutely no way to heal yourself without stopping moving. What, swallow a potion that restores 1700 or so of the 10,000 HP you just lost to the first spell he hits you with? I’ve always ended up asking a lvl 80 friend or two to help out (a healer is helpful) - have them group up with you and fly up to the top of that necropolis, then you enter the usual way. When the event starts, they dismount and help you fight. ---
**Author:** ![Quasimodem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/e274bd/32.png) [@Quasimodem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quasimodem)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2009, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5738 "2009-10-07T01:57:28Z")
… **aruvqan** and **Shot From Guns**!🙂 **a** sent me a gift card ensuring that I get to play WoW for another year! And **SFG** spent her Monday afternoon helping me to clean up **Wolkie** and his “Mess”! All of you kids have been just SUPER to me, but I wanted to thank these two ladies for going above and beyond. Thanks to both their kindnesses I will be able to play WoW and play much better than before.🙂 “Class Acts” indeed! Thanks so much! Quasi ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2009, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5739 "2009-10-07T02:10:41Z")
> [@Telperien](#): > > I’ve been in two hTOC runs this weekend that didn’t finish. The first one, we wiped three times on the Black Knight and gave up. The last time I went to H ToC my group wiped a few times on the first three champions. It was a struggle just getting to the BK and when someone showed the DPS recount I was #2. I was the tank. I find that when I run through H ToC either my group does extremely well or we flounder and give up after dying multiple times. My last trip through ended up costing me about 80g in repairs. Odesio ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2009, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/5740 "2009-10-07T02:25:35Z")
I’m glad I’m not the only one to end up with hit-or-miss pugs for H ToC! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=286) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=288)