Would producing a birth certificate do any good?

[GIGObuster]

@Starving_Artist

It doesn’t matter how “black” someone is if they’re a conservative. To the liberal mind they’re simply honorary white people. And the wrong kind of white people at that. We’ve seen the same with Clarence Thomas, Alan Keys, Condoleeza Rice and Michael Steele. And with regard to Obama, it somehow never occurs to liberals who question to this very day the vote count of the 2000 election, that Republicans may simply be looking for ways to invalidate an election that put the opposing party in the White House. Nope, to them if a black guy’s involved and Republicans oppose him in any way, the reason is always racism, pure and simple.

Nah, it is just evidence of the Crazification Factor, just by using logic one can be aware that race was out as a factor in the Obama vs Keyes contest.

http://philosophistry.com/archives/2008/04/the-crazificati.html

Tyrone: Obama vs. Alan Keyes. Keyes was from out of state, so you can eliminate any established political base; both candidates were black, so you can factor out racism; and Keyes was plainly, obviously, completely crazy.

Batshit crazy. Head-trauma crazy. But 27% of the population of Illinois voted for him. They put party identification, personal prejudice, whatever ahead of rational judgment. Hell, even like 5% of Democrats voted for him. That’s crazy behaviour. I think you have to assume a 27% Crazification Factor in any population.

And really Starving Artist, do you consider a good friend someone that says “I’m willing to BET MY FUCKING LIFE that when Obama’s treason is finally brought to justice and he’s taken out of office (or prevented from getting elected in 2012) due to his eligibility problems, the libtards will go apeshit”?

Are you really a birther too?

[Champion-of-Truth]

Gigomoron wrote:

And really Starving Artist, do you consider a good friend someone that says “I’m willing to BET MY FUCKING LIFE that when Obama’s treason is finally brought to justice and he’s taken out of office (or prevented from getting elected in 2012) due to his eligibility problems, the libtards will go apeshit”?

Are you really a birther too?

One small problem with your nonsense. I’m not a birther. Never have been. Never will be.

[GIGObuster]

@Champion-of-Truth

Gigomoron wrote:

One small problem with your nonsense. I’m not a birther. Never have been. Never will be.

This should be good, then what are the ineligibility problems that Obama has then?

[Champion-of-Truth]

Hey Leper. Or Leaper. Or Stupid Fuck. Whatever you call yourself. You wrote:

Huh. I didn’t know that Starving Artist believed that Obama was not born in the United States. I thought the friending thing was something unrelated, but apparently, he actually does think so.

Neither Starving Artist or myself said Obama was not born in the United States. I myself have only said that we do not know if he has natural born status, and that I am certain he does not. I have posted that OBAMA’S RELATIVES have said he was born in Kenya, and that WE DO NOT KNOW until we see a true, long form birth certificate.

What is it with liberals where they can’t get any of their facts straight and always post things that in fact have never been said? So far, and this is just today’s list off the top of my head, I have been accused by fucktard liberals here of the following:

Hating Hawaii
Saying Obama was born in Kenya
Saying Obama was not born in America
Hating America
Citing Newsbusters

when in fact the public record shows all those accusations to be FALSE. I have even offered $500 to anyone who can show where I EVER cited Newsbusters. Surely one of you stupid fucktard liberals can use an extra $500 to donate to some ridiculous Muslim “charity” or to donate to some stupid anti-gun campaign or something. Come on, step up and claim your rewards, dumb-asses! Waving 5 $100 bills under my nose just DARING one of you to claim it.

Hell, I’ll give $500 to anyone who show me saying ANY of the things listed above (that I hate Hawaii or America, that I cited Newsbusters, that Obama was born in Kenya, etc). Hell, if one of you lazy fucks had any integrity, you’d try claiming all of those things and win $2,500. Go for it!

[Starving_Artist]

@Leaper

Huh. I didn’t know that Starving Artist believed that Obama was not born in the United States. I thought the friending thing was something unrelated, but apparently, he actually does think so.

I have no idea why I didn’t know that. I could’ve sworn he said at some point before that he thought the opposite. Huh (again).

Just because you can understand someone’s motives it doesn’t necessarily follow that you agree with them.

As for me, I feel the same way about Obama’s having been elected as I did about liberals who were whinging about the 2000 election years after it was declared legal - “The powers that be have settled the issue and Bush is legally the president. Get over it.” I feel the same about Obama. He’s the president and that’s all there is to it. Frankly, I never give a moment’s thought to the issue. I just think it’s horseshit when liberals eagerly and knee-jerkedly assign any opposition to Obama in any way as being racially motivated, so I said so.

[Leaper]

@Starving_Artist

Just because you can understand someone’s motives it doesn’t necessarily follow that you agree with them.

As for me, I feel the same way about Obama’s having been elected as I did about liberals who were whinging about the 2000 election years after it was declared legal - “The powers that be have settled the issue and Bush is legally the president. Get over it.” I feel the same about Obama. He’s the president and that’s all there is to it. Frankly, I never give a moment’s thought to the issue. I just think it’s horseshit when liberals eagerly and knee-jerkedly assign any opposition to Obama in any way as being racially motivated, so I said so.

I see. Still, it does still have continuing relevance, assuming that he runs for reelection. Should he do so, and win, I assume you’ll take his previous election as “evidence” (or whatever word you want to use) that he’s allowed to take office for a second time? Or am I misunderstanding?

[Kyla]

@Champion-of-Truth

Surely one of you stupid fucktard liberals can use an extra $500 to donate to some ridiculous Muslim “charity” or to donate to some stupid anti-gun campaign or something.

I prefer killing babies, actually.

[Champion-of-Truth]

Gigobuster wrote:

This should be good, then what are the ineligibility problems that Obama has then?

There is a very, very serious question about his eligibility. Regardless of what you choose to believe, there are conflicting stories. Some of his relatives claim they were there when he was born in Kenya. Two different Hawaiian hospitals have been cited as his place of birth, yet neither will confirm it, nor has any doctor stepped forward to claim he delivered Obama. Obama’s mama left Hawaii for Seattle withing less than 3 weeks of his birth to attend college. Seems a bit strange for an 18 year old mother with a 3 week old child to travel cross-country with a 3 week old child. Obama is using a Social Security number registered to a man born in 1890, and it was registered to the state of Connecticut where he never lived, resided, worked, or even visited (until he campaigned there). There is evidence from a digital forensic expert that the COLB posted at fightthesmears.com and factcheck.org are forgeries. Both sources are suspect anyway, since they have strong association with Obama. There is no record of his parents ever living together as man and wife. He traveled to Pakistan at a time when US citizens could not travel there. There are issues with his Indonesian and British citizenship that must be looked at. Hawaii’s Democratic party refused to issue certification saying he was constitutionally eligible on its paperwork naming Obama a candidate (read here: http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=207197)

I could go on and on. The bottom line is, WE DO NOT KNOW. There is a lot of smoke, and where there is smoke there is fire. Obam has sealed virtually all his records. His birth certificate, his adoption papers, his passport records, his law school papers, his financial aid papers, etc. So much for transparency!

Since the office of president is the highest in the land, the founding fathers were adamant that one must be a natural born citizen for that office and that office alone. Surely all these doubts should be put to rest. Obama admits to having found a long form birth certificate in an old book. He wrote about this in one of his books. He can have the Hawaiian Dept. of Health release this and he can release his other records but instead he has spent $2 MILLION to suppress this information. Only someone with something to hide would do that.

Thomas Jefferson said “When a man assumes a public trust, he should consider himself as public property.” I agree.

I cannot honestly say whether he was born in Hawaii, Kenya, or wherever. There is no proof of anything. And he’s been caught lying about so much. So he cannot be trusted.

I fail to see how any decent citizen would ridicule another merely for demanding proof that the person who claims he is constitutionally eligible truly is. Its not much to ask for a birth certificate and to release other records. It costs him less money than I lose in my car seat on a daily basis, and less time than it took me to type this paragraph. Certainly not an unreasonable demand.

Now there are kooks who INSIST he was born in Kenya. I am not one of them. I am not a “birther”. Joesph Farah, the editor of World Net Daily, gets this shit all the time. Liberals ALWAYS accuse him of saying Obama was born in Kenya, when he never has. He’s merely said we have no way of knowing where he was born.

I simply want him properly vetted as McCain was. No more, no less.

[Champion-of-Truth]

Kyla babbled:

I prefer killing babies, actually.

This is why Ann Coulter wrote a book titled “How to Talk To Liberals”. I could have written it a lot quicker, since it would consist of 1 page, saying: “You can’t talk to liberals. They’re just too damned stupid.”

But then, who would buy a 1 page book, regardless of the wisdom therein?

[Kyla]

@Starving_Artist

I just think it’s horseshit when liberals eagerly and knee-jerkedly assign any opposition to Obama in any way as being racially motivated, so I said so.

I have to say, this is a bit of a strawman. I don’t see a lot of liberals accusing conservatives of being racist in general. Not everyone agrees politically, and we all know that. It rarely has to do with race. The only times I can think of race being an issue is when people start saying that Obama wasn’t born in the US. Considering that Obama has a birth certificate that says he was born in Hawaii, there is a birth announcement in a Hawaiian paper, and there is absolutely no evidence to the contrary, the persistent belief that some people hold that Obama is not an American citizen strikes many as so irrational that it must have its cause in something equally irrational, such as racism.

[Kyla]

@Champion-of-Truth

Kyla babbled:

This is why Ann Coulter wrote a book titled “How to Talk To Liberals”. I could have written it a lot quicker, since it would consist of 1 page, saying: “You can’t talk to liberals. They’re just too damned stupid.”

But then, who would buy a 1 page book, regardless of the wisdom therein?

So, serious question: does this get boring after awhile? I mean, I’ve never trolled a message board, but I feel like it could potentially be kind of amusing at first. But the entertainment value would probably fade pretty quickly. I am legit impressed with your tenacity, but I wonder if you couldn’t find a more constructive outlet.

[joebuck20]

Just curious, how many people have handy a copy of their “long form” birth certificate? The copy I have and that I’ve used all my life to get a driver’s license, passport, etc. looks a lot like the one Obama made public (albeit from a Midwestern state and not Hawaii). It’s an official copy printed out on fancy stationary with the county seal embossed in the corner, and lists my birthdate, birth place and parents’ names, but no other information save for the signature of the county health commissioner.

[Starving_Artist]

@Leaper

I see. Still, it does still have continuing relevance, assuming that he runs for reelection. Should he do so, and win, I assume you’ll take his previous election as “evidence” (or whatever word you want to use) that he’s allowed to take office for a second time? Or am I misunderstanding?

No, I’ll simply think, as I do with regard to Bush and WMD, that mistakes were made based upon information available at the time. And then I would rely upon our legal system, which is all we really can rely on, to determine how to proceeed from there. I would imagine that Obama would be deemed unqualified to continue to serve, but that his actions as president up to that time would still stand under the rationale that he was legally elected president based upon the information available at the time he was elected. Natually, this would be strongly contested by certain members of the Republican party, but I can’t see any way that the courts would overrule every action, every signing, and every law otherwise passed by Congress and signed into being by Obama. That would result in chaos. So the courts, even though they know that Obama was not qualified at the time he was elected, would find some way to make his time in office legal.

[Champion-of-Truth]

Starving Artist wrote:

As for me, I feel the same way about Obama’s having been elected as I did about liberals who were whinging about the 2000 election years after it was declared legal - “The powers that be have settled the issue and Bush is legally the president. Get over it.” I feel the same about Obama. He’s the president and that’s all there is to it. Frankly, I never give a moment’s thought to the issue. I just think it’s horseshit when liberals eagerly and knee-jerkedly assign any opposition to Obama in any way as being racially motivated, so I said so.

Oh dear God, now you’ve done it! The libtards are gonna have a nuclear meltdown when they realize that conservatives can disagree on issues and aren’t hive members! LMAO!

Here is why I disagree with you on that. First, the 2000 election was in dispute, it was taken to court, the issues were all investigated, and a legal ruling was made. I had no stake in it since I hated both Bush and Kerry, so it didn’t matter to me who won (I only vote for Constitution Party candidates, for the most part). Later, even the DNC admitted through its own recount that Bush won.

However, with Obama we never properly looked into the matter. And if he is ineligible, he damn well knows he is, so that would make him a treasonous usurper. And that would violate the Constitution, the supreme law of our country. That’s very serious. And if we say “Oh well, he got away with it, it’s too late now”, then that means that part of the Constitution is meaningless. Which part do we abrogate next? Free speech? Freedom of religion? It’s a slippery slope. The Constitution must mean something, and every part of it must mean something, or the whole document is meaningless.

And as I say, even if you disagree with me, I think most people would agree that there’s no harm in asking to see a true birth certificate and other records, as that is not asking any more than we have of any other president. Obama promised transparency, and yet he is the most secretive president of all time.

Good lord, the libtards are gonna freak when they realize we’re not clones of one another!

[Lord_Feldon]

@Champion-of-Truth

I could go on and on. The bottom line is, WE DO NOT KNOW.

I’m not saying the theory of evolution isn’t valid, I’m just saying we don’t know. Teach the controversy.

I’m not saying that a plane didn’t hit the Pentagon, I’m just saying we don’t know. Investigate it more.

I’m not saying homeopathy is effective, I’m just saying we don’t know. Be open-minded.

I wish idiots would at least have conviction in their idiocy.

[joebuck20]

@Lord_Feldon

I’m not saying the theory of evolution isn’t valid, I’m just saying we don’t know. Teach the controversy.

I’m not saying that a plane didn’t hit the Pentagon, I’m just saying we don’t know. Investigate it more.

I’m not saying homeopathy is effective, I’m just saying we don’t know. Be open-minded.

I wish idiots would at least have conviction in their idiocy.

So you’re saying this guy is Glenn Beck then?

[Starving_Artist]

@Kyla

I have to say, this is a bit of a strawman. I don’t see a lot of liberals accusing conservatives of being racist in general.

:eek: You don’t? I’ve been seeing and hearing it for forty years, though nowhere near to the degree it goes on around here. Perhaps if the board’s liberal members who disagree ever spoke up to contest it I’d feel differently. But I have literally read thousands of posts on this board over the eight years or so I’ve been here calling conservatives racist, and much worse, without the slightest refutation by any of the board’s other liberal members.

[Champion-of-Truth]

Joebuck20 wrote:

Just curious, how many people have handy a copy of their “long form” birth certificate? The copy I have and that I’ve used all my life to get a driver’s license, passport, etc. looks a lot like the one Obama made public (albeit from a Midwestern state and not Hawaii). It’s an official copy printed out on fancy stationary with the county seal embossed in the corner, and lists my birthdate, birth place and parents’ names, but no other information save for the signature of the county health commissioner.

I do. My brother does. My best friend does. Three people I talked to about it at work do. Several people I talk to regularly as clients do. My uncle has his. My aunt has hers. My grandmother’s great niece (I have no idea what that makes me to her) has hers, as does her brother. Their parents had theirs. I have my parents’ original birth certificates. Actually, most people I know have theirs. Or can obtain theirs, along with other hospital records.

Speaking of which, let’s assume for sake of argument that there is no longer any long form birth certificate on Obama. There are certainly other hospital admission records from when he was born. Why not just release those?

[GIGObuster]

@Champion-of-Truth

Neither Starving Artist or myself said Obama was not born in the United States. I myself have only said that we do not know if he has natural born status, and that I am certain he does not.

And that makes you a birther also, sorry to disappoint you, but the term also applies to the ones that insist on that **useless **angle.

@Champion-of-Truth

I have posted that OBAMA’S RELATIVES have said he was born in Kenya, and that WE DO NOT KNOW until we see a true, long form birth certificate.

What I do know is that World Nut Daily forgot to report this to you:

Salon's handy-dandy guide to refuting the Birthers

Some of the Birthers – like de facto leader Orly Taitz – believe that Obama wouldn’t be eligible for the presidency even if he were born in the U.S. That’s because, in their infinite wisdom, the Founding Fathers included in the Constitution a fair amount of phrases they never really bothered to define. One of those is this explanation of who can be president: “No person except a natural born citizen.”

The Supreme Court has never ruled directly on the question of what “natural born citizen” means. So the Birthers have simply settled on their own definition – someone born to two citizen parents – and found a source,“The Law of Nations,” a 1758 book by the Swiss philosopher Emerich de Vattel, to back them up.

There are a couple of problems with this. Most important, Obama isn’t the first president with a non-citizen parent: Chester A. Arthur, the 21st president, was. His father was from Ireland and apparently did not become a U.S. citizen until more than 10 years after the future president’s birth.

Plus, even if the Founding Fathers did rely on Vattel as much as the Birthers say – always a dubious proposition – Swiss philosophy books aren’t legal precedent in the United States. British common law is. And in 1898, in the case of U.S. v. Wong Kim Ark, the Supreme Court looked into the meaning of “natural born” in the common law and concluded that a non-citizen’s mere presence in the U.S. is enough to make their child, if born here, a natural-born citizen.

Myth 4: Obama’s grandmother said he was born in Kenya

There’s a kernel of truth to this one. In an interview with a street preacher named Ron McRae, Sarah Obama, the second wife of the president’s grandfather, did say she was there, in Kenya, for her grandson’s birth.
**
Unfortunately for the Birthers, it was the result of a miscommunication – or perhaps a mistranslation** – and as soon as McRae started pressing the issue, Obama’s family realized what had happened and corrected him. Most Birthers simply ignore the corrections, excising them from audio and transcripts of the conversation posted online. McRae just believes it’s part of the conspiracy and that Obama’s younger relatives were coached to hide the truth.

The full audio can be downloaded here. What follows is a transcript of the relevant portion of the interview:

MCRAE: Could I ask her about his actual birthplace? I would like to see his birthplace when I come to Kenya in December. Was she present when he was born in Kenya?

TRANSLATOR: Yes. She says, yes, she was, she was present when Obama was born.

MCRAE: When I come in December. I would like to come by the place, the hospital, where he was born. Could you tell me where he was born? Was he born in Mombasa?

TRANSLATOR: No, Obama was not born in Mombasa. He was born in America.

MCRAE: Whereabouts was he born? I thought he was born in Kenya.

TRANSLATOR: No, he was born in America, not in Mombasa.

MCRAE: Do you know where he was born? I thought he was born in Kenya. I was going to go by and see where he was born.

TRANSLATOR: Hawaii. Hawaii. Sir, she says he was born in Hawaii. In the state of Hawaii, where his father was also learning, there. The state of Hawaii.

@Champion-of-Truth

What is it with liberals where they can’t get any of their facts straight and always post things that in fact have never been said?

What you posted early does forcefully imply that indeed you are claiming that others report that Obama was born in Kenya or Obama was not born in America.

And that is really stupid, someone claiming that others claimed that Obama was not born in America is not a good reason to believe that Obama was or would not eligible, the burden was still on the birthers to show that this was the truth. The whole truth was that a smoking misunderstanding in an interview was turned by retarded media like WND into a burning inferno.

Incidentally, it is not logical to jump from “OBAMA’S RELATIVES have said he was born in Kenya” to say that “WE DO NOT KNOW until we see a true, long form birth certificate.” They (Obama’s relatives) are the ones with the problem, and a few birthers that are dismissed by even mainstream republicans.

http://www.wisepolitics.com/eric-cantor-hits-birthers-3172.html

Eric Cantor says birther claims are wrong. “Birthers” has been a term recently applied to those questioning President Obama’s citizenship. Glenn Beck and Bill O’Reilly have already dismissed the claims of the “birthers.” “Meet the Press” host David Gregory went even further, calling the birther theories “crazy talk.”

[GIGObuster]

@joebuck20

So you’re saying this guy is Glenn Beck then?

No he is not, even Glenn Beck is smarter than this old COoT!!!