# Would you eat vat-grown meat? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 30, 2011, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397 "2011-06-30T15:42:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/41 "2011-07-03T02:07:40Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > People, please. **Do not fight the hypothetical**. We are in pretend land now, and in pretend land scienticians can create meat without using or harming animals and it tastes exactly the same as farmed and slaughtered meat. Understood? But that’s NOT the hypothetical. The hypothetical is that > [@](#): > > In double-blind tests no difference can be detected between it and regular slaughtered meat and that’s a different thing. In double-blind tests, few can distinguish between Coke and Pepsi, either, but the world is full of people who prefer one to the other, or at least strongly believe they do. The OP does NOT say that I will find them indistinguishable. If the OP had said that, I would have answered differently. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/42 "2011-07-03T04:27:02Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > But that’s NOT the hypothetical. The hypothetical is that > > and that’s a different thing. In double-blind tests, few can distinguish between Coke and Pepsi, either, but the world is full of people who prefer one to the other, or at least strongly believe they do. > > The OP does NOT say that I will find them indistinguishable. If the OP had said that, I would have answered differently. Oh god… :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/43 "2011-07-03T04:38:34Z")
I don’t know–I’ve always thought there was something absolutely yummy about knowing your food met a violent end. But at the end of the day, so long as I don’t have to go vegetarian, sure. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/44 "2011-07-03T05:22:31Z")
For all of you that would prefer vat grown meat, did you see the episode of Better off Ted where they grew meat in the lab? “It tastes depressed.” And it costs $10,000 a lb to grow ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/45 "2011-07-03T10:54:38Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Now if it were more expensive, or not quite as good - fine, then you can decide if it’s worth it. But the hypothetical is basically asking you “so, would you like to see less animals harmed and slaughtered at no cost to you?” and your reply is _shrug_ I don’t see using animals for food as _inherently_ harmful. Sure, they die, but ALL animals die and a quick death from a gun or captive bolt is a _hell_ of a lot less suffering than what nature often provides. Yes, there are terrible abuses out there. That doesn’t mean it always happens. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/46 "2011-07-03T10:57:16Z")
> [@Rick](#): > > For all of you that would prefer vat grown meat, did you see the episode of Better off Ted where they grew meat in the lab? > “It tastes depressed.” Hell, I thought the point of vat meat was that it was pre-lobotomized! It _should_ taste like “drooling contentment”! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![brittekland](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@brittekland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brittekland)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/47 "2011-07-03T13:53:54Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I don’t see using animals for food as _inherently_ harmful. Sure, they die, but ALL animals die and a quick death from a gun or captive bolt is a _hell_ of a lot less suffering than what nature often provides. > > Yes, there are terrible abuses out there. That doesn’t mean it always happens. Animals just don’t how good they have; It’s utterly ridiculous that we have to keep them tied and fenced in so dumb animals don’t run away from the good life and humane death we provide. ---
**Author:** ![Renee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/renee/32/287_2.png) [@Renee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renee)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/48 "2011-07-03T14:14:56Z")
My concern is that it’s more fake food. Since switching to a diet without processed, fake food in it, I’m doing much better. We buy all our meat from the butcher down the road, and the animals are raised on pasture and treated and killed humanely, and I don’t have ethical issues with eating them. If this meat was truly exactly the same as grass-fed animals, yes, I’d be all over it. But if it’s “I can’t believe it’s not beef!” then no, thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/49 "2011-07-03T15:03:17Z")
> [@brittekland](#): > > Animals just don’t how good they have; It’s utterly ridiculous that we have to keep them tied and fenced in so dumb animals don’t run away from the good life and humane death we provide. I don’t know which I find more amusing - that your reply is clearly missing a few words, which makes me think you were quite worked up when you wrote it, or that you think it will change my mind. Nice distortion of my statement. I very clearly stated that there are abuses, but they were not _inherent_ in eating meat. Certainly, the wild game I have eaten were never tied nor fenced in. And don’t insult cows, pigs, and chickens by calling them “dumb”. They’re more intelligent than people give them credit for. On top of that - as noted, a gunshot that kills in a minute or less is far more humane than what, say, a pack of wolves do to a deer, or an eagle eating a salmon before the fish is dead, tearing at it while thrashes and gulps in the air. What’s wild and natural can also be pretty horrific and filled with suffering. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/50 "2011-07-03T15:39:09Z")
> [@brittekland](#): > > Animals just don’t how good they have; It’s utterly ridiculous that we have to keep them tied and fenced in so dumb animals don’t run away from the good life and humane death we provide. Snark much? When _my_ critters stray it is because they are interested in grazing somewhere else. In nature animals have a many acre range, not the restricted amounts that we allow them to have. It is natural instinct that takes my guinea fowl across the street to eat the neighbors ticks and yard bugs … or my geese to the other neighbors pond for a swim. I will also note that in the evening they come back on their own. The chickens and ducks tend to stay in the field, they have a smaller natural range apparently. And they tend to come home at night and voluntarily go into their coop. I will shamefully admit that my sheep did eat one neighbors garden … fresh sweet corn and garden peas are like crack to sheep :smack: ---
**Author:** ![brittekland](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@brittekland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brittekland)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/51 "2011-07-03T16:12:08Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I don’t know which I find more amusing - that your reply is clearly missing a few words, which makes me think you were quite worked up when you wrote it, or that you think it will change my mind. OMG, I’m so embarrassed… darn that 5 min editing time limit. :eek: 😉 > [@](#): > > Sure, they die, but ALL animals die and a quick death from a gun or **captive bolt** is a hell of a lot less suffering than what nature often provides > [@](#): > > Nice distortion of my statement. I very clearly stated that there are abuses, but they were not _inherent_ in eating meat. Certainly, **the wild game I have eaten werenever tied nor fenced in**. You kill **wild animal** with **captive bolt** and **without being tied or fenced in**? Aren’t we talking more about captive animal/livestock/animal husbandry? What percentage of **meat** we consume comes from the wild? > [@](#): > > On top of that - as noted, a gunshot that kills in a minute or less is far more humane than what, say, a pack of wolves do to a deer, or an eagle eating a salmon before the fish is dead, tearing at it while thrashes and gulps in the air. What’s wild and natural can also be pretty horrific and filled with suffering. You would give up your **freedom** for being imprisoned and head-locked into your feed bucket until you are killed “_humanely_” for food at the time of your owner’s choosing? > [@](#): > > And don’t insult cows, pigs, and chickens by calling them “dumb”. They’re more intelligent than people give them credit for. Eh? So “dumb” wasn’t sarcasm but everything else I said were? Never mind… ---
**Author:** ![brittekland](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@brittekland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brittekland)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/52 "2011-07-03T16:24:16Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > Snark much? When _my_ critters stray it is because they are interested in grazing somewhere else. In nature animals have a many acre range, not the restricted amounts that we allow them to have. It is natural instinct that takes my guinea fowl across the street to eat the neighbors ticks and yard bugs … or my geese to the other neighbors pond for a swim. I will also note that in the evening they come back on their own. The chickens and ducks tend to stay in the field, they have a smaller natural range apparently. And they tend to come home at night and voluntarily go into their coop. I will shamefully admit that my sheep did eat one neighbors garden … fresh sweet corn and garden peas are like crack to sheep :smack: Fair enough. I apologize for my sarcasm. Everything can be rationalized. Isn’t animal husbandry from birth something of brainwashing? Many escaped North Koreans choose to go back to North Korea. I don’t think animals that have tasted the freedom in the wild would choose to be captive. I don’t see wild animals lining up to be captive/live stocks. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2011, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/53 "2011-07-03T18:14:50Z")
> [@brittekland](#): > > OMG, I’m so embarrassed… darn that 5 min editing time limit. :eek: 😉 Preview is your friend. Spellcheck is your friend. Grammarcheck (where available) is your friend… > [@](#): > > You kill **wild animal** with **captive bolt** and **without being tied or fenced in**? Aren’t we talking more about captive animal/livestock/animal husbandry? What percentage of **meat** we consume comes from the wild? Oh, please - I was trying to encompass BOTH food hunting and animal husbandry. They don’t kill cattle at the slaughterhouse with a bullet anymore, anymore than you use captive bolts during deer season. As for percentage of domestic vs. wild - that varies. There have been times in my life when 80-90% of animal products I consume come from wild sources. Other times, none. I’ve also killed and butchered my own dinner, so I’m not under the illusion that it’s _totally_ painless, but it’s as quick and merciful as I can make it. I’m an omnivore, I don’t have a problem with that. Why do you? > [@](#): > > You would give up your **freedom** for being imprisoned and head-locked into your feed bucket until you are killed “_humanely_” for food at the time of your owner’s choosing? :lol: What the hell kind of question is that? Do FREE wild animals choose to be killed and eaten? Hell no! Quite a few of them will fight for survival. Your line about “head-locked” into a feed bucket is yet another example of how you take the very worst instance of abuse and extend it everywhere. If you don’t like that, then purchase free-range meat or hunt your own. Of course, free-range costs more, but hey, it’s your money and if it’s really an important issue to you, you’ll pay for it. Or you’ll make the effort to hunt. Or you’ll go vegetarian to one degree or another. The difference between you and me, though, is I don’t get my panties in a bunch over whether or not other people make different choices. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2011, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/54 "2011-07-04T02:31:47Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Oh god… :rolleyes: Hey, at least I can read… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2011, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/55 "2011-07-04T02:35:32Z")
Moving thread from IMHO to Cafe Society. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2011, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/56 "2011-07-04T04:12:15Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > \But the hypothetical is basically asking you “so, would you like to see less animals harmed and slaughtered at no cost to you?” and your reply is _shrug_ Actually, my reply would be, “Fewer.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2011, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/57 "2011-07-04T04:57:50Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I don’t quite understand the thoughts behind people picking the no preference answer. I can sort of see the “I wouldn’t eat it” because people might get squicked out by it, but if we’re assuming a perfect world and it tastes just as good and costs just the same - why in the world wouldn’t you prefer one that didn’t result from an animal being raised in captivity and slaughter? All it takes from you is expressing a mere preference, but it’s not worth it to create animal-free meat? Not a hard one, for me, because the hypothetical isn’t _very_ far from reality. There is a wonderful, magical shop in Vancouver - the sort of shop that Rod Serling imagined in which the impossible takes place behind the most unassuming storefront you might imagine. That place is [West Best Vegetarian Market](http://www.canpages.ca/page/BC/vancouver/west-best-vegetarian-market-ltd/4170753.html), and it’s a little chinese outfit that supplies Vancouver’s best Buddhist restaurants (and to a lesser degree asian supermarkets) with meat. Glorious, toothsome, delicious animal-free meat. Now I understand you may look upon this claim with some skepticism, especially if you’ve had some addled hippie claim that Yves Veggie Ground Round is just as good as beef, or that Tofurkey is something that you might reasonably be expected to choke down without sinking into a deep depression - but the stuff they produce is amazing. (They are open to the public, but it’s hit-and-miss if you can find English descriptions on all the products.) Anyway, in particular, they sell “vegetarian chicken,” which is pretty much like little frozen slices of chicken breast. If you’re going to make a meal that would ordinarily contain chunks or slices of chicken breast, this stuff is perfect. The most incredible product, because you can (as I often needed to) prepare a meal that both vegetarians and omnivores will tuck into with equal relish. I _love_ that stuff. It’s the best. But in spite of its existence, I still use chicken. I would probably use less chicken if I could pick the vegetarian chicken up at Superstore and not have to go across town for it, but even if The World’s Best Chicken-less Chicken was completely ubiquitous, I’m still going to be eating chicken, because there’s more to meat than muscle and and even a product that imitates muscle perfectly isn’t going to replace chicken. You know what makes a good chicken soup or stew? Bones and connective tissue. If your chicken soup doesn’t start with bones and connective tissue, your chicken soup sucks. While I would be happy to use vat-grown meat for dishes that just need little chunks of muscle in them, I like to cook and I like to eat and and can’t really imagine being satisfied giving up all the various cuts of meat.\* I’m happy to reduce the overall amount of meat in the diet (compared with the cliche North American “every meal is built around a substantial portion of flesh” approach, but I doubt that it would ever totally replace meat for me. \*And I say that as someone who _did_ - for ten years. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2011, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/58 "2011-07-04T06:13:16Z")
> [@Larry\_Mudd](#): > > You know what makes a good chicken soup or stew? Bones and connective tissue. If your chicken soup doesn’t start with bones and connective tissue, your chicken soup sucks. While I would be happy to use vat-grown meat for dishes that just need little chunks of muscle in them, I like to cook and I like to eat and and can’t really imagine being satisfied giving up all the various cuts of meat. So, for the record, if the clone-vat chicken is the same as regular chicken, but say missing the nervous system (including the brain), that’d be perfect?\* Deluxe Product Line idea! 😃 \*I’m assuming we can edit out the feathers, too…what about the guts? Is it OK if it doesn’t have guts, or would you have a use for those? And if so, would your kitchen needs be better served by a _modified_ organ selection in each Chicklone™? An extra gizzard, for example? We here at General Clone™ (not affiliated with members of the Clone Army, Clone Troopers, or Foreign Clone Legion) are always aiming to improve our products in accord with our customers’ needs! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2011, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/59 "2011-07-04T10:50:14Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > \*I’m assuming we can edit out the feathers, too…what about the guts? Is it OK if it doesn’t have guts, or would you have a use for those? Well… I do eat chicken livers. And I usually use the hearts, lungs, and gizzards along with connective tissue and bones for soup stock… ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2011, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397/60 "2011-07-04T17:45:23Z")
I’d be willing to try it, even the vat-grown long pork. That could open up a whole industry even if more conventional vat-meats (veats?) aren’t as economical as naturely raised ones. Hell you might even see celebrities (or the heirs of dead celebrities) licence their DNA and collect royalities from the sale of their cloned flesh. Or even an establishment specializing in cloning customer’s flesh so that they could eat themselves. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/would-you-eat-vat-grown-meat/587397.md?page=4)