# World of Warcraft General Discussion **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 4, 2009, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294 "2009-03-04T17:44:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 328
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6541 "2009-11-05T21:22:30Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Hope that was a joke… Crusader Aura only affects \*\*mounted \*\*speed. IIRC, the only aura that buffs all movement speed is Aspect of the Pack, and that would be deadly for Faction Champs because of the daze-on-hit. > > Speaking of FC, here’s another trick for it: dedicate one DPS to attacking a pet. You’re not trying to kill it–the idea is to make the pet soak up the heals that would otherwise go to the bosses. It works because the healers tend to prioritize the thing with the lowest HP by strict numbers, not by percentages. I’m almost always assigned to locking down a healer (Holy Pally or Priest), and I can tell you that with this strategy, my target spends most of its time healing the pet we’ve got a Hunter sitting on. Thish also means I’m much more likely to have a stun or interrupt available to cut off the heals that do matter. So you have fewer heals going to the bosses and the heals that do go to them are more likely to fail. It was a joke. The point is RUN!!! Yeah, we’ve been doing that and it makes a difference. Healers don’t always heal the pet but at some point they all start focus healing the pet. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6542 "2009-11-05T21:28:25Z")
> [@Mekhazzio](#): > > If by Relentless, you mean the 258 grade that is making the BIS lists rather than the 245, then you need to be in something like the top 5% of whichever arena bracket you decide to participate in. If you’re not already an avid PVPer (and, importantly, know other people who also are) then you will find this very challenging if not impossible. However, the 245 weapons (which are still pretty good) are a lot more obtainable. Even then, it bears noting that these weapons place high because of their sheer item level and lack of competition. If you’re looking for, say, an item level 245 two-handed strength weapon out of 10-man raiding, then there is one and only one item that fits the bill. The PVP weapons are almost never better than their raiding counterparts, but if you are a PVPer (and, even better, one of the currently dominant arena classes/specs) then it’s much easier to get a weapon from arena than from the end-boss of the hard-mode raid that was just released last week. > > The only time PVP weapons actually -are- best in slot straight-up is for feral druid and DK tanking, where their immense stamina budget blows all the PVE (and exclusively DPS-oriented) alternatives out of the water. Yeah I am talking about the relentless 258 stuff. It sounds like you’re telling me its tough to get. There seems to be some PVP weapons that are BiS for resto druids according to RAWR. I will take another look. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6543 "2009-11-05T21:34:18Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > Well, my naive thinking way back last year when I started my Ret Pally was simply “Mine for the mats, BS my gear, and all is good.” But a year later, with both professions maxed, I now realized that I can virtually race through the JC ladder when the mats have been mined. There maybe quite some time to hunt down the JC recipes, but I think picking Mining early on wasn’t a mistake after all…just a means to an end. I’m not saying that mining isn’t a good way to get BS to max. BUT right now thcombination of BS and JC is pretty much unbeatable with ENCHANT/JC coming a close second for casters. You are talking about sometimes marginal differences but the flexibility of having those extra gem slots from BS and the upgraded gems from JC means you have much more gear flexibility than any other tradeskill combination (which usually gives a short menu of possible buffs in a single slot). ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6544 "2009-11-05T22:18:47Z")
I just now realized where some of my 80 pally’s HP disappeared to (she used to have more than 18k unbuffed, and at some point her HP dropped to just over 17k): it must have happened when she dropped Mining for Enchanting, and she lost that Toughness buff (+STA) that Miners get. :smack: I spent all sorts of time going over her gear trying to figure out what happened. I couldn’t figure it out because none of the gear upgrades I’d given had reduced her Stamina. ---
**Author:** ![Goblinboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3be4f8/32.png) [@Goblinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Goblinboy)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6545 "2009-11-05T22:41:45Z")
What is the benefit of going JC/BS over BS/mining to a plate tank? Does JC really add that much more stam then straight mining does? If we’re only talking a couple of hundred hitpoints, I question wether it’s worth the effort. Yeah, it’ll benefit my dps spec better, but I’m not worried if I’m a couple of dps lower without it. I’d be curious to see some numbers. This is for a warrior who already has blacksmithing and mining maxxed. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6546 "2009-11-05T23:19:38Z")
> [@Goblinboy](#): > > What is the benefit of going JC/BS over BS/mining to a plate tank? Does JC really add that much more stam then straight mining does? If we’re only talking a couple of hundred hitpoints, I question wether it’s worth the effort. Yeah, it’ll benefit my dps spec better, but I’m not worried if I’m a couple of dps lower without it. I’d be curious to see some numbers. > > This is for a warrior who already has blacksmithing and mining maxxed. At max Mining gives you +60 Stamina. Jewelcrafters can make and use Solid Dragon’s Eyes, which are +51 Stam. Not a great deal by itself, but when you can slot 3 or 4 of them on yourself, especially considering BS gives you sockets on your bracers and gloves, that’s a hell of a lot more Stamina. ---
**Author:** ![Goblinboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3be4f8/32.png) [@Goblinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Goblinboy)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6547 "2009-11-05T23:32:46Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > At max Mining gives you +60 Stamina. Jewelcrafters can make and use Solid Dragon’s Eyes, which are +51 Stam. Not a great deal by itself, but when you can slot 3 or 4 of them on yourself, especially considering BS gives you sockets on your bracers and gloves, that’s a hell of a lot more Stamina. But ordinary epic gems can give you 30 stamina. So that’s only 21 bonus per gem. If you can only put in 3 Solid Dragon’s Eyes, that’s only going to give you 63 bonus stamina over regular gems. Mining gives you 60. I’m not going to redo a profession for 3 stamina. And yeah, it would be benefit my arms spec a lot more to get 63 strength instead of 60 stamina ( since you can’t change what stats you get from mining like you can with jewelcrafting ) but I’ve always considered my tanking stats higher priority then my dps ones. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6548 "2009-11-05T23:47:23Z")
> [@Goblinboy](#): > > But ordinary epic gems can give you 30 stamina. So that’s only 21 bonus per gem. At the end game, progression is all about eking out those last few points. Besides, I apparently vastly underestimated just how many slots an endgame raider has. Glancing at high ilevel items, chest pieces have 3 sockets, legs have 2, feet have 2, helmets have 1 + 1 meta, and shoulders have 1. That’s 9 sockets anyone can get (I’m assuming you can’t slot non-meta gems in meta slots), plus the Eternal Belt Buckle for 10. Then Blacksmiths get an extra 2 slots for a total of 12. If you’re Stamina-crazy and put +Stam gems in every available slot, that’s an extra 252 Stamina a Jewelcrafter can get over ordinary epic gems (12 gems x 21 Stam), which is 192 Stamina over someone with BS and Mining. Even at endgame an extra 1920 health is not insignificant. Then of course there’s the versatility you mentioned, and intelligent slotting can probably get even more out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Quasimodem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/e274bd/32.png) [@Quasimodem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quasimodem)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6549 "2009-11-05T23:56:01Z")
**jayjay’s** gettin’ a new _BOX_??? Awesome, **jay** , but if I can help (even in my limited way), holler, okay?🙂 Q ---
**Author:** ![Goblinboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3be4f8/32.png) [@Goblinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Goblinboy)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2009, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6550 "2009-11-05T23:57:53Z")
I’m at work, so I can’t look it up, but I was under the impression that Dragon’s Eyes had something like Unique(3) on them. So you can only equip three of them. I can’t imagine Blizzard letting Jewelcrafters get that much of ANY stat more then anyone else. Stamina would be the least of their worries. Imagine if that was strength or intelligence. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6551 "2009-11-06T00:02:25Z")
> [@Goblinboy](#): > > I’m at work, so I can’t look it up, but I was under the impression that Dragon’s Eyes had something like Unique(3) on them. So you can only equip three of them. I can’t imagine Blizzard letting Jewelcrafters get that much of ANY stat more then anyone else. Stamina would be the least of their worries. Imagine if that was strength or intelligence. Ooh, good catch. I missed that entirely. Okay, so it’s limited to an extra +63 Stamina over Mining and using ordinary gems, which is still twice the value Mining provides. (Both JC and non-JC can continue to stack extra non-unique +Stam gems beyond the first 3, so those are a wash.) Whether or not that’s worth relearning an entire profession entirely is up to the player, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6552 "2009-11-06T00:10:25Z")
> [@Words\_on\_the\_Interweb](#): > > I’ve been there, to an extent, except as an officer. And I just have to say - please don’t dump on the officers the way you did in your PM. They’re doing their best, and if they’re really interested in raiding, they’re probably more frustrated with the situation than you are - not only are they experiencing the exact same frustrations as you with the other raiders, they have to deal with the burden of responsibility for keeping the rest of the guild happy. You’re right that you need an attitude adjustment (if you want to continue on in your current guild), but your PM isn’t going to accomplish that - all you’re really doing there is spreading your unhappiness around. There’s a lot of context missing from what I wrote in the PM, so I can see how someone without the context could see it as dumping on the GMs. I’ve offered many suggestions and ways to do things differently or better. But as others have said, I am not an officer and there’s a thin line between offering suggestions and acting like a Jr. GM. > [@](#): > > Ulduar has been out almost 8 months now, and many raid guilds are having problems filling their rosters right now - people are bored, and ToC/Ony may be repetitive and boring, too, but at least it’s quick and the rewards are good. I absolutely agree with that. But the GMs decide what we do and we’re doing Ulduar too. So I’d hope that people would put the same level of effort in showing up and doing the content to the best of their ability. TBH, I don’t want to run Ulduar anymore. But I’m not in a position to decide that. > [@](#): > > Your expectations of raids, and the fact you’ve been raiding 4 nights per week, make you a “hardcore” raider in WoW, regardless of what you want to label yourself… if you’re that frustrated and your guild has never had the focus you want, there are plenty of raid guilds recruiting. The grass is greener, of course, but at least more “hardcore” guilds generally enforce certain standards of behaviour for granting raid slots. The grass is never greener. Just a different shade. The distinction I’m making between hardcore and casual is the different between having relaxed rules or having very strict rules with actual consequences for not meeting the requirements. I wouldn’t disagree with what you wrote either. I don’t want those kinds of rules either, which is why I came to the conclusion that the guild can’t be fixed in a way that makes people more accountable without changing the very nature of the guild. Which is how I figured out that my attitude needs to adjust. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6553 "2009-11-06T03:04:57Z")
_squee_ If you’re willing to pay $10 a pop like me, you too can have your very own [Lil’ KT or Pandaren Monk](http://us.blizzard.com/store/browse.xml?f=c:5,c:33). Itty-bitty Kel’Thuzad will cackle when you click on him, randomly cackle for no reason (and scare the everliving shit out of me in the process) and has a great head animation in the process, and on rare occasion will freeze and kill a nearby Critter. Supposedly it will also laugh at your fallen PvP opponents, but I’m allergic to PvP. Pandaren Monk will return a /bow, do ‘kung fu’ moves when bored, and have a seat when you toast him with /drink. I think he eventually pulls out his little bottle after having a rest. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6554 "2009-11-06T03:18:36Z")
First thought: Why would I pay $10 for a cosmetic item? Second thought: …Well, hell, I’ve already bought a couple City of Heroes costume packs for $10 each. Third thought: …And damn those are some cool pets. I kinda want to buy one. Fourth thought: [PUG! PUG PUG PUG!](http://www.wow.com/2009/11/05/patch-3-3-ptr-get-a-pug-when-you-pug/) ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6555 "2009-11-06T03:26:18Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > First thought: Why would I pay $10 for a cosmetic item? > Second thought: …Well, hell, I’ve already bought a couple City of Heroes costume packs for $10 each. > Third thought: …And damn those are some cool pets. I kinda want to buy one. > > Fourth thought: [PUG! PUG PUG PUG!](http://www.wow.com/2009/11/05/patch-3-3-ptr-get-a-pug-when-you-pug/) Oh. Ouch. See, I’ll pay to get a pet, but repeatedly pugging…? Erk. I figure I’ve spent money on stupid stuff like magazines and things - since I cut out most of my random magazine spending, each pet is maybe 2 magazines. Plus I just got a hell of a lot of entertainment out of them, including by having Lil’ KT stand amongst a big group of penguins and seeing how long it took before he unleashed frozen doom on one. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6556 "2009-11-06T04:53:10Z")
> [@Ferret\_Herder](#): > > _squee_ If you’re willing to pay $10 a pop like me, you too can have your very own [Lil’ KT or Pandaren Monk](http://us.blizzard.com/store/browse.xml?f=c:5,c:33). Ha-ha! I just bought both 😃 Heh. “Lil’ Phylactery” 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6557 "2009-11-06T05:04:02Z")
> [@Ferret\_Herder](#): > > Plus I just got a hell of a lot of entertainment out of them, including by having Lil’ KT stand amongst a big group of penguins and seeing how long it took before he unleashed frozen doom on one. 😃 Oh, man. See, a boring pet isn’t worth $10, but that totally is. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6558 "2009-11-06T11:32:47Z")
Yeah, that’s very neat. Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on novelty factor and one’s tolerance for that), it does take a while. I think I stood around for a few minutes before he finally laid into one. Can’t wait to see what he does in Naxx with all the random critters in there. The Pandaren Monk is more mellow than that, but half of the price goes to the Make-A-Wish charity! You can even send either as a gift if you know the e-mail address of the person you want it to go to - and it doesn’t have to be their [battle.net](http://battle.net) address tied to their account. They log into that account on the web and plug in the code in the ‘redeem codes’ section. Imagine the fun of that person then logging in to their WoW account, mousing over the new mail icon, and seeing that one of the senders is Kel’Thuzad. :eek: (Really!) ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6559 "2009-11-06T11:50:39Z")
> [@Ferret\_Herder](#): > > Yeah, that’s very neat. Fortunately or unfortunately (depending on novelty factor and one’s tolerance for that), it does take a while. I think I stood around for a few minutes before he finally laid into one. Can’t wait to see what he does in Naxx with all the random critters in there. > > The Pandaren Monk is more mellow than that, but half of the price goes to the Make-A-Wish charity! > > You can even send either as a gift if you know the e-mail address of the person you want it to go to - and it doesn’t have to be their [battle.net](http://battle.net) address tied to their account. They log into that account on the web and plug in the code in the ‘redeem codes’ section. Imagine the fun of that person then logging in to their WoW account, mousing over the new mail icon, and seeing that one of the senders is Kel’Thuzad. :eek: (Really!) I got the pets, after reading this… I like the way he threatens you in his letter =) I admit, they are cute. Im going to log in and play with them now =) ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2009, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/6560 "2009-11-06T14:40:00Z")
I probably won’t pay real money for the pets, although they are cute. Seeing Lil’ KT freeze a nearby critter would be cool, but I already have a pet that does something [similar](http://www.wowhead.com/?item=34955). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=327) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=329)