# Worst retcons **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 5, 2017, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410 "2017-01-05T19:32:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2017, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/41 "2017-01-07T15:59:52Z")
> [@Sterling\_Archer](#): > > This explanation never made much sense to me. It would be like Han was saying “I ran a marathon in only 20 miles!” Han was just being arrogant and said something kinda stupid because he thought they’d never realize. And of course, had Obi-Wan actually been what he seemed, it might have succeeded in going over their heads. Of course, Luke actually had traveled around the Tattooine so he likely wouldn’t have been fooled either, but the screenplay doesn’t suggest he noticed (or cared) about whatever nonsense Han was selling. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2017, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/42 "2017-01-07T16:26:48Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > Han was just being arrogant and said something kinda stupid because he thought they’d never realize. IMHO you are giving George Lucas much more credit for subtly of writing than he has ever demonstrated to deserve. I believe that Lucas was trying to show Han Solo as trying to BS Luke and Ben _and_ Lucas didn’t know what the word “parsec” meant. ---
**Author:** ![desertmonk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@desertmonk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/desertmonk)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2017, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/43 "2017-01-07T17:25:14Z")
> [@Sterling\_Archer](#): > > This explanation never made much sense to me. It would be like Han was saying “I ran a marathon in only 20 miles!” Doesn’t Obi-Wan roll his eyes as Han is saying this though? ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/44 "2017-01-07T18:06:01Z")
Maybe Solo, crazy guy that he was, went _through_ an asteroid field that everybody else steered around so he was able to do the trip in fewer parsecs. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2017, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/45 "2017-01-07T18:27:42Z")
Sir, the probability of successfully navigating an asteroid field is approximately… ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2017, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/46 "2017-01-07T19:13:12Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > IMHO you are giving George Lucas much more credit for subtly of writing than he has ever demonstrated to deserve. I believe that Lucas was trying to show Han Solo as trying to BS Luke and Ben _and_ Lucas didn’t know what the word “parsec” meant. To be fair, I doubt Lucas know that 40 years in then future, avid fans would be scrutinizing every throwaway line like it were holy writ. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/47 "2017-01-10T15:32:38Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > The whole trilogy hangs on this. The whole _saga_ hangs on this. When people ask why someone who maybe shouldn’t have gotten Jedi training got it – over the objections of folks who frown on that, and who kept saying they didn’t really trust him, and who were right – we need to know why Qui-Gon thought the kid had so much potential. Imagine if they had an organization of people who spend their lives training to use a mystical force, hey call it The Force, both to fight and to perceive things. They can get premonitions of events, see into the hearts of people near them, and sense other force users. Now imagine that someone who was well trained by that organization could use the force to see the force potential in another person, turned that sense onto the kid, and was amazed by what he saw. I guess you’d have to retcon… oh wait, that organization is the Jedi, and the Jedi and the Force have been a major part of Star Wars since the beginning. I really don’t see how retconning a weird tech explanation that there’s some blood-borne organisms regulating force sensitivity helps the series, it turns away from the mysticism of the Jedi, raises lots of questions about how it works, and just breaks the theme that’s been established. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/48 "2017-01-10T15:50:29Z")
> [@desertmonk](#): > > Doesn’t Obi-Wan roll his eyes as Han is saying this though? Because Alec Guinness realized the whole thing was stupid as shit and couldn’t restrain his reaction. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/49 "2017-01-10T16:03:25Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Especially since DS9 explained it perfectly: “We do not discuss it with outsiders.” Agreed. DS9 writers winked at the audience and privately shared a ‘joke’ about production-related issues. For a moment we were all insiders. It’s really the only graceful way to deal with it. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/50 "2017-01-10T16:15:14Z")
> [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > And of course, had Obi-Wan actually been what he seemed, it might have succeeded in going over their heads. What I hate about the prequels is that it reveals that instead of Obi-Wan dressing in desert robes convenient to his hot and dusty environment on Tatooine, he’s instead dressed in what appears to have been **the fracking uniform of the Jedi Knights** for twenty years! Before they were hunted down and killed by the despotic omnipresent Empire, that was how all Jedi Knights dressed. Seriously? Did they think we would lose track of who these characters were just because they dressed differently? And that Obi-Wan was so stupid he couldn’t go to Mos Eisley’s version of The Gap to hide himself a little better? ---
**Author:** ![oft\_wears\_hats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@oft\_wears\_hats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oft_wears_hats)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/51 "2017-01-10T16:31:05Z")
Flint Marko accidentally killing Uncle Ben in _Spider Man 3_ was a pretty stupid retcon. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/52 "2017-01-10T16:32:47Z")
> [@wevets](#): > > And that Obi-Wan was so stupid he couldn’t go to Mos Eisley’s version of The Gap to hide himself a little better? As far out in the boonies as Tattooine is, I’d expect the only shirts available were the equivalent of “Carolina Panthers Superbowl 50 Champs!” 🙂 > [@smiling\_bandit](#): > > What’s weird about this is that everyone writing about it completely failed to get that Lucas explicitly wrote that Han was trying to pass one over on the local yokels, and Obi-Wan flat out knew what he was going. (Luke wasn’t impressed for other reasons.) Way back in 1977, Starlog magazine devoted a ton of column inches to this very question. I think even David Gerrold weighed in in a column with some fan-wanky “explanation”. And even then, I thought they missed the point. (With no sequels to use for additional information) Solo’s comment means one of two things: he’s trying to test the yokels to see how much he can put over on them, or he isn’t actually the brains of the duo, and that Chewie does all the hard thinking, and Solo is just the front man. I vote for the first. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/53 "2017-01-10T17:13:10Z")
Some of these examples are not really retcons, in that they don’t really change anything that was previous established. Han shot first, that change is a retcon. And a terrible one, at that. But the introduction of midichlorians, much as I hate it, didn’t really change anything we already knew for a fact about the Force. The origin of the Xenomorph also isn’t really a retcon, as far as I can tell. Professor X pretty clearly exploded to pieces in X-Men: The Last Stand. And sure, his consciousness could be transferred to a new body. But in future movies, even set in the future, there he is, in his old Patrick Stewart body. Wheelchair and all. As far as I know, there’s no explanation for how they put him back together. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/54 "2017-01-10T17:34:43Z")
The new season of _Bones_ has started off …, well, it’s _Bones_, what do you expect at this point. (At least this will be the last season.) They are retconning some stuff concerning Zack. Doesn’t really play well. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/55 "2017-01-10T17:47:54Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > Some of these examples are not really retcons, in that they don’t really change anything that was previous established. Han shot first, that change is a retcon. And a terrible one, at that. But the introduction of midichlorians, much as I hate it, didn’t really change anything we already knew for a fact about the Force. The origin of the Xenomorph also isn’t really a retcon, as far as I can tell. > > Professor X pretty clearly exploded to pieces in X-Men: The Last Stand. And sure, his consciousness could be transferred to a new body. But in future movies, even set in the future, there he is, in his old Patrick Stewart body. Wheelchair and all. As far as I know, there’s no explanation for how they put him back together. What scenes show Professor Xavier from after the end of _Last Stand_ and before the alteration of the timeline in _Days of Future Past_? Clearly, after the events of the second prequel, the timeline has altered enough that Jean Grey and Cyclops are still alive, so presumably at that point, Professor X could be alive, too. But I don’t recall if there were scenes in either _The Wolverine_ or _Days of Future Past_ from before the timeline alteration that show Professor X alive after he was dead. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/56 "2017-01-10T17:52:35Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > What scenes show Professor Xavier from after the end of _Last Stand_ and before the alteration of the timeline in _Days of Future Past_? Clearly, after the events of the second prequel, the timeline has altered enough that Jean Grey and Cyclops are still alive, so presumably at that point, Professor X could be alive, too. But I don’t recall if there were scenes in either _The Wolverine_ or _Days of Future Past_ from before the timeline alteration that show Professor X alive after he was dead. Professor X is alive in the future before they alter the timeline. That’s the whole plot of the movie is him reaching out to his younger self. ---
**Author:** ![oft\_wears\_hats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@oft\_wears\_hats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oft_wears_hats)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/57 "2017-01-10T17:54:45Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > What scenes show Professor Xavier from after the end of _Last Stand_ and before the alteration of the timeline in _Days of Future Past_? Clearly, after the events of the second prequel, the timeline has altered enough that Jean Grey and Cyclops are still alive, so presumably at that point, Professor X could be alive, too. But I don’t recall if there were scenes in either _The Wolverine_ or _Days of Future Past_ from before the timeline alteration that show Professor X alive after he was dead. Xavier is shown in his usual body in the original future in Days of Future Past. AFAIK, this is the same future as The Last Stand, which is only retconned out of existence after Wolverine is sent back in time. So it does appear to be a plot hole, since it precedes Wolverine’s time shenanigans. ETA: Looks like Shadowcat sent **enalzi** back in time to ninja me and save the future. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/58 "2017-01-10T18:03:32Z")
Although speaking of X-Men, First Class definitely made some big retcons, mainly the relationships between Charles, Eric, and Mystique. ---
**Author:** ![MrAtoz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MrAtoz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrAtoz)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/59 "2017-01-10T18:14:38Z")
> [@wevets](#): > > What I hate about the prequels is that it reveals that instead of Obi-Wan dressing in desert robes convenient to his hot and dusty environment on Tatooine, he’s instead dressed in what appears to have been **the fracking uniform of the Jedi Knights** for twenty years! Before they were hunted down and killed by the despotic omnipresent Empire, that was how all Jedi Knights dressed. The _really_ weird part is that [Uncle Owen](http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/File:Owen_Luke.jpg) dressed almost exactly the same way, and nobody ever asked why he was doing Jedi Knight cosplay. Of course, that’s because he wasn’t. He was dressed for the hot desert environment that he lived in, just like Ben was. I very much agree with you–the transformation of Ben Kenobi’s practical desert robes into the Official Jedi Uniform is a small thing, but I find it deeply irritating. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410/60 "2017-01-10T18:17:55Z")
> [@MrAtoz](#): > > I very much agree with you–the transformation of Ben Kenobi’s practical desert robes into the Official Jedi Uniform is a small thing, but I find it deeply irritating. Along with the Enterprise crest from TOS changing into the crest for all of Star Fleet. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/worst-retcons/776410.md?page=4)