# Worldviews that are hard to fathom **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 28, 2013, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375 "2013-08-28T05:24:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/121 "2013-09-03T03:08:12Z")
> [@mandala](#): > > That’s a worldview I cannot fathom - dissing something you know jack about. > > Astrology is not stupid, though many charlatans and assholes writing entertainment columns for newspapers certainly do make it appear ridiculous. > > It is a common misperception that astrology exclusively relies on the positions of the planets to make predictions about your life. That’s just one branch of astrology - there are many others that do not crunch the numbers to make predictions, or need to. > > In Southern India, there is a derivation of astrology called ‘Nadi Shastra’ that is stunningly accurate, if you can find the right pandita (expert). I once randomly walked into one of the Nadi shops (yes they run shops selling that kind of profound stuff for cheap; everyone’s got to eat). Gave them my DOB and right-thumb print. They returned a few minutes later with a bunch of ancient papyrus plates, and laid bare my entire life - my name, age, education, my parents’ name, my grandparents’ name, and significant events that happened in my life. > > Apparently they CAN predict how and when you will die, but ethics of the practice prohibit them from doing so. > > My head was spinning when I came out. Mind you these guys did not know me and I did not know them. There is no scientific explanation I can think of. > > But I do hereby declare that Linda Goodman style astronumerology is a shipload of crap. In fact, all Western-style astronomerology is bullshit. Apparently Westerners can only handle hard science. I am stunned by the ability of these astrologers to predict the past. And they can predict the future as well, you say? But their ethics prohibit them from making predictions that can be tested, huh? Darn, that’s inconvenient. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/122 "2013-09-03T04:26:38Z")
There are about 250 people in my department. I’m sure there’s all kinds of woo belief going on I don’t know about. But I’ve come across a few. Last week I was talking to a guy and halloween came up. I mentioned that I was at Garden Ridge the day before and they already had christmas stuff out. He went off. “Well, at least we still _have_ christmas but not for long, they are going to take it away from us!” I won’t be mentioning the c word around him again. We have a couple of government conspiracy theorists. I got involved in a conversation with them a few years back and laughed it off, thinking they were kidding around. Then I realized they weren’t. I avoid talking to them now. And there was a woman who has since left who, no matter what the conversation, had to work in that Obama is a muslim terrorist. I just laughed at her because what else are you going to do? It’s always a little sad to find out these things about people but, on the other hand, good to know who to stay away from. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/123 "2013-09-03T04:33:44Z")
The worldview I don’t get is the class of worldviews, many of which are conflicting, that start with “everybody…” Stop. Now. Unless the next words out of your mouth are “breathes” or “needs to eat” or something like that just stop. These are the people who have to torture absolutely any story or person into their worldview. “Everybody likes gifts”, “my girlfriend doesn’t”, “well she does, but she doesn’t think of it like a gift. It’s the gift of control over her life and what objects she receives that you’re giving her.” Uh… sure, why not? It’s one of those “not even wrong” type deals. They just bludgeon everybody else’s preferences and worldviews into some meaningless easy-to-understand paradigm. You can’t really argue on any grounds other than “you’re really torturing your terminology there”. Some of them are better (and worse at the same time) and rather than assuming you’re honest and torturing their definitions to accommodate you, just assume whoever doesn’t fit is lying or mistaken. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/124 "2013-09-03T05:15:43Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Sometimes I swear they are just jerking around. I once knew a man who insisted that 5-6 pm was the hottest time of the day, not 1-3 pm, no matter what… depending on where you live that’s true. The Earth’s center line is not parallel to the Sun so the amount of light at a given time of day is different within a time zone. It can be dark in New York City but still daylight in Orlando FL. Not sure I explained that well but you can go to Google Earth and click on the Sun and move the slide bar back and forth to see the angle of light as sunset approaches. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/125 "2013-09-03T06:02:24Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > My mother used to claim that you got rest only from sleep before midnight. I am not sure she actually believed that; possibly she was trying to get me to go to bed earlier. My mother claimed this as well. The pediatrician told her that, back in the 1960s. ---
**Author:** ![Blackberry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@Blackberry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackberry)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/126 "2013-09-03T06:13:43Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > My mother claimed this as well. The pediatrician told her that, back in the 1960s. My mom’s 50% more reasonable about it, she says sleep after midnight only counts for half (or sleep before midnight counts double, I’m not sure). ---
**Author:** ![Peanuthead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peanuthead/32/360_2.png) [@Peanuthead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peanuthead)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/127 "2013-09-03T09:43:08Z")
I once had a coworker who thought that Zionists were behind everything from the Oklahoma City bombing, to Ruby Ridge, to Waco, to the WTC attack. Of course they had help from the government because, you know, Jews run the government. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/128 "2013-09-03T10:06:01Z")
Jews do run the government… of Israel. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 10:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/129 "2013-09-03T10:30:28Z")
> [@phreesh](#): > > I read the Globe and Mail newspaper online every day. It’s pretty much the New York Times of Canada. Anyway, every day they have a list of the top ten articles read in the last 24 hours. EVERY SINGLE DAY, the horoscopes are in the top ten. It makes me crazy. Reading the horrorscopes doesn’t mean you believe in them, though. My mother likes running comparisons and looking for absurdities. Magazines with a predominantly-female target audience are particularly juicy: “ **Nava** , dear, why didn’t you notify me when you gave birth? Apparently your child will have moderate health problems!.. and by the way, your brother is going to have some terrible arguments with his husband; well, at least they’re saying that about the married one and not about the unmarried one… do you think we should notify his wife?” ---
**Author:** ![KarlGrenze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dbc845/32.png) [@KarlGrenze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGrenze)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 10:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/130 "2013-09-03T10:36:04Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Reading the horrorscopes doesn’t mean you believe in them, though. My mother likes running comparisons and looking for absurdities. Exactly. Not to mention many just give common advice and different ways of saying “don’t be a jerk”. Extremly nebulous to plan anything around those. Yet funny to read. “Hey mom, it says you’re going to find your true love today! So I guess dad is not it?” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/131 "2013-09-03T10:41:48Z")
Aanamika, the heat we feel walking around the Earth is caused by two things: the electromagnetic energy from the sun directly (and reflected off surfaces) (which does peak at local solar “noon”), AND the energy re-radiated from clouds and from the ground after it has been absorbed. The latter kind of energy is shifted toward the infrared part of the spectrum, and it peaks rather later – both later in the day (by several hours), and later in the year (by several weeks), simply because it takes time for the earth’s surface (especially) to absorb and re-radiate. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/132 "2013-09-03T11:40:58Z")
> [@Spoke](#): > > You have one of those, too? Mine is a college professor. Mine is an “artist,” which, I guess is more stereotypically consistent. > [@mandala](#): > > I did think about my experience - I just gave them my DOB (millions must have been born on that date) and my thumb print. That might have enabled them hack into the DHS’ fingerprint database and let them pull in details - such as my grandparents’ names. And my parent’s vocations. From a small Indian town that did not have a single internet connection at that time. Sure, why not. Or maybe I sound like someone who has seen how some of the tricks work, including cold reading (such as repeating to you things that you have told them in the process of being interviewed) or hot reading (investigating you and reporting back to you). Astrological con artists are a known phenomenon. They come in all kinds of guises. One thing they have is common is that none of them are relying on either a science or a supernatural power of astrology. I also know a couple of people who have studied Indian astrology. They have told me it’s the same old bullshit involved in Western astrology, just in a more complicated guise. I don’t have to believe in conspiracies. I can point out that exactly zero astrologers—Indian or otherwise—have been able to prove that their astrology has either a supernatural or a scientific basis when scrutinized by actual scientists. On the other hand, there are individuals like you who have fallen for the con insisting that, no, your experience was genuine. Which one of us has a larger leap of faith? Go back and find your Indian astrologer and set him in front of James Randi and see what happens. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/133 "2013-09-03T12:06:04Z")
> [@mandala](#): > > From a small Indian town that did not have a single internet connection at that time. Sure, why not. Indian astrology has become a global business. I have a friend whose astrologer in India works at night when his American clients are awake. He takes credit cards. Maybe it wasn’t just the astrology that fooled you. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/134 "2013-09-03T17:02:23Z")
I like how everybody hastens to tell me that indeed, sometimes, it is hotter in the evening. I wasn’t disputing that, you pedantic friends of mine. No, what bothered me about this fellow was that he claimed that it was ALL the time, no matter what, in every place you go to, it was ALWAYS hotter in the evenings from 5-6 pm. No matter what time of year it was. In Upstate NY, where we live, it’s just not true. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/135 "2013-09-03T17:07:06Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > I like how everybody hastens to tell me that indeed, sometimes, it is hotter in the evening. I wasn’t disputing that, you pedantic friends of mine. No, what bothered me about this fellow was that he claimed that it was ALL the time, no matter what, in every place you go to, it was ALWAYS hotter in the evenings from 5-6 pm. No matter what time of year it was. > > In Upstate NY, where we live, it’s just not true. We had a thread on that topic recently. I was surprised because I had never heard it before and know that it isn’t true for the places that I have lived. I looked up some locations people were giving as examples (West Coast) and was surprised that it really was hotter many times from 5 - 6 pm than at midday there. You are right though, it certainly isn’t true everywhere and I didn’t know that many people assumed it was a universal rule. ---
**Author:** ![GoodOmens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d26b3c/32.png) [@GoodOmens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GoodOmens)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/136 "2013-09-03T17:08:56Z")
> [@Blackberry](#): > > My mom’s 50% more reasonable about it, she says sleep after midnight only counts for half (or sleep before midnight counts double, I’m not sure). So, if you are asleep when you cross into a new time-zone, is there some sort of weighted average or pro-rating that occurs? ---
**Author:** ![DataX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@DataX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DataX)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/137 "2013-09-03T18:30:19Z")
> [@Blackberry](#): > > My mom’s 50% more reasonable about it, she says sleep after midnight only counts for half (or sleep before midnight counts double, I’m not sure). There is actually some truth to this - depending on how you look at it - if you are on a normal sleep schedule - and go to bed at say 10:00 - most of the “deep sleep” - will occur before midnight. This is probably what someone read somewhere - and changed it to a version quoted by apparently at least two moms. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/138 "2013-09-03T18:35:07Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Indian astrology has become a global business. I have a friend whose astrologer in India works at night when his American clients are awake. He takes credit cards. Maybe it wasn’t just the astrology that fooled you. I want my kundli read. I really do. I don’t believe in it but I would be very curious to know if in anyway they could predict my future, with a completely cold reading, nothing more than when I was born, what date, etc. Whatever they need to start with. Because a lot of stuff that happened to me was really freakin random. I should get it done next time I go back (hahaha whenever that is.) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2013, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/139 "2013-09-04T14:30:51Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > This will probably be a hot button one because there are some examples among the regulars of this board. But I can’t fathom the people who have an overwhelming hate for America - especially when it appears most of them are American. > > I’d be the first person to agree that America is far from perfect. We’ve done a lot of bad things and are still doing some of them. But there are some people who apparently feel that every bad thing that’s ever been done in human history originated here in America. > > Slavery? Not only did we practice it, we invented it. Killing the Indians? We’re the only country in history that ever killed an enemy and took their land. Nisei internment? The worst atrocity of World War II. The Holocaust? Germans killing people but we were to blame. Saddam Hussein? Our fault somehow. George Bush? Worse than Hitler or Stalin. > > Seriously, people, learn some history and get a sense of perspective. Anyone wanting an example of this worldview will find plenty of it in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=701327). ---
**Author:** ![babygoat666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/2acd7d/32.png) [@babygoat666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/babygoat666)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2013, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375/140 "2013-09-04T14:57:08Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Anyone wanting an example of this worldview will find plenty of it in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=701327). Could you point your finger more directly? Besides post #4, I think you’re just conflating any criticism of U.S. foreign policy to some utterly ridiculous hyperbole. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worldviews-that-are-hard-to-fathom/667375.md?page=8)