# Would "12 Angry Men" be well-received today? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 21, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554 "2011-08-21T18:49:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/1 "2011-08-21T18:49:55Z")
Last night, I watched _12 Angry Men_. I’ve seen it before, but it’s a film I return to from time to time–it’s a gripping drama, concerning jury deliberations in a death-penalty case. At the time of its release (1957), it was critically acclaimed, and it was also nominated for three Oscars. The film has two rather unusual characteristics. First, no names are used during deliberations–the jurors refer to themselves by number, the defendant is only known as “the boy,” and the witnesses are known as “the old man” and “the lady across the street.” We only learn the names of two jurors, and those are revealed only in the last minute of the film. But what has always struck me is the second characteristic, which is best summed up in the [Wikipedia entry for the film](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12_Angry_Men_%281957_film%29): > [@](#): > > The film is notable for its almost exclusive use of one set: with the exception of the film’s opening, which begins outside on the steps of the courthouse and ends with the jury’s final instructions before retiring, a brief final scene on the courthouse steps and two short scenes in an adjoining washroom, the entire movie takes place in the jury room. The total time spent outside of the jury room is three minutes out of the full 96 minutes of the movie. And that’s about it: the film takes place in one room, and consists mainly of people arguing, cajoling, talking, and so on. There are no special effects, action heroes, or supervillians; and there is only a little unobtrusive music to add to the atmosphere. But given many of the film discussions here, many of which concern action-adventure pictures, or special-effects-laden science-fiction movies, I’m wondering: how would _12 Angry Men_, or something similar, be received today? Is it too dull for today’s audiences, or would it still have critical and popular appeal? ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/2 "2011-08-21T18:55:11Z")
It was redone in [1997](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118528/), though I’m not sure how well it did or didn’t do. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/3 "2011-08-21T18:57:32Z")
Made now, they would “open up” the play. Flashbacks. Dramatic recreations of the situations being debated. More business in the courtroom itself. They wouldn’t have faith in the material to support itself without additional bells & whistles. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/4 "2011-08-21T18:58:31Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > It was redone in [1997](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118528/), though I’m not sure how well it did or didn’t do. It did as well as a made for TV remake of a 40 year old classic could be expected to. (It was quite good, by the way.) ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/5 "2011-08-21T19:10:53Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > But given many of the film discussions here, many of which concern action-adventure pictures, or special-effects-laden science-fiction movies, I’m wondering: how would _12 Angry Men_, or something similar, be received today? Is it too dull for today’s audiences, or would it still have critical and popular appeal? Clerks was released in 1994 and takes place almost exclusively in a convenience store and the adjoining video store. No special effects, all talking. Yes, it’s slightly more “open” than 12 Angry Men, but something tells that its one room setup wasn’t all that common in 50s film either. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/6 "2011-08-21T19:20:43Z")
If they tried to make it today, some asshole would immediately link to the [Cracked page](http://www.cracked.com/article_18815_the-5-most-wildly-illegal-court-rulings-in-movie-history_p2.html) that calls it “one of the most illegal trial verdicts in cinema history.” ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/7 "2011-08-21T19:28:04Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > And that’s about it: the film takes place in one room, and consists mainly of people arguing, cajoling, talking, and so on. Sounds a bit like a [bottle episode](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=564380) of a TV series. My guess: a movie like this could do well today, but it would have to be _extremely_ well-written and well-acted. ---
**Author:** ![LH75](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lh75/32/4438_2.png) [@LH75](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LH75)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/8 "2011-08-21T19:55:36Z")
The casting of the 1957 movie was perfect. What current actors could be brought together to make this movie today? ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/9 "2011-08-21T19:57:40Z")
The play was performed by the local bar in TBay just a few years ago, and was well received. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/10 "2011-08-21T19:58:55Z")
> [@LH75](#): > > The casting of the 1957 movie was perfect. What current actors could be brought together to make this movie today? You don’t think 12 good actors riffing off each could work? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/11 "2011-08-21T20:28:43Z")
> [@LH75](#): > > The casting of the 1957 movie was perfect. What current actors could be brought together to make this movie today? The casting of the 1997 version linked to earlier worked pretty darn well. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/12 "2011-08-21T20:50:39Z")
A large part of the unity of place stems from the fact that it was written as a play, not as a movie. It makes things a lot easier on stage if you never need to change the set. Frankly, I’m kind of surprised it hasn’t been remade. Even if it wouldn’t rake in the big bucks that the summer blockbusters do, the expenses would be minimal, so it should be very easy to turn a profit on. Really, the only expense of any significance would be the actors, and there are only 12 of them total, no cameos, no walk-ons, no extras. And most of those 12 you could fill with up-and-coming no-name actors willing to work for little more than the chance at exposure. It’s made even easier by the fact that they’re so nonspecific: You could use an actor of any appearance, nearly any age, and even any sex, for all of the roles. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/13 "2011-08-21T21:11:12Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > Last night, I watched _12 Angry Men_. I’ve seen it before, but it’s a film I return to from time to time–it’s a gripping drama, concerning jury deliberations in a death-penalty case. At the time of its release (1957), it was critically acclaimed, and it was also nominated for three Oscars. > > The film has two rather unusual characteristics. First, no names are used during deliberations–the jurors refer to themselves by number, the defendant is only known as “the boy,” and the witnesses are known as “the old man” and “the lady across the street.” We only learn the names of two jurors, and those are revealed only in the last minute of the film. > > But what has always struck me is the second characteristic, which is best summed up in the [Wikipedia entry for the film](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12_Angry_Men_%281957_film%29): > > And that’s about it: the film takes place in one room, and consists mainly of people arguing, cajoling, talking, and so on. There are no special effects, action heroes, or supervillians; and there is only a little unobtrusive music to add to the atmosphere. > > But given many of the film discussions here, many of which concern action-adventure pictures, or special-effects-laden science-fiction movies, I’m wondering: how would _12 Angry Men_, or something similar, be received today? Is it too dull for today’s audiences, or would it still have critical and popular appeal? This xkcd [xkcd: Movie Narrative Charts](http://xkcd.com/657/) includes a timeline of the motions of the main characters in “12 Angry Men,” by the way. P.S. It’s a great movie, and known as such - that might protect it from being jazzed up by a remake. ---
**Author:** ![Voluble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/4af34b/32.png) [@Voluble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voluble)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/14 "2011-08-21T21:22:15Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > Made now, they would “open up” the play. Flashbacks. Dramatic recreations of the situations being debated. More business in the courtroom itself. They wouldn’t have faith in the material to support itself without additional bells & whistles. That’s the problem, the material isn’t all that good. You have a lot of people sitting around reminiscing and chewing the fat about things that aren’t remotely related to the facts or evidence of the case. It is the typical hectoring, lecturing fare you get from Hollywood and it is a rather inartful example of even that. Admittedly, I didn’t make it through the entire movie. I turned it off about the point I would have left the jury room to get the bailiff to tell him no one was taking their responsibilities seriously. And yeah, as someone else indicated TV series often do episodes where the characters are on just one set when they have used up too much of their budget. This is especially true in Science Fiction where the budgets get strained and it is better to have one good set than to have a bunch of bad sets or effects. A lot of sitcoms like _Cheers_ or _Married With Children_ take place in one or two rooms for their entire run. It seems to be more common than not for that genre. I guess that is why there are so many of them… they are cheap to make. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/15 "2011-08-21T21:22:34Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > A large part of the unity of place stems from the fact that it was written as a play, not as a movie. It makes things a lot easier on stage if you never need to change the set. Actually, if I’m interpreting what Wikipedia says correctly, it was written as a teleplay (i.e. the original version was for TV, not for the stage or the big screen). ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/16 "2011-08-21T21:41:05Z")
I can think of four other movies that take place almost entirely in a single building or on its grounds, though not in a single room. The first three are all based on stage plays, the fourth on a novel. The Diary of Anne Frank (1959) - the Anne Frank house in Amsterdam Stalag 17 (1953) - A barracks and adjacent yard in a POW camp with at least one scene in the commandant’s office The Lion in Winter (1968) - A castle in France They Shoot Horses, Don’t They? (1969) - a dance hall, with some brief flashback exterior scenes and brief flash-forward scenes in a courtroom ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/17 "2011-08-21T22:14:34Z")
> [@bibliophage](#): > > I can think of four other movies that take place almost entirely in a single building or on its grounds, though not in a single room. Most porn does, too. And that is pretty successful genre of film. Probably the most successful, financially. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/18 "2011-08-21T22:15:10Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Frankly, I’m kind of surprised it hasn’t been remade. As has been already mentioned, they made a remake in 1997. A more recent remake was released in Russia (simply titled “12”) was released in 2007. > **[12](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12_%28film%29)** > > Twelve or 12 may refer to: ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/19 "2011-08-21T22:34:56Z")
Other films with a single set: **The Boys in the Band Lifeboat Rope Rear Window Russian Ark** (though the “set” is the Hermitage Museum in St. Petersburg, so there’s a lot of movement). More recently, **Proof** takes place in a house (though more than one room is shown), and **Doubt** in a Catholic school (again, more than one area of the school is shown). ---
**Author:** ![LH75](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lh75/32/4438_2.png) [@LH75](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LH75)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554/20 "2011-08-21T22:37:48Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > You don’t think 12 good actors riffing off each could work? I am sorry I wasn’t clear. I was not doubting that we have the talent to carry this movie off using current actors. I was just wondering who would be cast. Maybe this would be an interesting thread [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-12-angry-men-be-well-received-today/593554.md?page=2)