# World of Warcraft General Discussion **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 4, 2009, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294 "2009-03-04T17:44:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 380
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7581 "2009-12-11T21:45:01Z")
[Browser is a piece of shit and I have no idea what I hit, but it posted while I was still writing. Ignore this.] ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7582 "2009-12-11T21:49:31Z")
> [@Ferret\_Herder](#): > > I’m reluctant to even try the random group feature as I hate Oculus with the fire of a thousand suns, yet I would feel like a real dick if I dropped group upon zoning into Oculus. I heard they seriously nerfed Oculus, though. ---
**Author:** ![ArrMatey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/arrmatey/32/3522_2.png) [@ArrMatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArrMatey)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7583 "2009-12-11T21:51:20Z")
> [@Mogle](#): > > Halls of Reflection is probably the hardest Wotlk 5-man so far. The first two bosses(just one long encounter) is kind of like the Brann event in HoS, only 10 times worse and currently top my ‘Most hated encounter list’. Essentially it’s 2x(4 waves mobs + 1 boss) with each wave consisting of 3-5 mobs that spawn all over the room and about half of them are ranged, have fun getting **that** under control, and to make things even more fun the mobs seem to be quite capable of 2-shotting anyone who isn’t a tank. Line-of-sight. Only way to do it. There are two ‘corner’ areas in the room that you can sucker them into chasing you into. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7584 "2009-12-11T21:52:16Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > I heard they seriously nerfed Oculus, though. Probably not by enough. The final battle basically depends on having players who either (1) already know the fight or (2) can learn it quickly, neither things I’d like to count on in a PuG. ---
**Author:** ![Mogle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mogle/32/12021_2.png) [@Mogle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mogle)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7585 "2009-12-11T21:58:22Z")
> [@ArrMatey](#): > > Line-of-sight. Only way to do it. There are two ‘corner’ areas in the room that you can sucker them into chasing you into. No, it’s not the _only_ way to do it, it just makes it easier 🙂 But it’s still one of the hardest 5 man encounters in the game, at least as a tank. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7586 "2009-12-11T22:00:33Z")
ETA this line: Holy crap, I apologize for the GIANT WALL OF TEXT crit on your eyes. I promise to never again get so busy at work that I can’t log onto the Dope for a couple of days in a row. 😛 I really like the new LFG. I really hate the new instances. They’re not hard-hard, they’re just shitty-mob-pack-composition-hard. Groups with multiple casters who won’t stack on the tank? Check. Groups with Hunters who you can’t even silence-pull? Check. For a Prot War, unless I have one or more DPS with me who know what the fuck they’re doing enough to help with pulls (silencing casters or DKs Death Gripping Hunters), this is one giant clusterfuck of me constantly using Charge and Intervene to keep aggro up on everything or tear it off someone else. When the trash is harder than the bosses… Ugh. Also: **ENOUGH FUCKING GAUNTLETS ALREADY**. I HATE gauntlets. Hate, hate, hate. In other news, I’ve decided to transfer a mule from BT to ET with some heirloom items for my Mage (Cold Weather Flying + shoulders), as well as some other stuff to max her profs faster (cloth, chant mats, etc.). Because I’m an awesome friend, I’m also carting items over for my friends who, like me, have their mains on BT now but alts still on ET. I’m soooooooo unbelievably excited to have Smarati flying in Northrend. > [@Bosstone](#): > > …Boo, addon updates! :mad: Agreed x 50 billion. I use a crap-ton of addons, and I don’t use any kind of updater tool. (Don’t trust 'em to work right.) That means manually downloading a few dozen zips, extracting them, deleting all the old folders, copying over the new ones… > [@tacoloco](#): > > On a positive note, I got a [Battered Hilt]. Woohoo! > [@martu](#): > > Grand Master Fisherman > Grand Master Cook > Skills to Pay the Bills > Grand Master in First Aid > Working Day and Night > Professional Grand Master Grats! > [@](#): > > Not only was it productive but damn it was expensive, dropped over 200g just doing this training. Oh honey. If you think 200g is expensive to powerlevel a prof, you ain’t seen nothin’ yet. 😃 > [@Jbone](#): > > Removing the DE option, regardless if there’s an enchanter or not, does not penalize the group - they can still vendor the item; hence no harm done in removing it. **YES IT DOES.** It removes a functionality that previously existed (the ability to have an Enchanter in the group pick up the items, DE them, then distribute the dusts, essences, and shards). Just because \*\*you \*\*do not want to use your profession to help others doesn’t mean that \*\*other \*\*Chanters feel the same way. \*\*Every Enchanter I have ever run with \*\*(ever, seriously) has always been more than happy to provide this service free of charge. > [@](#): > > The biggest problem I see now is setting loot rules to begin with. Same as before, really–the only difference is that now, if you screw up a roll, there’s no way to re-roll and trade the item. > [@](#): > > I’m kind of curious as to how the grouping mechanism works as well. Maybe it is gear score related? AFAIK, it’s pretty random, other than a “gating” system to prevent people from joining higher-level dungeons without the requisite gear. I don’t think I got anybody with insanely bad gear, but AFAIK none of them had gear as good as mine. > [@My\_Darn\_Snake\_Legs](#): > > Wait…we can now PUG instances with people from other realms? The new LFG interface matches people across your entire battlegroup (i.e., the people you’d be in BGs with). Note that there is no way to group with specific people from another realm; group members are randomly assigned. > [@Skammer](#): > > On the other hand – selling enchants themselves is going to become a lot more profitable since the mats will be cheaper. Exactly. Since the advent of vellum (I love you, Inscription), my best income on my Enchanters comes from the chants themselves, not the mats. > [@Jbone](#): > > Anyone know if my ring enchants will stay active if I drop enchanting? Any enhancement that requires a profession will stay on the item but become inactive (indicated by the text on the tooltip changing to red). > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > I’ve got to say, it’s refreshing as a melee DPS to finally get to fight a boss (the first guy in the Soul Forge) whose big-ass AoE attack doesn’t hit the melee DPS first and hardest. Yeah, that was kind of awesome. Take that, ranged–come stare at this boss’s butt for a while. 😃 > [@Jas09](#): > > You’ll notice he has many achievements from 10/23/08. I’m guessing that is when the achievement system went live and gave credit for all achievements that Blizz could reasonably conclude you completed (loot from a given boss, for example). That’s correct. > [@tacoloco](#): > > Beat the first boss in ICC 25 man last night. Grats! > [@Angel\_of\_the\_Lord](#): > > Okay, I just started playing–long story; I swore I’d never play, I’d waved off friends who tried to get me to play, and then one of my friends started playing while at home recovering from a busted leg. My desire to not be addicted warred with my desire to hang out with and distract my friend, and. . .yeah. Hahaha, funny how it sucks you in, isn’t it? I knew a lot of people who were playing from the first day it released, but I always avoided it for the same reason as you (I was in college and I knew I couldn’t spare the time). But then I got fired (from the job from hell, thank god) in the summer of 2007, and with not much else to do, my boyfriend suggested that I could kill some time by playing on his WoW account while he was at work, and… 😃 You know how it goes. > [@](#): > > Is it a difference in the builds, or is it because I leveled up with a party (the friend made a new character to go with my warlock, but wanted company pumping it up to 10, so there were two of us)? Or is it because of the patch? Little column A, little column B. Playing with a friend (especially a friend who knows how to find things) always makes it go faster, since while you get slightly less XP per kill, you kill things much faster, and you still get the same XP from quests you complete. There were also several changes made in 3.3 that make the first levels faster, from the mana cost reduction previously mentioned to a faster HP and Mana regen rate up to level 15 or so. > [@](#): > > Also, what the heck is up with the Draenei starting area? It’s really pretty, but the quests already feel like grinding, whereas the ones in the human starting area have been fun and challenging. Personally, I loved the Draenei starting area, but I’m a sucker for puns. YMMV. > [@Foma](#): > > (Long time lurker, first time poster) Welcome to our [del]altar of obsession[/del] [del]den of sin[/del] thread! > [@Jbone](#): > > My personal favorite zone is Duskwood. I still remember my first character that went through there. I had to go to Darkshire for some reason on Sleutel (I think it was the “get all these kinds of booze” quest) before she was really ready for the zone. On my way down the road, I saw an Herb node pop up on my minimap. I don’t remember what it was, besides something particularly useful at that point in leveling my Herb and Alch. “Oooh!” I said, and ran up the hill towards it… only to immediately get my face eaten off by a ghoul before I could even get in harvesting range. One corpse run later, I rez on the road, and think, “Okay, maybe he patted away.” I walk back up the hill and… Nope. He didn’t pat away. Face eaten again. I learned my lesson and stay on the damn road the rest of the way in like a good lowbie. > [@My\_Darn\_Snake\_Legs](#): > > I actaully didn’t like Duskwood because it was a really long run from the town to the graveyard where a lot of the quests took place. At the time, I hated it, but it’s since been overshadowed in my mind by STV. Duskwood was a long run east-west, but STV was soooo much worse north-south. I almost cried when they put the Rebel Camp FP in… \*after \*I was done questing there. > [@](#): > > It seems like they just designed it that way so that they could put that dragon in the center, but I don’t know if anyone I know bothered to go in after that dragon at all. If I remember correctly it required a really well geared raid to take it down, and it wasn’t really released until near the end of Vanilla WoW, so people just moved on to BC. The dragon (or possibly the adds around it?) are part of the AQ opening chain, IIRC. > [@Jbone](#): > > Forgot to mention I completed the [Battered Hilt](http://www.wowhead.com/?item=50380) quest line! Grats! > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > BTW, just for my peace of mind: is the hilt like some of the holiday items, in that it won’t be lootable by someone who’s already got one/done the quest? I would think so… although maybe not, for hybrids. :\ > [@winterhawk11](#): > > Wednesday night my guild went in and took down the four ICC25 bosses–lots of fun. Grats! > [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > The Alliance equivalent, I think, is Auberdine/Darkshore, the night elf “secondary” zone. I hate, hate, HATE that place. Every sane person does. Let us pause to share this moment of bonding. > [@](#): > > Anybody know offhand what a server transfer costs? Server transfer is $25. Faction transfer is $30. Both come with a free rename. The faction xfer lets you select any race of the opposite faction that supports your character’s class, and you can also change your gender and customize your features for your new race. > [@](#): > > The biggest problem I can forsee with a server transfer is the fact that all 10 of my toons on Lightbringer are in my “vanity guild”, so I’d want to move all of them, and I don’t know how they handle the guild bank in that kind of situation. Guild banks do not currently transfer. You have to move all of the contents in your characters’ bags and personal banks and repurchase any tabs on the new server. > [@](#): > > Cairne (which is in the same battlegroup as Lightbringer - so maybe it’s a battlegroup problem rather than a realm problem) isn’t much better lately, either, even when it’s showing only “Medium” population. Have you considered that the problem here might be… you? I play on some pretty high-population servers, and I never have this kind of issue. > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I thought we were talking about classic WOTLK heroics, you know, for the random daily. Personally, I was talking about the trend of Heroics going forward. > [@](#): > > As a healer, you have to make a decision after a while to just let people die. Yup. Unfortunately, the healer I was with that night had to learn the lesson the hard way. > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I thought we were talking about what is best for the game, not what is best for you in particular. Very well put. > [@Skammer](#): > > I know there are three (?) new 5-mans instances. And you have to do them in order to unlock them? They can be done regular or heroic, right? Are they on par with the H ToC 5-man or more difficult? Three new instances, which you have to do in order the first time in order to unlock numbers two and three. IMO, they’re harder than H-ToC5; the trash is a complete bitch, and several of the bosses have mechanics that requires your DPS to be slightly less retarded than a potato, which is apparently a challenge for some people. > [@winterhawk11](#): > > Since my actual weapon was better than this one, it would have been rather ninja-ish to Need on it. Not if you ask first. I’d have waited to roll, then said, “Hey everybody, I’d really like that piece for an RP set. Can I hit Need, then we’ll all do a manual /roll and I’ll give a shard to the high roller?” ---
**Author:** ![aktep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f0a364/32.png) [@aktep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aktep)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7587 "2009-12-11T22:03:33Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > I heard they seriously nerfed Oculus, though. Yes, but that doesn’t necessarily make it any better. Your drakes have more health, the enemies have much less, and the 3rd boss has been nerfed so much you can almost completely ignore the mechanics of the fight; but if your group doesn’t know what do do on their drakes for Eregos, you’ll get overwhelmed by whelps and die anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7588 "2009-12-11T22:08:55Z")
There is no such thing as [Alleria’s Silver Coin.](http://www.wowhead.com/?item=43686) On another note, I went to to do the Daily Heroic last night…I think it was “Deconstructing the Deconstructor” and I didn’t know which dungeon to pick for that one…I knew the quest was in Udular, but it wasn’t listed on the DF, either for normal or heroic. I is so confuzed. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7589 "2009-12-11T22:11:59Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > There is no such thing as [Alleria’s Silver Coin.](http://www.wowhead.com/?item=43686) > > On another note, I went to to do the Daily Heroic last night…I think it was “Deconstructing the Deconstructor” and I didn’t know which dungeon to pick for that one…I knew the quest was in Udular, but it wasn’t listed on the DF, either for normal or heroic. > > I is so confuzed. I think the daily heroics are no more; the 2 guys in the VH now give raid quests, so you’d need to be in an Ulduar raid to do that one. The bonus award you used to get for the daily heroic now comes from the 2 frosts you get for your first random heroic instance. ---
**Author:** ![aktep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f0a364/32.png) [@aktep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aktep)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7590 "2009-12-11T22:15:32Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Not if you ask first. I’d have waited to roll, then said, “Hey everybody, I’d really like that piece for an RP set. Can I hit Need, then we’ll all do a manual /roll and I’ll give a shard to the high roller?” If I understand the cross-realm instances, though, this won’t work, because you won’t be able to trade that shard to anyone not on your server. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7591 "2009-12-11T22:20:52Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > On another note, I went to to do the Daily Heroic last night…I think it was “Deconstructing the Deconstructor” and I didn’t know which dungeon to pick for that one…I knew the quest was in Udular, but it wasn’t listed on the DF, either for normal or heroic. There is no daily Heroic or daily regular dungeon anymore. You’re looking at the weekly \*\*raid \*\*quest. You need to go kill XT-002 in Ulduar (the raid, not HoS or HoL). ETA: > [@aktep](#): > > If I understand the cross-realm instances, though, this won’t work, because you won’t be able to trade that shard to anyone not on your server. True. You could agree to pass on the next X pieces of loot, though. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7592 "2009-12-11T22:24:27Z")
The nice thing about the daily raid quest, is that it should make it easier to get in to the raids because more people will be doing them (he said hopefully). But wait – how does that work with raid locks? If you’ve done Ulduar already this week and then the daily is Ulduar, are you out of luck? ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7593 "2009-12-11T22:27:33Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > But wait – how does that work with raid locks? If you’ve done Ulduar already this week and then the daily is Ulduar, are you out of luck? They’re weekly rather than daily, so I guess if you haven’t checked before you did your raiding, you’re out of luck. ---
**Author:** ![Calatin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/439d5e/32.png) [@Calatin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Calatin)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7594 "2009-12-11T22:36:43Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > They’re weekly rather than daily, so I guess if you haven’t checked before you did your raiding, you’re out of luck. Since the raid weekly applies to either 10 or 25 man, if you’ve only done one version of the instance, you can always complete the quest through the other. ---
**Author:** ![lizardling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f4b2a3/32.png) [@lizardling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lizardling)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7595 "2009-12-11T22:55:10Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > Oh speaking of dropping mid-instance… > > On Wednesday I was running HoL with a random PUG and halfway through (after defeating the next to last boss) one of our dps disconnected. We hung around for about five mintes waiting for him to show up. At that point, I Voted to Kick. The vote passed so he was kicked out. Then DF gave us the option to fill the spot and we got a new dps in about _three seconds_. Just awesome. > > My question is does DF let you know you’re joining a run already in progress and give you a chance to decline? Nope. I got sucked into a HoR run last night that was already to the twin boss zergfest. No heads up, just “queue for dungeon Y/N?” and bang there I was. I agree the trash is tough. We ended up slaughtering in order: priest, mage, riflemen, melee. DG’ing the contrary riflemen or mages as needed. Let’s just say that I really don’t like fire mages now. Crispy troll is not my favorite when it’s me being crisped, dammit. I like the new lfg though, I could actually get a dungeon run on my 46 priest at 1AM instead of falling asleep watching Trade. We wound up with two kitties going bear and co-tanking ZF which actually worked pretty well. Awesome thing though: Gahz threw us all up in the air, and I landed squarely on one of the eagle head lamp holders that stick out horizontally from the arched doorways. What are the odds? I spent the rest of the fight healing from my perch up there XD ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7596 "2009-12-11T23:30:51Z")
Welcome back, **Guns**. I was starting to wonder if you’d died or something. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Jbone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/58f4c7/32.png) [@Jbone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jbone)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7597 "2009-12-11T23:32:20Z")
God I hope this formats right.._click_ > [@Mekhazzio](#): > > My group 2-shotted each of the bosses in half our scheduled raid time, and then here we are, stuck with this locked door until January. We just called it and split up to check out the 5-mans. It’s cool and all, but we want to get started on the real meat already. We’re more than ready to leave the garbage that is TOC behind us. Congratz, I absolutely must read up on some strategies for the next time I find a pug. I wonder what’s the best strategy to get your group to ‘move-out-of-the-damn-fire’. > [@Mekhazzio](#): > > Blizzard’s completely overhauled the game in the goal of making everything accessible to anyone who wants to do it, and while I might go grumpy-old-man at that philosophy, they’ve certainly managed to achieve it. The only real obstacles to raiding these days are the social ones. I like the change (As a casual pug raider), but I feel for the progression players. I didn’t raid/run instances at all until WolTK. Hell I wasn’t really in a guild either, I just played solo, but I was **always** awestruck when I say someone in ‘uber’ raid gear back in BC/Vanilla. > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I tip ZERO for DE. I don’t know anyone in a guild that tips anything to get DE. For guild members/friends yes, have you ever had someone you don’t know, that you found on Trade channel DE items for you? Would you tip them 0 as well? Not everyone is in a guild, or have friends that play. Those people have to rely on complete strangers to help them if they need anything. > [@](#): > > I think it would even make more sense to allow DE even if there wasn’t anyone with enchanting in the group so that every group would get a DE option. What I think would also make sense is to give enchanters a recipe for a BOE wand that lets you DE stuff. I think Alchemists should be able to make BOE muddlers so everyone can mash their own herbs together and make potions/elixirs. And tailors can make BOE looms to give away so people can turn their own cloth into bolts of cloth. > [@](#): > > But if we are going to talk about what would be best for my toon in particular, I think that they should make borean leather convertible into arctic fur only if you are a leatherworker, right now anyone can convert borean leather into arctic fur. I also think that they should make titanium powder much cheaper so that JC don’t have to do the JC daily every day for a year to get all the recipes. Exactly, the profession abilities should be limited to people who spent the time to learn the profession. Miners can mine ore/smelt bars, enchanters can enchant items/disenchant items, leatherworkers can make leather equipment/combine leathers etc. I’m not sure where titanium powder comes from (sites blocked at work) but it sounds like something that should come from Prospecting titanium ore? > [@](#): > > I thought we were talking about what is best for the game, not what is best for you in particular. I think it would be good for the game if profession abilities were only available to people with those professions. Anyone who wanted something from an profession that they don’t have would have to find someone who has that profession. > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Yeah, I hear you. You’re saying that this is an enchantment nerf of some sort but its not, I have a mage JC enchanter and frankly I like the change because it saves me all that time at the end of a heroic trying to distribute the shards and stuff. > > I almost never have to supply my own mats for enchantments. I think cheaper mats is going to equal people upgrading their enchants more frequently which will probably get me more tips if I had the time to sit around enchanting for tips. Frankly I wish everyone in my guild could just go to the guild bank and just get any of my enchants from the guild bank, it would save me about half an hour after every raid. I agree that it does save a lot of time (I personally don’t mind the change). I also do not supply my own mats unless it’s a guildie and they might have to help on some of the higher-cost items, but there are enchanters that do try to make profit by selling scrolls or advertising on trade. As an enchanter you’re not gonna be making money at 10-20 gold tips here and there. You make money by putting the 4 infinite dust, 1 minor essence enchants on scrolls and selling them for 80g a pop (I sold 3 yesterday) > [@](#): > > Folks in the endgame don’t generally level tradeskills to make money (gathering skills is another matter). They level tradeskills to get the BOP recipes. BOP recipes for BOE items that they sell. There are a lot of great BOE tradeskill items, but endgamers may make an item for themselves until they find a better item from raiding. > [@](#): > > I have enchanting so that I can enchant my rings not so I can make 15 gold enchanting someone’s boots and certainly not so I can make a couple of gold disenchanting a bagful of green loot for someone. And as far as tradeskills go, enchanting is one of the cheaper tradeskills to level. Compared to Engineering, BS, JC, etc. enchanting is a breeze. Enchanting is a money-making skill. I wouldn’t recommend leveling it just for a +23 spellpower, or +30 stamina to each of your rings. That’s really not a going to be decision maker in the current content. > [@tacoloco](#): > > +23 spell power FTW. Again, at this phase +23 spell power is not gonna decide life and death. Maybe if they jacked that up to be more useful, it could have some better applications (+50sp, +50stam for the new patch would be sweet). At least update it to somewhat scale with the new gear that comes out. > [@Skammer](#): > > Are you saying on Heroic they’re not probably not harder than H ToC, or on regular? I didn’t notice too much of a difference. It still seems straight forward - if you stand in the fire you’re gonna die. Heroic means you’ll die a tick or two faster. Like with ToC if you make a dumb mistake, it’s gonna hurt regardless if it’s regular or heroic. > [@winterhawk11](#): > > Yeah, but I never need for “Ooh, pretty, I want it for RP.” I always just greed on it, and usually offer the group a shard in exchange if it’s something I really want. Since my actual weapon was better than this one, it would have been rather ninja-ish to Need on it. If I see something that drops and need it for either main or offspec, I will ask the group. I haven’t heard a complaint yet. I think setting some basic loot rules at the beginning can’t hurt because, with the random dungeon stuff, we are getting people from different servers that could do things differently. > [@Mogle](#): > > Halls of Reflection is probably the hardest Wotlk 5-man so far. The first two bosses(just one long encounter) is kind of like the Brann event in HoS, only 10 times worse and currently top my ‘Most hated encounter list’. Essentially it’s 2x(4 waves mobs + 1 boss) with each wave consisting of 3-5 mobs that spawn all over the room and about half of them are ranged, have fun getting **that** under control, and to make things even more fun the mobs seem to be quite capable of 2-shotting anyone who isn’t a tank. Someone will mention it before i finish this post, but have everyone stand in the cove and break line-of-sight. The ranged will come running in nice and close. > [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > They’re not hard-hard, they’re just shitty-mob-pack-composition-hard. Groups with multiple casters who won’t stack on the tank? Check. Groups with Hunters who you can’t even silence-pull? Check. For a Prot War, unless I have one or more DPS with me who know what the fuck they’re doing enough to help with pulls (silencing casters or DKs Death Gripping Hunters), this is one giant clusterfuck of me constantly using Charge and Intervene to keep aggro up on everything or tear it off someone else. Yeah i found the new trash packs really don’t like the positions you try to put them in. Very annoying. I’ve noticed a real lack in tanks on our battlegroup. I’ve only queued for random dungeons so far and each time it picks me as a tank, even though I’m tank/heals. I wonder if that’s just the mechanics of it, but oh well. > [@](#): > > **YES IT DOES.** It removes a functionality that previously existed (the ability to have an Enchanter in the group pick up the items, DE them, then distribute the dusts, essences, and shards). Just because \*\*you \*\*do not want to use your profession to help others doesn’t mean that \*\*other \*\*Chanters feel the same way. \*\*Every Enchanter I have ever run with \*\*(ever, seriously) has always been more than happy to provide this service free of charge. So what happens if a group doesn’t have an enchanter, they would never have the previously existing function? Are they hindered so much that they’d have to boot someone to find an enchanter just so they can do the dungeon? Are people specifically looking for enchanters when making group decisions. No, they’re not. Having an enchanter is a **bonus** , above and beyond the normal, to any group because they can DE into the dusts. They can still vendor the items for cash. Sure, it’s too bad they didn’t have an enchanter to DE stuff, but it doesn’t affect the completion of their run. Also, as a reminder, I never mind DEing items at the end of runs, and never charge for my services or expect tips from guildies or even strangers. I like helping others out whenever I can. I’m looking at this from an angle from someone who would have the view that “Blizzard is stealing money from me directly by making these changes”, etc. Original quote from me: > [@](#): > > A group without and enchanter could be considered the “minimum”. There would be no disenchanting option and they would have to need/greed for it and vendor the item if no one needed it. The group isn’t hindered by running without and enchanter. > Having an enchanter along is a bonus to that minimum group. Now they can DE the items and hopefully the mats will still be worth more than the item itself. Removing the DE option, regardless if there’s an enchanter or not, does not penalize the group - they can still vendor the item; hence no harm done in removing it. > [@](#): > > At the time, I hated it, but it’s since been overshadowed in my mind by STV. Duskwood was a long run east-west, but STV was soooo much worse north-south. I almost cried when they put the Rebel Camp FP in… \*after \*I was done questing there. This! I also think I read somewhere that they made another new FP or two with the new patch. ---
**Author:** ![Jbone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/58f4c7/32.png) [@Jbone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jbone)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7598 "2009-12-11T23:46:28Z")
> [@lizardling](#): > > Nope. I got sucked into a HoR run last night that was already to the twin boss zergfest. No heads up, just “queue for dungeon Y/N?” and bang there I was. I agree the trash is tough. We ended up slaughtering in order: priest, mage, riflemen, melee. DG’ing the contrary riflemen or mages as needed. Let’s just say that I really don’t like fire mages now. Crispy troll is not my favorite when it’s me being crisped, dammit. > > I like the new lfg though, I could actually get a dungeon run on my 46 priest at 1AM instead of falling asleep watching Trade. We wound up with two kitties going bear and co-tanking ZF which actually worked pretty well. Awesome thing though: Gahz threw us all up in the air, and I landed squarely on one of the eagle head lamp holders that stick out horizontally from the arched doorways. What are the odds? I spent the rest of the fight healing from my perch up there XD That’s how the dungeons starts…it jumps right into it. I have been invited to a dungeon already in progression. It prompted me and said it was a Pit of Saron run with 2/3 bosses complete. What I haven’t figured out is if it is possible to continue a run if your group dissolves or you want to pick it up later. I would assume it would be possible if the entire group was on the same server, but if they puged even 1 person it would probably prompt them to fill in the remaining spots if people left. I’ll have to test this if I ever find a group who are just as curious. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7599 "2009-12-11T23:54:30Z")
> [@Jbone](#): > > This! I also think I read somewhere that they made another new FP or two with the new patch. One at the Bulwark in Tirisfal (might be neutral…it’s Argent Dawn) and one just before(?) the bridge in Western Plaguelands (definitely neutral, goblin flightmaster). So sayeth the WoW LJ community, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Mogle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mogle/32/12021_2.png) [@Mogle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mogle)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2009, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/7600 "2009-12-11T23:54:33Z")
> [@Jbone](#): > > Someone will mention it before i finish this post, but have everyone stand in the cove and break line-of-sight. The ranged will come running in nice and close. Yes, I know that, LoSing mobs is part of Tanking 101 after all, but the first time I ran HoR I went in blind and did it the hard way(without wiping!). I was just commenting on the difficulty of the new instances. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=379) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=381)