# Would the human race die out if we only "did it" like the bible says you're supposed to? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 8, 2010, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434 "2010-04-08T17:35:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/41 "2010-04-09T17:49:07Z")
Several thousand years of history isn’t a good enough example for the OP? Okay, sure, there were illegitmate children. _But babies also died by the cartload_. _Surely_ the latter losses outnumber the prior gains, if only because the fetal mortality was so staggeringly high. Seriously. Every good christan family I know manages to have five or more kids nowadays - sometimes, _much_ more. In what way does this risk diving below replacement rate? ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2010, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/42 "2010-04-10T05:17:12Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > Reproduction just puts more pure spirits in bondage to material shells & gives Jehovah more souls to enslave. Also, all matter being evil & all spirit being good, these dualists were accused of believing that nothing they did sexually/materially really did damage to their spirituality so anything sexual was OK as long as it didn’t result in childbirth. Tell the truth- you’ve used that as a pickup line haven’t you? ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2010, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/43 "2010-04-10T15:57:00Z")
> [@phouka](#): > > Dude, you should hang out with some Orthodox Jews. I taught at an Orthodox school. Never once did I hear reference to someone in their community born out of wedlock, so either it didn’t happen or those who had extra-marital sex were shunned. > > Girls married in their late teens/early twenties, and immediately started having kids. According to the laws of Leviticus, a specific time after her period is over, a woman takes a cleansing bath (mikvah), and that night, her husband is _obligated_ to have sex with her. The timing is very fortuitous for conception. Very large families are standard. My principal had twelve children. All of them redheads, G-d help him. Our own **CMKeller** has posted how his child (ken a hurra) wa conceived immediately after his wife came back from the mikvah. Further, Orthodox Judaism speaks VERY _positively_ of sex. There are whole schools of erotic Hebrew poetry. The Talmud requires a man to have sex with his wife on a basis determined by his profession. My own mother tells how the rabbi gave a talk to the two of them just before performing the wedding ‘When she wants it, how she wants it, whenever she wants it’. I often use this quote from Boychiks In The Hood- Travels In The Hasidic Underground, when asked about sex a rabbi responds “Our business is to give our wives pleasure!” The talmud says that all sex must take place in marriage, and that ejaculation must take place in the vagina. However, it’s clear that if the wife enjoys having her vagina licked for hours on end, then it is the husband’s happy duty to oblige. RE Onan As has been said, Onan’s crime was selfishness and disobedience to G-d. He not only denied the woman an heir, he schemed to get all the pleasure of having sex with her first. Had Onan just said “No, I won’t do it.” IMO he would have lived. Look at all the prophets who disobey and say no when told of their mission. Jonah has to spend three days in a whale before he changes his mind. Onan, OTOH, reveals himself as a scheming, selfish bastard who cares only about himself. ---
**Author:** ![focusonz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9dc877/32.png) [@focusonz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/focusonz)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2010, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/44 "2010-04-10T23:25:46Z")
It would be helpful if you specified what you mean by “like the bible says you’re supposed to”. I will take that to mean that you must be truly remorseful for breaking the 10 commandments of the Jewish and Christian religions. And the evidence for extinction of those peoples can be easily found. Looking at the birth and mortality rates of original Caucasian stock in European countries Zero population growth was achieved 10’s of years ago and has been continuously negative since. Those peoples are most assuredly going extinct today. I would also guess that DINK’s (double income no kids) who are predominately on the far left are also going extinct in America. I believe the evidence for this claim can be found here [List of U.S. states and territories by population - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_population_growth_rate) and here [http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/censr-8.pdf](http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/censr-8.pdf) ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2010, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/45 "2010-04-11T00:10:35Z")
> [@focusonz](#): > > I would also guess that DINK’s (double income no kids) who are predominately on the far left are also going extinct in America. Er, DINKism is not a genetic trait so it can’t “go extinct”. There have always been and always will be childless married couples in the population. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2010, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/46 "2010-04-11T01:00:28Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Er, DINKism is not a genetic trait so it can’t “go extinct”. There have always been and always will be childless married couples in the population. Until somehow, by some unknowable incalcuable combination of nature and nurture, the people who reproduce will have both the genes and the cultural values to both reproduce and pass on those traits (biological and cultural) to their offspring, and those who don’t will have few or no descendents. That’s the thing about selection- it can’t NOT be true. ---
**Author:** ![Enuma\_Elish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5e9695/32.png) [@Enuma\_Elish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enuma_Elish)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2010, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/47 "2010-04-11T03:02:28Z")
Shakes, dude, please read the Bible before commenting on it. You will be incredibly shocked about what is in it and what is not in it. Do you know the words ‘fuck’ or ‘shit’ never appear once in the Bible? Do you know that prostitution was considered a normal state of affairs for much of the Bible? Did you know that Onan’s sin was not masturbation, but was the fact that he wouldn’t have sex with his brother’s wife after his brother died? Dude!!! Read The Book! Then post. Yes, I’m posting after drinking… ---
**Author:** ![focusonz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9dc877/32.png) [@focusonz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/focusonz)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2010, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/48 "2010-04-11T03:15:20Z")
Yep, far left liberal marxists in America are going extinct. It can’t NOT be true. And the conservatives will continue to produce baby conservatives. But in the meantime the pocket book voting independents will awaken from their somnolence and make it right again or remain asleep and allow everything to get screwed up. ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2010, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/49 "2010-04-11T06:30:56Z")
> [@focusonz](#): > > Yep, far left liberal marxists in America are going extinct. It can’t NOT be true. > And the conservatives will continue to produce baby conservatives. > But in the meantime the pocket book voting independents will awaken from their somnolence and make it right again or remain asleep and allow everything to get screwed up. I’m strongly tempted to violate one of the SDMB rules, here, in response to this poster… ---
**Author:** ![focusonz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9dc877/32.png) [@focusonz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/focusonz)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2010, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/50 "2010-04-11T14:24:00Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > I’m strongly tempted to violate one of the SDMB rules, here, in response to this poster… **Go for it.** Experience Freedom first hand and maybe for you for the first time! Escape from the group think of the doper planet! You will gain everything and lose nothing (coming back under a different user name, faceless among the masses that is the doper planet, is accepted practice among the unprincipled. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/51 "2010-04-11T16:47:46Z")
focus, would you respect someone expressing freedom, even if they did so by describing ideas that disagreed with your own? ---
**Author:** ![focusonz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9dc877/32.png) [@focusonz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/focusonz)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/52 "2010-04-12T14:32:32Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > focus, would you respect someone expressing freedom, even if they did so by describing ideas that disagreed with your own? Sure. Further elucidation is not on the point of this thread. I love Canada. I worked in oil refineries in Montreal and Alberta. I also worked in New Zealand and Korea. So new ideas was what it was all about. Thanks for asking, You may start a pit thread or another debate or contact me privately. Your choice. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/53 "2010-04-12T14:46:22Z")
I could be wrong, but as far as I know the Roman Catholic church is the only major Christian denomination that has a problem with birth control; and even that, while the “official” policy, is more or less ignored in most of the world. But yes, if you had to be married to have sex, a lot more people would be getting married, and sooner. The Apostle Paul even said, although he recommended singlehood, that “it is better to marry than to burn (with lust).” The human race would be just fine. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/54 "2010-04-12T21:01:33Z")
> [@focusonz](#): > > Yep, far left liberal marxists in America are going extinct. It can’t NOT be true. > And the conservatives will continue to produce baby conservatives. > But in the meantime the pocket book voting independents will awaken from their somnolence and make it right again or remain asleep and allow everything to get screwed up. Based on this logic, non-reproducing individuals could never have _come_ to exist, because they lack genetic antecedents, and therefore, don’t _currently_ exist. This business with anybody but industriously reproductive conservatives existing is sheerly your imagination, Palin is currently in the white house, and Europe (and Canada, and everywhere but Texas) is a figment of everyone’s collective imagination. Remember, this can’t NOT be true. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434/55 "2010-04-14T12:08:13Z")
So in ten years of posting on this board THIS is the only major post fail that comes to mind. And as luck would have it, this is the one that makes it to two pages! :smack: Um, yep, it’s good to be me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-the-human-race-die-out-if-we-only-did-it-like-the-bible-says-youre-supposed-to/535434.md?page=2)