# Would a Giuliani/McCain ticket be unbeatable? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 11, 2006, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331 "2006-08-11T19:02:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/41 "2006-08-12T21:45:29Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Yep, and thanks. I’m further suggesting that you join the bulk of the former “Rockefeller Republicans” in recognizing that their principles are more important than their traditional organizational affiliations, and make the appropriate change. I still have problems with the Dems as I am very much in favor of a strong military used wisely. I consider myself to truly be a Bull-Moose Republican. Trust busting, green, and militaristic. **GLWasteful** : I know, small chance, but you got to believe and I have to give the pubbies one last chance. Jim ---
**Author:** ![CapnPitt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/edb3f5/32.png) [@CapnPitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CapnPitt)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/42 "2006-08-12T22:22:42Z")
Well, I for one, was the one doing the pipe-dreaming (though I’m glad to see I have at least a little company). Up until the GWBush candidacy, I’d always thought of myself as a Rockefeller Republican. Of course, unusual as I am, I’ve moved further to the left as I’ve aged instead of the opposite. I just got my shiny new Democratic voter registration card the other day (after a 4 year stint as an Independent). That being said, I was just thinking (in the OP) that I’d probably vote for the ticket I named. However, that’s mostly because I’m pissed that the Dems (my new party) won’t ever give me someone who I can vote _for_. Hell, I hated Bob Casey and I don’t like his son very much. However, I gave him money because I can’t stand Santorum so much. Casey, Jr.'s campaign is apparently to just shut up and not stand for anything and let people like me hate Santorum. I think that’s what **XT** was talking about above. In short, I’m just begging the Dems to give me someone with a little charisma, intellect, a modicum of integrity (whatever that is these days) and _some_ issues I can get behind. Alas, that’s just pipe dreaming too, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/43 "2006-08-12T22:41:59Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Yep, and thanks. I’m further suggesting that you join the bulk of the former “Rockefeller Republicans” in recognizing that their principles are more important than their traditional organizational affiliations, and make the appropriate change. I already made the appropriate switch - I’m a registered Libertarian. So long as the Democratic Party opposes my ownership of firearms, they will **never** get my vote on anything. Count me as a single-issue voter in that respect. I’d sooner “waste” my vote for a third-party candidate than support a Democrat. Or a Republican, for that matter lately. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/44 "2006-08-12T23:34:16Z")
You’ll never find an organization that always agrees with everything you want. Hell, do you know of any \*individual \* who always agrees with you, either? Make a list of what you want, prioritize it, and compare. If you prize Ineffectuality highly, then perhaps the Libertarians are your best bet. [This little game](http://www.loveinwar.com/game.cfm) can help you decide. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/45 "2006-08-12T23:51:17Z")
“You are a **Middle-of-the-Road Independent**. You have little conviction and less loyalty. You expect politicians to cater to your over-sized ego.” Yep. Exactly. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2006, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/46 "2006-08-12T23:59:20Z")
> [@](#): > > I’m a registered Libertarian. So long as the Democratic Party opposes my ownership of firearms, they will never get my vote on anything. Oh yes. The Democrats are just rushing to TAKE AWAY ALL YOUR PRETTY GUNS!!! Sure they are. I mean, that’s what all the compulsory gun collections back in the 60s,70s,80s,and 90s were about. Remember those? Now wait you don’t? I could have sworn… But, okay: you mean what you are saying is some sort of ridiculous hyberbole and you consider things like background checks and triggerlock laws and attempts to stop en masse gun smuggling to be attempts to take away your guns? Well, why not say that, instead of something so nutty and over the top? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/47 "2006-08-13T00:47:51Z")
Who supports HCI and every other anti-gun group in America? It certainly hasn’t been the Republican Party. Try reading the Democratic Party National Platform sometime. > [@](#): > > But, okay: you mean what you are saying is some sort of ridiculous hyberbole and you consider things like background checks and triggerlock laws and attempts to stop en masse gun smuggling to be attempts to take away your guns? Keep repeating your little liberal mantra until it makes you feel better. But basically, yes, I do view them as attempts to that end. Now that I’ve revealed myself to be the rabid manic you suspected I was, you can cower in fear and terror at the Danger to Western Civilization that I represent. I’m a Life Member of the NRA, and I vote. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/48 "2006-08-13T01:50:35Z")
Giuliani’s been getting a pretty free ride. His national reputation has been generally based on his finest hour; his crisis management in the aftermath of the 9/11 attacks on NYC. But on September 10, Rudy Giuliani was considered a political dead end by many people - Hillary Clinton was ahead of him in the polls when they were running for the Senate and Bloomberg’s ties to Giuliani were considered a liability that would probably cost him the election. If Giuliani ever declares for a major nomination all of the old baggage will be resurrected. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/49 "2006-08-13T01:55:29Z")
> [@What Exit?](#): > > I still have problems with the Dems as I am very much in favor of a strong military used wisely. I consider myself to truly be a Bull-Moose Republican. Trust busting, green, and militaristic. > **GLWasteful** : I know, small chance, but you got to believe and I have to give the pubbies one last chance. > > Jim We need a two-party system in which both parties are loyal to the fundamental bones of what makes this country tick. If you have the energy and the gumption, please stick with trying to retake the Republican party. I don’t like the Dems being able to take my vote for granted, and I’ve voted Republican on occasion (but on the national level it’s been a long dry season). The Republican party I could respect would be one that trots out candidates like Pete Domenici, Olympia Snowe, Rudolph Giuliani, Susan Collins, and Christine Todd Whitman when it comes time to put someone in national office. Most of the folks they’ve been fielding the last quarter-century have been frightening and threatening. Not that I’m telling you anything you don’t already know. By all means, go retake your party, the folks who control it now are fucking dangerous. And yeah, the Dems need a loyal opposition to keep them in check once they come back into power. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/50 "2006-08-13T02:38:37Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Who supports HCI and every other anti-gun group in America? It certainly hasn’t been the Republican Party. “HCI”? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/51 "2006-08-13T02:42:19Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > We need a two-party system in which both parties are loyal to the fundamental bones of what makes this country tick. To the contrary, we need a [multiparty system.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=269169) Even if the various parties have radically different ideas about what it means to be “loyal to the fundamental bones of what makes this country tick.” ---
**Author:** ![Ms2001](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ms2001/32/18463_2.png) [@Ms2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms2001)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/52 "2006-08-13T03:12:53Z")
HCI (“Handgun Control, Inc.”) was an old name for the [Brady Campaign](http://www.bradycampaign.org/). From their [about page](http://www.bradycampaign.org/about/): > [@](#): > > Brady believes that a safer America can be achieved without banning guns. Our stand is simple. We believe that law-abiding citizens should be able to buy and keep firearms. And we believe there are sensible gun laws that we can and should insist upon when it comes to gun ownership. > > First and foremost, we should try to keep guns out of the hands of those who should not have them, including criminals and children. > > Second, there are certain classes of weapons that should be out of bounds for private ownership. They include Saturday-night specials, which are used almost exclusively for crime, military-style assault weapons like Uzis and AK-47s, and .50-caliber sniper rifles, which serve no ordinary sporting purpose. > > Third, we believe that those who do own guns ought to be held to the highest standards of safety. They should be well trained in the use of their weapons and they should be required to keep weapons secure, so that neither innocent children nor prohibited persons can get a hold of them. What a bunch of gun-grabbing wackos, huh? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/53 "2006-08-13T03:33:09Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > … > The Republican party I could respect would be one that trots out candidates like Pete Domenici, Olympia Snowe, Rudolph Giuliani, Susan Collins, and Christine Todd Whitman when it comes time to put someone in national office. Most of the folks they’ve been fielding the last quarter-century have been frightening and threatening. Not that I’m telling you anything you don’t already know. By all means, go retake your party, the folks who control it now are fucking dangerous. > > And yeah, the Dems need a loyal opposition to keep them in check once they come back into power. You probably know that Christy Todd is campaigning nationwide to encourage the moderate Republicans to take back the party. She is as anti-RR as any Dem at this point and far more then jerks like Lieberman. I like her, but she was not a great governor, hopefully she will prove to be a great party organizer. Jim ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/54 "2006-08-13T03:34:19Z")
> [@Mr2001](#): > > What a bunch of gun-grabbing wackos, huh? I’ve got some swampland in Georgia you might be interested in… ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/55 "2006-08-13T04:26:24Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > I’ve got some swampland in Georgia you might be interested in… [I’m afraid that particular piece of swampland is no longer marketable.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newt_Gingrich) ---
**Author:** ![Ms2001](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ms2001/32/18463_2.png) [@Ms2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms2001)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/56 "2006-08-13T04:31:46Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > I’ve got some swampland in Georgia you might be interested in… Guess you think they’re lying, then. So what **would** an organization that seriously believes in that position look like to you? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/57 "2006-08-13T04:35:34Z")
> [@Mr2001](#): > > Guess you think they’re lying, then. So what **would** an organization that seriously believes in that position look like to you? I am not pro-gun, but I agree with **Silenus**. The Dems are the party that have caused the few erosions to Gun rights that have occurred in this country. I do also believe the NRA has over the years defended some ridiculous positions in the name of the slippery slope. Jim ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/58 "2006-08-13T04:35:56Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > We need a two-party system in which both parties are loyal to the fundamental bones of what makes this country tick. Preach it! > [@](#): > > The Republican party I could respect would be one that trots out candidates like Pete Domenici, Olympia Snowe, Rudolph Giuliani, Susan Collins, and Christine Todd Whitman when it comes time to put someone in national office. Hell, **I** could respect 'em if they did that. But I stand by my statement that the Religious Right will never allow any of the above to stand for national office. And they will watch the GOP burn to ashes first. > [@](#): > > And yeah, the Dems need a loyal opposition to keep them in check once they come back into power. Again, preach it! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/59 "2006-08-13T06:46:02Z")
For the sake of power, to advance their agenda, the Rocky Pubbies supped with Da Debbil, made a deal with the knuckle-walkers. Without that support, they could not aspire to anything other than Loyal Opposition status. The Republican party can be reformed and reborn if enough of them opt for integrity over power. If it happens, I will most likely be too stunned to applaud. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2006, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331/60 "2006-08-13T07:31:21Z")
I am sick to death of both parties kowtowing to the concerns of the Religious Right. “I have a dream” that some day both parties will put other issues first. I like both McCain and Guilliani okay, but truly, I’ve voted for my last set of white males unless that is my only choice. I like both Olympia Snow and Susan Collins (lucky Maine!). I don’t know much about your other suggestions **AHunter3**. How old is Fred Dalton Thompson? I don’t like being ageist anyway. He was one of the Republican votes that I’ve cast when he was in the Senate. Very sharp man and many thought that he was well on the road to the Presidency at one time. After the death of one of his children, he left politics and returned to acting. (_Law and Order_) (His first role was playing himself in a movie. He was a Nashville attorney who helped to rid Tennesseans of a corrupt governor.) Get Colin Powell to run and I’ll vote Republican. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-a-giuliani-mccain-ticket-be-unbeatable/368331.md?page=4)