# Would this form of torture work in real life? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 27, 2011, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252 "2011-08-27T01:35:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/1 "2011-08-27T01:35:13Z")
My husband is watching a movie which is about secretly trafficking drugs in neon colored race cars. Or something like that. I’m not paying that much attention. There is a scene where the bad guy gets information from someone by putting a rat on his belly and then covering the rat with a bucket. As he explains it, the rat will dig through the torturee’s belly to escape. Now, I don’t want to take as gospel the word of a movie that thinks that neon colored race cars are a good way to secretly move drugs, so I’m asking you dopers. Do you think this rat torture would work in real life? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/2 "2011-08-27T01:55:17Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > My husband is watching a movie which is about secretly trafficking drugs in neon colored race cars. Or something like that. I’m not paying that much attention. There is a scene where the bad guy gets information from someone by putting a rat on his belly and then covering the rat with a bucket. As he explains it, the rat will dig through the torturee’s belly to escape. > > Now, I don’t want to take as gospel the word of a movie that thinks that neon colored race cars are a good way to secretly move drugs, so I’m asking you dopers. Do you think this rat torture would work in real life? I think it likely a determined rat could bite and claw through human flesh, and if it were agitated it would do so quickly, and being confined thus would agitate it. But most importantly, I think the idea of being eaten thus by a rat would freak out everybody my side of Leroy Jethro Gibbs in at most twenty-seven seconds. If that. I’m not saying _I’d_ last the full 27 seconds, either. Rhymers are cowards. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/3 "2011-08-27T01:56:38Z")
I have to admit that I do not have adequate personal knowledge to answer. However, I am betting it would work. I would spill my guts if a hungry rat were trapped on my belly. ---
**Author:** ![Marconi\_N.Cheese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Marconi\_N.Cheese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marconi_N.Cheese)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/4 "2011-08-27T02:10:43Z")
When they did this in medieval times I believe the belly cage was heated to encourage the rat to escape. I have no doubt it would work. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/5 "2011-08-27T02:39:13Z")
It’s a rip-off of \*Nineteen Eighty Four \*where Winston Smith was tortured in a similar fashion. It had been established earlier in the novel that he had a deep-rooted phobia against rats. It doesn’t matter whether the threat is realistic, ju8st that this particular individual was ready to believe the threat. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/6 "2011-08-27T02:47:13Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > It’s a rip-off of \*Nineteen Eighty Four \*where Winston Smith was tortured in a similar fashion. > > It had been established earlier in the novel that he had a deep-rooted phobia against rats. It doesn’t matter whether the threat is realistic, ju8st that this particular individual was ready to believe the threat. Nope, not like 1984. In 1984 they let the rats crawl all over Wilson, who was deathly terrified of them. In this movie it was explicit that the rats would chew through his belly. There’s even a shot of his scratched upped bloody belly once the bucket was removed. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/7 "2011-08-27T03:14:03Z")
Here’s the actual text. > **[George Orwell - 1984 - Part 3, Chapter 5](http://www.george-orwell.org/1984/21.html)** > > The complete works of george orwell, searchable format. Also contains a biography and quotes by George Orwell It was a cage around his head, rather than his belly, but more or less the same thing. Anyway, the point is that it worked on Winston Smith because he had a phobia. It possibly might not work on someone that doesn’t have a phobia. ---
**Author:** ![FordTaurusSHO94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f07891/32.png) [@FordTaurusSHO94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordTaurusSHO94)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/8 "2011-08-27T03:19:41Z")
It’s from Fast and Furious 2. I got drug to it. They put the rat on his stomach, put the bucket over it, then heat it up with a torch or something. He finally says whatever he’s supposed to and they lift the bucket. His stomach is scratched and bleeding. It may have been Flass from Batman Begins, if I remember correctly. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/9 "2011-08-27T03:35:40Z")
**Ford** beat me to it. They didn’t just put a rat on his stomach in a bucket, they were _heating_ the bucket to make the rat desperate to escape. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/10 "2011-08-27T04:03:47Z")
* * * > [@FordTaurusSHO94](#): > > I They put the rat on his stomach, put the bucket over it, **then heat it up with a torch or something.**. Gosh…too bad they didn’t have a less complicated method at hand for torturing someone. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/11 "2011-08-27T04:10:38Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Anyway, the point is that it worked on Winston Smith because he had a phobia. It possibly might not work on someone that doesn’t have a phobia. Do you really need a phobia of rats to become terrified at the idea of them gnawing off your face? ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/12 "2011-08-27T04:14:19Z")
Of course not. You’re not going to freak out nearly as bad as Smith did before they even got the mask on his face, let alone got near the point of opening the cage, but any sane person’s going to be freaked by the idea - let alone once the rats start clawing and biting at you. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/13 "2011-08-27T04:15:27Z")
I didn’t have a rat phobia before I read the book. But I did after. Also, after American Psycho…though I don’t remember if Patrick Bateman actually went through with it in that one. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/14 "2011-08-27T04:43:28Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > Do you really need a phobia of rats to become terrified at the idea of them gnawing off your face? The thing is, I don’t know a great deal about rat behaviour. It might be that a zoologist might come to this thread and say, with authority, “oh come on, rats don’t behave like that.” Maybe they do, and maybe they don’t. Thinking about it rationally, I am rather dubious that a rat would be able to think of such concepts as gnawing a tunnel through a person to escape a trap. But, whether realistic or not, Winston was ready to believe the threat. That’s what made it an effective torture. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/15 "2011-08-27T04:47:32Z")
So where the hell are all the rat behaviorists? ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/16 "2011-08-27T05:06:22Z")
Why wouldn’t they? ‘Gnaw through nearest surface that’s soft enough to do so’ is the typical rodent method for getting past a barrier, and rats are omnivorous, so going through flesh wouldn’t bother them. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/17 "2011-08-27T05:46:30Z")
Nicodemus would never do that to me!:eek: ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/18 "2011-08-27T05:57:57Z")
This method of torture,including heating the metal bowl or bucket, is also described in detail in the film Graveyard Shift. Personally, I don’t think it would work that well. Is a rat smart enough to figure out ‘the metal above me is hot. I shall burrow down to escape’? I can easily see the rat just panicking and doing nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/19 "2011-08-27T06:07:22Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > It had been established earlier in the novel that he had a deep-rooted phobia against rats. It doesn’t matter whether the threat is realistic, ju8st that this particular individual was ready to believe the threat. This. A form of torture doesn’t need to “work” the way the OP seems to be using the word - it just needs to be convincing enough that the victim decides they’re better off talking. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2011, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252/20 "2011-08-27T07:00:06Z")
Of course, it would have been much more effective for the bad guy just to threaten to make the guy watch 2 Fast 2 Furious. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-this-form-of-torture-work-in-real-life/594252.md?page=2)