# World of Warcraft General Discussion **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 4, 2009, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294 "2009-03-04T17:44:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 94
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1861 "2009-06-11T18:54:46Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Arcane Torrent got changed, too. It’s now a single ability that simultaneously does an AOE silence and restores Mana/Energy/Runic Power (not Rage, though, according to [the WoWWiki page](http://www.wowwiki.com/Arcane_Torrent), which is WTF lame if it’s accurate). And Stoneform [clears all poisons/diseases/bleed effects](http://www.wowwiki.com/Stoneform) when used now (instead of granting immunity), so that’s still really useful, too. I REALLY need to start reading patch notes… ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1862 "2009-06-11T19:01:16Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > **Mining** : What, exactly, makes Silver Ore so much more valuable than Gold Ore? Right now I’ve got a stack of 18 Silver Ores, with Auctioneer showing a market price of 85g 32s, and a stack of 15 Gold Ores showing a market price of only 40g 69s 20c. Its for people powerlevelling their mining. There is a 10-20 point range in there where smelting silver is about the only way to level your mining without spending some serious time running around looking for silver nodes, I don’t think gold fills a similar gap. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1863 "2009-06-11T19:26:50Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Arcane Torrent got changed, too. It’s now a single ability that simultaneously does an AOE silence and restores Mana/Energy/Runic Power (not Rage, though, according to [the WoWWiki page](http://www.wowwiki.com/Arcane_Torrent), which is WTF lame if it’s accurate). That would be because Blood Elves don’t have Warriors. The only non-mana-using class BElves have is the Rogue (and DK, I suppose). The closest you can get to a Warrior is Paladin. ---
**Author:** ![Redwing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/dfb087/32.png) [@Redwing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Redwing)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1864 "2009-06-11T19:58:24Z")
> [@ashman165](#): > > They really don’t need another DoT so much as most locks simply need to learn to use the ones they do have. An affliction lock, while capable of putting out substantial dps, is also a utility class, which means that s/he debuffs a target in the best way possible to min/max the raid’s dps overall. Individual, while not unimportant, isn’t the do-all end-all of raiding. > > For instance, I raid as a fire mage not because the individual dps is the best (fire has never been capable of more damage than arcane, ever). Fire only merges ahead in extremely long fights because arcane is a very, very mana intensive, which is to say that arcane will always have higher DPS, but lower DPM, equal gearing of course. I raid fire because of two major reasons: 1.) I enjoy being fire more than any other spec, and 2.) the improved scorch debuff allows my raid to min/max. > > Back to affliction locks. Locks have an entire host of curses (though not as many individual ones as times past) which can be used according to the raid makeup. While it’s true that CoA can account for a significant portion of your DPS, it generally pales in comparison to using CoE, excepting the situation in which there’s a boomkin in the group, of course. Also, _good_ affliction locks\* will always beat out _good_ destruction locks in highly mobile fights merely because a substantial part of their dps isn’t contingent upon direct damage spells. Also, if you’re going deep affliction, you might as well max out nightfall and glyph to get the 8%(?) chance for a free shadow bolt proc per tick of corruption. > > \*This requires very good management of cooldown timers. Very, very good. > > Where destruction has the edge is in that their shadow bolts and incinerate will hit hard because their spec is balanced around direct damage spells. > > An affliction lock whose bulk of dps comes from his shadow bolt has probably got some questionable itemization going on, which is to say that he’s likely got too high a crit chance and too low a spell power rating. With destruction locks, like with magi, there are two ways to gear: spell power, or crit. Some prefer to be a crit lock, or mage, while some prefer to crit less often, but a lot harder. How you gear depends on what drops, and your playstyle. But as an affliction lock, you’re going to want to get up around three thousand spell power, while a crit lock can get by with far less spell power, but will require _at the very least_ a 30% crit rate. 45-50% crit rating would be ideal. Ummm… no. CoE is rarely used, because someone else already puts it up for free (Earth and Moon or Ebon Plaguebringer). ISB takes the place of scorch for the same reason. Curses used during raid are CoD if destro, CoA if demo (for molten core procs) CoA if aff (higher dpxt (damage per execute time) than CoD when talented. CoE by one lock if there’s no boomkin or DK (why are you in 25man progression without a boomkin (crit, haste, spell damage taken, all in a giant chicken)?). I expect that every lock always refreshes their DoTs on completion of the GCD or cast that the DoT expired during, that seems to be a rather minimal expectation to me, like not letting corruption or shadow embrace or ISB fall off. Gear wise aff and destro stack haste over crit, and of the spell stats (hit, haste, crit, and power) all locks value power the least (well, until hit capped, but you knew that). DoT’s crit, and haste reduces all your casting times, it just scales better for an aff lock, because he’s spending so much time casting a 3second cast time nuke. If he’s not casting that nuke , in GCD from a CoA, or refreshing UA or haunt, what the heck’s he doing? Demo stacks crit and spell power because that’s what he uses for his raid buffing, though that raid buff is pointless before 2800 spell power, and not fully reliable, depending on pet criticals. I will grant that you’re right that locks don’t need another DoT. As much as I liked SL, rolling it into corruption with the talent’s fine. Technically it’s a dps increase, because aff locks get one GCD per 30seconds back. For anyone who’s trying to improve their raiding game, one of the first rules (for dps) is always be casting or in a GCD. If you’re resource constrained (casters on Vezax) there’s still someething you could be doing (wanding). It may not be much, but every little bit counts; on things like Yogg phase 2, people burning a GCD on corruptor tentacles as they run to the next crusher can whittle down enough corruptors that the upstairs group can finish them off when the downstairs group enters the brain room. To me, the frustration is that my alt brings the single best buff in the game (BoK), which is unique to that class. My main’s best debuffs were move else where (CoE). It’s all QQ anyway. What matters is dropping bosses and getting loot. Which reminds me, anyone done Thorim hard mode, and got any advise? I don’t think I’ve seen anything kick our asses quite so hard as he did. Heck, even failing at three tree Freya we did better than we did with Thorim with Sif playing along. **Shot from Guns** why would a blood-elf need rage? They can’t be warriors or druids. The change to Arcane Torrent were a buff to the ability, 6% mana every two minutes is nothing to scoff at, and the AoE silence may be OP (it’s very gross in healer v healer fights). ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1865 "2009-06-11T20:08:45Z")
Thanks \*\*Bosstone \*\*and **Redwing** –I never noticed that Blood Elves can’t be Warriors. I thought that was the one class everybody had, but apparently not. And sorry for not being clear if you thought I was saying the AT change was bad–it was a huge buff to the ability and made my 19 twink Belf Mage very happy. _cue The More You Know logo and theme_ ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1866 "2009-06-11T20:45:59Z")
> [@JayRx1981](#): > > Yeah, sorry if I was unclear about that. > > I’m not going to buy gold with real life dollars. One because it’s a TOS violation and I rather like having a non-banned account. Two because there’s no guarantee that if I fork over real money for fake money that I’ll get said fake money since it’s not, strictly speaking, legitimate business. And Three because I’m not gonna aid or abet the sweatshops that most of those gold-farming operations are. > > But still, I’m not looking forward to getting that remaining 4000G. _shudder_ I’m not promoting buying gold but If I was a kid that could make $20/hour mowing lawns and turn that into more gold than I can grind in 5 hours, then I might be tempted. With that said, you should be able to get that amount of gold from normal levels of activity by the time you are 77 if you don’t waste your money. I haven’t bought anything at the auction house since I got to Outland (well I bought some stuff to level up my tradeskills but nothing that I really needed) because I get almost all my gear from quests. The only thing I want that I cannot afford through regular levels of AH activity (about half an hour a day) is that neat elephant that carries three players and vendors. That is something I think is very useful. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1867 "2009-06-11T20:49:10Z")
It took me a while after I hit level 80 to afford fast flying, but then (1) I was a DK, so started making money late (2) I was levelling enchanting, and buying all those greens off the AH (and never selling any greens or blues) adds up. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1868 "2009-06-11T20:52:53Z")
I just lent a friend the 3300g or so she still needed to get her epic flying skill and mount (she just hit 77). Seriously, I think you have to \*try \*to not make mad cash at 80, between dailies and the saleable things you pick up farming (whether its for mats, mounts, rep, whatever). ---
**Author:** ![twilly80](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@twilly80](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twilly80)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1869 "2009-06-11T21:03:41Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > I just lent a friend the 3300g or so she still needed to get her epic flying skill and mount (she just hit 77). Seriously, I think you have to \*try \*to not make mad cash at 80, between dailies and the saleable things you pick up farming (whether its for mats, mounts, rep, whatever). Well, aren’t you special? Care to loan me about 1000g so I can buy my epic flying? ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1870 "2009-06-11T21:09:47Z")
Are you playing an Alliance toon on Borean Tundra? If so, the answer is “maybe.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![twilly80](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@twilly80](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twilly80)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1871 "2009-06-11T21:14:10Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Are you playing an Alliance toon on Borean Tundra? If so, the answer is “maybe.” 😃 No, but I do have a horde there. 8( ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1872 "2009-06-11T21:17:08Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > I just lent a friend the 3300g or so she still needed to get her epic flying skill and mount (she just hit 77). Seriously, I think you have to \*try \*to not make mad cash at 80, between dailies and the saleable things you pick up farming (whether its for mats, mounts, rep, whatever). Quite true. Just knocking off extra Northrend quests that you skipped while levelling nets mad cash. According to my money-tracking add-on I’ve taken in over 4k this week (although I’ve spent a bunch too of course…). Just questing (well, actually 1k of it was selling a Darkmoon deck - you can make some easy cash by buying the cheap cards when the fair is not around and selling the completed deck during the fair). If you’re at 80 and struggling for cash I highly recommend hitting up the low-level NR zones you skipped (for me it was Zul’Drak and Howling Fjord). Since you’re not getting XP you get 13g or more per quest, plus selling quest rewards and drops. And the quests go really fast since you out-level them. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1873 "2009-06-11T21:30:59Z")
Don’t forget the Argent Tournament dailies, too. At the Champion level, each one nets you over 20g, assuming you go for the extra cash instead of the rep. ---
**Author:** ![twilly80](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@twilly80](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twilly80)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1874 "2009-06-11T21:38:39Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Don’t forget the Argent Tournament dailies, too. At the Champion level, each one nets you over 20g, assuming you go for the extra cash instead of the rep. But your rich. I was asking for a loan. ---
**Author:** ![Darwins\_Finch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darwins_finch/32/20304_2.png) [@Darwins\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darwins_Finch)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1875 "2009-06-11T21:39:47Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Don’t forget the Argent Tournament dailies, too. At the Champion level, each one nets you over 20g, assuming you go for the extra cash instead of the rep. Of course, there are only 4 such Champion-level quests currently available, so it’s not exactly a major source of income… Even so, doing a full set of dailies should net you well over 1 kilo-gold / week (probably closer to 2K). I’ve paid for 4x fliers, 3x fast fliers, 2x Cold-Weather Flying, and 2x dual specs, above and beyond the miscellaneous crap I’ve bought over time, primarily from doing dailies over the past so many months. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1876 "2009-06-11T21:41:06Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Don’t forget the Argent Tournament dailies, too. At the Champion level, each one nets you over 20g, assuming you go for the extra cash instead of the rep. Absolutely - I do them every day 😃 Maybe an hour for 7 quests (till you run out of factions to be a valiant for) and an easy ~200g, IIRC. [QUOTE=twilly80] But your rich. I was asking for a loan. [/QUOTE] Ah! But we’re telling you how to **become** rich! Surely that is much more valuable. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![twilly80](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@twilly80](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twilly80)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1877 "2009-06-11T21:53:43Z")
I just need some help. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1878 "2009-06-11T21:59:03Z")
> [@twilly80](#): > > But your rich. Nah, I’m probably down to no more than 1500g (probably closer to 1k) on my BT Alliance toons since I lent Corey the bulk of what I had. > [@](#): > > I was asking for a loan. Yes, but we’ve already established that your toon isn’t anywhere that it could accept it. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Demo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demo/32/8472_2.png) [@Demo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Demo)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1879 "2009-06-11T22:00:12Z")
Here’s some help: Blizzard has conveniently left a bunch of money for you, spread out very thinly on a bunch of mobs. All you have to do is go out, kill them, and collect the loot. Easy peasy! ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2009, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294/1880 "2009-06-11T22:06:29Z")
> [@Demo](#): > > Here’s some help: Blizzard has conveniently left a bunch of money for you, spread out very thinly on a bunch of mobs. All you have to do is go out, kill them, and collect the loot. Easy peasy! Heh, that’s almost word-for-word what I told a player in-game that kept asking me for 10g. I even offered to help kill the mobs. For some reason the player wasn’t interested in that… And yes, this player was lvl80. How many mobs do you have to kill in Northrend to pick up 10g? 20 or 30 at the most, right? The goblins are right, as always: “Time is money, friend.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=93) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/world-of-warcraft-general-discussion/488294.md?page=95)